Embarrassed and upset. Was I wrong?

[fatandembarrassed]

Nc for this

I recently had to take an 11 hour flight. I'm quite pregnant at the moment - not close to my due date, but it's very obvious and I am pretty big now. I was cleared to fly but warned that I must walk about as much as possible.

I didn't have much notice of this flight and so didn't have spare money, so I booked an economy seat next to the toilet, for obvious reasons, and with extra legroom. It was fine, but about 4 hours into the flight, I realised my ankles were swelling, so I got up and started to walk about a bit.

I felt a bit embarrassed, but I was in a fair bit of pain with my ankles and Braxton Hicks contractions, so I persevered very slowly and in complete silence, making my way along the aisles which wasn't easy in Economy as it was very tight. I then walked up and down the Business Class aisle. Nobody looked up or seemed disturbed by me, and it was easier to walk, so I walked up and down that section twice which took me about five minutes.

Next thing I knew, a male flight attendant marched up to me, put his hand on my arm and told me that I was disturbing passengers who had paid more than me, and that I might be pregnant but it was 'not an excuse' to 'make a disturbance'. I was quite shocked to be told I was disturbing anyone - I was very quiet and slow, and there for less than 5 min.

I was really upset to have him talk to me like that, both touching me and implying that I was just being a 'nuisance' to people who were clearly 'better' than me. I ended up crying because I was so humiliated (hate having to walk anyway and draw attention to myself), in horrible pain and having contractions.

Was I being unreasonable here? DH is very upset that I was treated like this and I really didn't think I was doing anything terribly wrong.

I'm wondering what 'quite pregnant, but not near my due date' is. It's unusual not to say how many weeks you are. After week 28 of pregnancy most airlines require a letter from your GP i believe. Did you wear compression stockings OP?

I've noticed a few post alluding to 'heavily pregnant', and speculating she might have given birth, and the fact that she was manhandled. I think think this is over egging the pudding a bit now.

''a male flight attendant marched up to me, put his hand on my arm and told me that I was disturbing passengers who had paid more than me''

Now it's ''putting his hands on me'' and alluding to physical abuse and rape apologists God help us.

Are you going to complain about the flight attendant OP?

Is that actually what he said or how you interpreted it?

YABU business class is for the business class passengers, economy stay in economy

I also agree with those who said they wouldn't give their seat up for a pregnant person - I have been lucky enough to travel up the front, and it costs a lot of money, so no way would I be giving up my seat to another passenger

Why not book another class if economy was going to be a struggle?

No, it won't be an empty plane, obviously can't specify where, but it's peak travel to a hugely popular destination. School holidays.

"I can't see how this rule is unreasonable. "

It becomes unreasonable when a pregnant woman in discomfort is treated like that to protect the peace of people with more money.

It makes me question - is the money system we live in just and reasonable? Could things be different / fairer / better?

It makes me think isn't it fucking depressing that a bunch of (mostly) mums are jumping to the defense of a bunch of rich, probably mostly male* travelers, and defending their right to not maybe-be-disturbed-ever-so-slightly over helping with the very real discomfort and possibly risky medical condition of a pregnant woman and unborn baby in the same place. Any why? Because money.

It's bullshit. And yes, it is narrowminded when you get lots of people jumping on to defend the system, without stopping to think - why is the system like this? Why is a pregnant woman being treated like this? Is it right? Is a system that treats her like this a just one?

As mums we at least can understand her discomfort and we should be sticking up for her IMO.

*(statistically speaking, the people in businesses class are more likely to be men as men have more money and power than women overall, and are more likely to have a senior job that puts them on business class flights.

Also if we live in a system that tends to reward men for staying at work and penalises women (and to a lesser extent, men) for having children then is is always going to be more likely to be the pregnant woman who is asked to leave to keep peace for the rich man, rather than the other way round.

Are we happy with this? I'm not.

I think the FA massively, and very rudely, overreacted. A simple "I'm afraid you can't be in this part of the plane" would have sufficed. Job done, nobody has any need to be angered or upset. And I have no doubt that had I been spoken to like that I too would have been angry and upset.

As others have said yabu wandering around in BC though OP.

blinkowl totally agree with you!

THere is a tendency on mumsnet to really kowtow to the 'rules' - you must never take a child out of school, you cannot question homework rules, you cannot ever do anything that breaks 'rules' however much normal compassionate human response would tell you otherwise.

what sort of human being of any kind is rude to a person (pregnant or not) who is clearly in pain and discomfort and trying to do something to get themselves more comfortable.

Sorry OP, if you didn't pay for business class then you shouldn't have been there. I agree with previous posters that I'd find it very distracting to have someone pacing up and down past me when I'd purposely paid for extra space.

