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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think that one's husband shouldn't tell you how to vote?

27 replies

RubyGates · 31/05/2016 15:49

Just that really. My SIL was told in no uncertain terms how she should vote in the EU referendum by her husband. She was born in Britain but has non-British parents and has spent most of her adult life outside the UK, (She has since returned, married and had a daughter) and so is a bit unsure about the various issues .
Her husband's degree (taken long ago) is in a related subject so perhaps he sees himself as a bit of an expert in this sort of thing.

It wasn't a discussion about their views, or one where he directed her to various resources so that she could see why he was voting the way he was, it was an order that she should vote the way he was going to.

AIBU to think that this isn't the 19th century?

OP posts:

Whisky2014 · 31/05/2016 15:51

YANBU

SecretlyChartreuse · 31/05/2016 15:52

This is why we have a secret ballot so that patriarchs and especially bosses could not influence your vote.

lavenderdoilly · 31/05/2016 15:53

She should, of course, vote how she likes. Or should spoil her ballot paper. Or pretend to vote iyswim. If he goes with her to the voting booth and tells her what to do, there's a fighting chance the ballot overseer folk might intervene (perhaps I am being naive ). But you know the answer to your post already, op, so I wonder why you even ask.

newmumwithquestions · 31/05/2016 15:53

If it was the 19th century she wouldn't have had a vote.

LurkingHusband · 31/05/2016 15:53

This is why we have a secret ballot so that patriarchs and especially bosses could not influence your vote.

And then pissed it all away by giving away postal votes to all and sundry .

TheHiphopopotamus · 31/05/2016 15:56

And then pissed it all away by giving away postal votes to all and sundry

Exactly. When we moved into our old house a few years ago, we received the previous owner/tenants postal vote. I could have voted and sent it off and no one would've known (or even cared) what I'd done.

Radiatorvalves · 31/05/2016 16:04

My DH votes one way, and I vote another. I have told him he shouldn't vote for his choice of party. He ignores me...

Q - am I as bad as the DH in the OP?
Q2, - does your answer change if I tell you DH is a Tory?

BTW we both agree on the Referendum. IN all the way. Even MIL (blue rosette on a donkey type) is IN.

lavenderdoilly · 31/05/2016 16:09

Was she born a British citizen? Or is she recently naturalised. Have friends who have just gained British citizenship and understanding this stuff is part of the test. As is a load of stuff that I even I didn't know and I'm a smartarse.

VestalVirgin · 31/05/2016 16:14

I tend to ask people in my family for advice on how to vote when it gets complicated (like, there is a party I would like to vote for, but they have no chance of winning the election, so what party can I vote for to get my preferred outcome?), but that's more advice on how the voting system works. I make my political decisions myself.

If he is an expert on the matter, I would expect him to explain in simple terms how the economical outcome would be for Britain ... to my knowledge, it is not exactly a rosy prospect with Brexit. (Not British, so I don't care that much).

Just telling her what to vote ... not okay. From how you described it was not an unfortunately worded offhand comment but really him telling her how to vote.

Original poster

RubyGates · 31/05/2016 16:22

I'm rather hoping she reads this. I was shocked at her response to him as she's usually so self-assured about everything. It wasn't the kind of amusing interplay that married couples have when they disagree about something like this, it was definitely him telling her how to vote.

Radiator, Beloved Spouse and I vote very differently, we have "interesting banter" on the subject. She's the Tory voter (or at least has been in the past).

Lavender, she has dual nationality.

OP posts:

LurkingHusband · 31/05/2016 16:32

It wasn't so much that, as the fact that as soon as the rules were relaxed (you used to have to have a very good reason for a postal vote) then certain close-knit communities started getting everyone to register for postal votes. When the ballot papers arrived, they were dutifully delivered to the community leaders who "helpfully" completed and returned them.

www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/birmingham-vote-fraud-still-happening-7229359

There were cases of women (of course ) being forced (you can sadly imagine the force used too) to register for a postal vote, so the community leaders could sell their vote "help" them understand how to vote.

The irony is, the opening up of postal votes was supposed to be an initiative to counter voter apathy. All it's done is make me less confident in my vote. Doubles all round !!!!

