to think SIL manipulated us?

[Lilylo]

Long post, sorry but I am fuming.

SIL has a history for being manipulative, schemy and selfish and I guess what happened today was the final straw that made me snap.

Three days ago SIL calls DH and I to ask us if we wanted to have dinner with her and a childhood friend of hers (that DH hadn't met in 15 years) on Sat morning (today).

We said ok no probs, we'll come. Yesterday she texts us to check if we are ok with two other couples that are friends of the childhood friend joining the lunch.

We say: actually we do not quite feel like socializing with new people. (DH is going through a stressful period and just prefers to keep it quite during the weekend). Why don't you guys have lunch with these other people and we reschedule our lunch (SIL, childhood friend, DH and I) for another time?

SIL starts pushing and getting aggressive. She ignores the fact that we keep saying we don't quite feel like coming. She says she can't reschedule cause she is busy ANY other time, she says she has been organizing this lunch for months to make DH and this childhood friend meet after a long time, she says this friend is going to leave the country for 3 months and that we must see him today. Her actual words after we repeated several times "let's reschedule" were: let's just stick with tomorrow and deal with it.

We politely told her we'd rather not go 4 times. After that, she says that actually the other two couples cancelled so now it is back to us 4! No reason not to come then!

I asked her: ARE YOU SURE IT IS GOING TO BE JUST THE 4 OF US? She says yes.

We reluctantly agree to come. Today we show up and we find 8 people at the table and SIL looks at me and says: surprise!!!

I could have killed her with my bare hands.

For the whole lunch DH and I try to hide our frustration and be polite for the sake of these other people, but I actually went to the bathroom and cried a little out of frustration.

After we left, SIL calls DH and accuses us of having ruined the lunch cause apparently it was clear we did not want to be there and if we did not want to come we could have just let her know. She says she felt embarassed by our attitude. AAARRRRGGGGHHHH.

And by the way, it turns out that the childhood friend is not leaving the country for 3 months, he is going to Bristol for 5 days -.-'

AIBU to feel manipulated and tricked? AIBU to feel like I don't want to be bulldozed over if I say I don't want to join something?

I don't think you were manipulated at first. You could have said no and left it at that. The fact that you believed these other people suddenly "pulled out" when you objected to their presence is a bit...I don't know, naive, maybe? Knowing your SIL's history it's a bit obvious she was talking bollocks.

I don't agree. I know manipulative people but they are much cleverer than that. I wouldn't expect a adult to behave so stupidly even if they were manipulative. There is no point in getting people to turn up to a social occasion if they are going to be angry and therefore unsociable when they get there. This kind of blatant and obvious lying is something even my children wouldn't have tried after the age of about 4 as anyone with half a brain could see that it would all go horribly wrong.

TwoWrongs, if you are a person who finds certain social situations tricky, who finds that being pushed beyond your personal limits means that you get very stressed, then it's even more important for those individuals that they can set personal boundaries.
That they know they have the right and the power to say 'Enough, stop now' or 'No' and that they have the ability to withdraw when that instruction is ignored. Neither OP or her husband have to socialise with someone who manipulates their anxieties like the SIL does.
It's not healthy for them to continuously try and please her.

Next time let your dh handle her.
If he's not in tell her you will get him to ring her.

A little update: SIL has been messaging both me and DH trying to pick up fights. She thanked us for making her cry

I'd be tempted to text back "Any time".

If she hadn't lied, then she wouldn't be crying now.

"I know manipulative people but they are much cleverer than that. I wouldn't expect a adult to behave so stupidly even if they were manipulative. There is no point in getting people to turn up to a social occasion if they are going to be angry and therefore unsociable when they get there. This kind of blatant and obvious lying is something even my children wouldn't have tried after the age of about 4 as anyone with half a brain could see that it would all go horribly wrong."

Yes to this. I did think it was a little weird that these people disappeared all of a sudden but honestly I assumed it couldn't be a lie because it would have been impossible to hide. I must have overestimated SIL's intelligence.

And then she's had the nerve to tell to my face that these people decided to come last minute and she did not know until she showed up.

Sure

YANBU. I am wondering if the people who are saying it's no biggie and get a grip perhaps don't have so much life experience?

Sure, it shouldn't be a big deal in the grand scheme of things maybe - and as a one off, rather than the straw that broke the camel's back, perhaps it wouldn't have been -but the OP was very clear that it's a stressful time for them right now.

Definitely I've had times in my life when it's harder to cope. And certainly times when I haven't been "up" to New People. And also when you're down and vulnerable, it's easier to cave under pressure, as you have to pick your battles.

SIL is clearly a twat. Disengage. Don't feed her/play her game.

And hope things get less stressful for you soon

I feel like you got a bit of a hard time here OP. I'd be seriously fucked off with anyone who did this. But, being me, I'd also tell her straight that she's a manipulative cow. I think the best advice you've got on this thread is redexpat's.

ugh, just saw the update about the texts. what a PITA.

No, it's no use saying 'but that shouldn't have happened, that's stupid' because it did happen and the point of it for her was to get you there and crow about it. She wasn't going to try and pretend they weren't really there, it was all about proving a point and getting her own way. Which she did didn't she so it all went to plan and now she's using it as an opportunity to cause enough fuss to get you back in line.
Why assume she's going to be abashed about being caught out? She won't be, if anything she'll think she's won the day.