TheHiphopopotamus · 31/05/2016 16:38

Yes, you're totally right Lurking I agree with everything you've said. My post was more to illustrate how easily the system can be (and is) abused.

I can't believe it hasn't been stopped yet. The only reason I can think of why it hasn't, is because that kind of thing suits our political overlords.

GoblinLittleOwl · 31/05/2016 16:48

That whirring sound is of a lot of suffragettes rotating in their graves.

I hope your sister in law values her right to democracy sufficiently to make up her own mind, and if she doesn't know enough about the issues, FIND OUT.

Or isn't she allowed to use the internet without supervision?

Bolograph · 31/05/2016 16:53

then certain close-knit communities started getting everyone to register for postal votes

Rates of postal voting in certain inner city constituencies are around 50%. You don't have to be a demographic genius to figure out which sort of inner city constituencies.

araiba · 31/05/2016 16:54

this whole vote is stupid

lots of people who have no idea about the details voting on a decision that could massively alter our country

Bolograph · 31/05/2016 16:55

The need for a secret ballot is why the Cabinet Office are not doing any work on online voting, and people who campaign for it are usually either (a) ignorant of the Biradari problem or (b) rather too knowledgeable about the Biradari problem.

Lunar1 · 31/05/2016 17:10

I've always had a postal vote as if I was working on the day I wouldn't be able to vote due to a long day. It never occurred to me that it would've used in that way!

LurkingHusband · 31/05/2016 17:14

I've always had a postal vote as if I was working on the day I wouldn't be able to vote due to a long day. It never occurred to me that it would've used in that way!

That's what proxies are for (although you can't guarantee they will vote as you intend).

On the plus side, democracy in the UK has evolved over many centuries to be able to ignore the will of the people whilst appearing to serve it. I suspect a lot of corruptly elected officials (I use the plural quite deliberately) will be quite surprised at what little power they really have.

TheNaze73 · 31/05/2016 17:16

YANBU, with all due respect, she's an idiot for a) doing it & b) telling you

Bolograph · 31/05/2016 17:17

It never occurred to me that it would've used in that way!

Indeed. A good example of a good initiative having bad outcomes, because bad people are always more ingenious than good ones.

The votes of young people and women in certain communities are entirely controlled by "community leaders". Labour, who are the main beneficiaries of this, are not willing to do anything about it. The recent changes to postal votes haven't altered matters, because they are about identity fraud rather than coercion. We need to return to there having to be a justification for a postal vote, rather than on demand: I've just had to get a proxy for the 23rd, and I had to get my boss to sign off the business need, and I can't see any reason why the same shouldn't (as it used to) apply to postal votes. Other than ill-health or employment requirements, there's no good reason why people living 100 yards from a polling station can't go an vote in person, but lots of very bad reasons why they might be encouraged not to.

lavenderdoilly · 31/05/2016 17:18

My house bound mum has a postal vote. They are crucial. I wouldn't trust online voting. But then I'm with Australia on this I think it should be illegal not to vote even if you write "they are all a bunch of wankers" on your ballot paper.

LurkingHusband · 31/05/2016 17:24

My house bound mum has a postal vote. They are crucial.

No one is suggesting removing them. Just returning to the pre-200x ??? situation where you had to demonstrate a need, rather than being handed one on demand.

DontDead0penlnside · 31/05/2016 17:27

I think I'd be tempted to counsel her to vote the opposite of whatever he is going to do/telling her to do.

If she can't freely have her say, then at the very least she can cancel out his!

lavenderdoilly · 31/05/2016 17:28

Fine by me. Getting a doctor's note (for free) is perfectly reasonable. Happy to hear why it isn't btw.

Bolograph · 31/05/2016 17:35

Happy to hear why it isn't btw.

Postal votes were part of Blair's deal with the devil to get votes from deeply conservative "community leaders" programme to increase participation. Suddenly a lot of people who had historically not voted (turnout in Biradari wards was very low) discovered an interest in politics catalysed by their husbands' access to postal votes.

There is much I disagree with Salma Yaqoob about, but on this topic she is bang on the money:

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2007/may/02/thesecrettosuccess

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