By all means carry on expecting a manipulative liar to behave and act within an honest framework. By all means assume your relationship is anything more to her than her little lego pieces. But you don't then get to go wilty and all 'if my uncle had a fanny he'd be my aunt' about it because the situation is exactly what it is and if you keep thinking it won't be, it's only you who will suffer for it. Your choice, wise up, harden up or just do what she wants and stop being surprised and upset. You have the power and ability to change your responses only, you won't change her, so do what you need and see if she'll fall in line. People like this need a constant firm hand if they're to play any part in your life and if you can't do that then your options are not see her or suck it up, there's no third option of 'make SIL an honest person who isn't self obsessed'.
I'm surprised anyone who knows manipulative people is surprised that they manipulate to their own agenda and that liars lie - liars are not existing in the same reality as the truth so what you think facts will mean to them is beyond me. Liars will lie regardless of the likelihood of being caught out...That's how we know they're liars usually. Stop trying to make this behaviour fit a completely different paradigm, unless you're immortal and have plenty of time to waste. There's 2 of you now calling her stupid but who got what they wanted? I'd think on that before anything else personally.
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result and all that.

OMG We had to have lunch with EXTRA PEOPLE! End of the world and civilisation as we know it.

Luna, if you RTFT the issue is not the extra people but the SIL's blatant lies and manipulation.

Fuck, people are odd. (Yep, RTFT).

She lies, call her up on it. Not being able to cope with a few extras and playing the martyr is weird.

It's not about not being unable to cope with the extra people

I read this issue as being completely frustrated at having your stated needs ignored and subjugated to the needs of another person without your permission

Did you not say anything to the other people along the lines of 'oh nice to meet you, I didn't think you'd be joining us as SIL said everyone had cancelled?' Or to the friend 'Oh you're only going to Bristol for 5 days, oh SIL said you were going abroad for 3 months, don't know how she got that so mixed up?!' If I smelled a rat I'd be tempted to try and make it clear to SIL that I knew she lying and use the other people to pick her story apart.

She lies, call her up on it. Not being able to cope with a few extras and playing the martyr is weird

Yes I read the full thing and agree with this. The whole crying in the toilet thing when the OP knew that SIL was odd and told lies is very weird. If you know someone plays games like this or tells lies, why would you take anything they tell you as gospel truth?

There seems to be a spate of people crying in the toilet over this sort of thing, maybe Mumsnet needs a collective chill out time?

"Oh bullshit. For a start, a lot of us work weekends. And even when we don't, we spend them taking children to parties and football matches and attending family events we often don't particularly want to. Don't be so precious.

OP didn't want to have lunch with any of them, including the SIL. But she went anyway. So if her weekend was so precious, more fool her for going to lunch with someone she loathes."

No point in being pedantic. Replace the word "weekend" with "time off" if it's too difficult for you to make the leap.

From my understanding, the OP was happy to go for lunch with the SIL. Not with the other people. She didn't "loathe" this woman until this incident.

And yes, we all have to do things we don't want to on weekends, but we generally get to do them knowing what they will be, rather than labouring under false pretences, which is what happened here.

OP, I can see that the 'surprise' guests (which the SIL has claimed turned up unannounced, not that she lied) were irritating but it does look as though this could have been entirely predicted from the fact that they were coming in the first place! So it does leave me wondering why you accepted the invitation. It takes both sides to make a drama. If you really don't want a drama, then don't engage with her.

I'm very sociable and wouldn't have minded a lunch with lots of people, but I too would have been furious in your position with this. It's the being lied to and taken for an idiot that would have done it for me.

But in a way, she's shot herself in the foot, because next time she tries to pull a stunt like this, you'll know to give her a very wide berth.

I would very much treat this as a learning experience, OP, and make it the last time you give your SIL the benefit of the doubt. There comes a turning point in all unsatisfactory relationships where the realisation finally sets in that the other person is never going to change and that you have to act decisively to protect yourself. This is that point - as others have said, never again become drawn in to anything you are even mildly suspicious about or do not want to go to. This includes seeing her in any capacity, for the foreseeable future, if you don't want to.

Treat this incident as something positive - the trigger for taking control, long term.

"It's the being lied to and taken for an idiot that would have done it for me."

Exactly clam. This is what made me cry in the bathroom.

And by the way, SIL had a history for being manipulate and schemy but this was the first time she openly lied to us (or at least the first time we realized it).

bettercallsaul very well said. I think this was a turning point for both DH and I.

DH said: when I got to the restaurant and I saw those people my heart broke because I realized my sister lied to my face.

DH is not a dramatic person. He really is heartbroken because he finally must accept his DSis is an awful person who would walk over her own DB to get what she wants.

Poor DH

Next time.

Say yes to all her ...

Do not turn up.

Make no apologies.

Leave it at that.

The other thing that stinks about all this is that she's trying to turn the whole thing around on you and blame you for "making her cry." Why would she be crying? She got what she wanted.

THAT is the manipulative shit (the initial crime was 'just' lying). Do not engage. Withdraw and stop the nonsense now, or at least your collusion in it. Clearly, people have been enabling her to behave like this all her life, otherwise she wouldn't still be doing it. Now that you've seen her in action so clearly, you've had a sharp wake-up call to change it all for the future. That's not to say she won't still be trying, but you won't be falling for it.

Update: today the nasty cow is telling DH I changed him for the worse and he is not the same person anymore!!

Just because he used to take all her crap without saying anything and now he finally grew some backbone!