Well done for not crying oldgirl

Op you are pregnant with surges of many varieties of estrogen plus more exciting hormones which also affect your brain chemistry - serotonin, cortisol and so on, and thus make you more sensitive and react differently to situations than you would normally. It is really no surprise you are easy to tears when faced with situations of confrontation or acts that you personally find threatening on some basic level. This is all just basic biology. Anybody degrading you for this needs to go back to school, as it's clear that's where they left their brains behind. Many people don't understand why we function the way we do emotionally. They think they are in control of it. They aren't. It's all individual chemistry I'm afraid. That's why people can be manipulated with drugs.

There's different types of people in this world. Some care more about rules, respect, power. Some care more about human compassion and empathy. You're just going to get conflicted opinions here, and guess what - everybody thinks they are right.

I would care about whether you in pain and the safety of you and the baby. I would have the intelligence to see a situation for what it is. You would be most welcome to have a little walk with me in first class let alone business. That's just me. If I needed to follow protocol and ask you to leave I wouldn't manhandle you, I would explain the situation politely and escort you back without needing to use force. Again, that's just me.

Put down mumsnet. It doesn't matter what we think. Nobody is right or wrong. It's about what kind of person you are and who you want to be.

Forget this and look forward to your little one arriving. That's all that really matters.

Just read your post though blinkowl and totally agree with your points. The same thing annoys me about rail travel. On the train out of Kings Cross to where I live the standard (or 2nd class if you prefer) passengers are crammed into their seats, many often left standing in the aisle near the doors because there's no sitting space, while First Class is almost empty but those there enjoy plentiful leg room and free coffee. Because they earn more.

The reason why people fly business/first is fundamentally because of the additional space these cabins provide - both in terms of the isle, seat width and leg room.

The OP felt entitled to use the additional space in business because she was pregnant and because it was easier due to extra space - not because it wasn't possible to walk around in economy.

In short she felt that being pregnant made it appropriate to use facilities she hadn't paid for and then feel aggrieved and upset when asked not to do so and escorted back to use the facilities she had.

Is there an expectation that every pregnant woman should get upgraded?
Or that they should walk with impunity around an aircraft?ear

Travel whilst pregnant is bloody awful - I know and have been there, but it doesn't grant you the right to use the space other travellers have paid a premium for - which is spot on what the flight attendant told her.

Oh please blinkowl. The flight attendant would be risking his job by not ejecting the op from BC.

I'm afraid I'm not a supporter of special treatment for healthy pregnant women either.

You seem to be conflating a lot of different issues there too. This is not a metaphor for the class struggle and feminism all rolled into one.

The FA's job is to move you quickly and firmly back to the area you have paid for. The last thing the FA has time for is a negotiation about whether you can walk in bc. You don't have a ticket to be there. He sounds a bit brusque but he needed to get you out of there firmly and cleArly. It is nothing to do with your pregnancy just you were in the wrong place. Economy is famously cramped and uncomfortable. You either accept that for a few hours or you pay a small fortune to be more comfortable in business.

^It becomes unreasonable when a pregnant woman in discomfort is treated like that to protect the peace of people with more money.*

You're making this into something it's not. This is about whether a company is wiling to cannibalize its premium service for the benefit of those who have paid for the basic service, which of course, they aren't.

And presumably someone had complained about you so the FA had to respond.
It's been blown out of all proportion, op clearly was no where near delivering or she wouldn't have been allowed to travel.
Yes swollen ankles are very uncomfortable but hardly life-threatening (as I well know with two angles/legs held together with pins and plates).

Because they earn more. No..it's because they PAY more. It's quite different.

"This is not a metaphor for the class struggle and feminism all rolled into one."

Well there we disagree.

The class struggle and feminism aren't something that happen in books, or chat forums.

They are real and affect how we live our daily lives. Including what happens when you are in discomfort and possibly at risk of a medical condition on a plane.

If you are rich and male you are more likely to be in a place with space to move about, and no one being rude to you.

If you are female and not rich you are more likely to be somewhere cramped and have someone be rude to you if you step out if it.

How is that not about class, wealth, power and feminism?

'It's quite extraordinary. I flew on my own at 6 moths pregnant with my toddler. I was in economy. It was an 8 hour flight. The staff were bloody brilliant. It was a long time ago though

I'm still shocked that no one intervened.'

Yes, I am as well, Pag. Which airline was this? I have flown long haul on my own with three kids for years. My son has autism. We're always in economy, but with the exception of United which is the shittiest of shite airlines that I'll never fly on again because the FAs are all complete twats, the staff have been great.

YABVU

And would never hesitate to give my BC seat away to a distressed pregnant woman, or an elderly person taken ill, for example

But you already HAD a seat. We're not talking standing up on the train. If you needed to sit down - which you didn't, you needed to walk - you could have just gone back to the seat you paid for. And if there were 20 empty seats in BC, why would anyone think you needed theirs anyway?

I also fail to see how on earth the FA asking you to leave the section means you were treated as 'less than human'. Probably because it doesn't.

'And would never hesitate to give my BC seat away to a distressed pregnant woman, or an elderly person taken ill, for example'

They already have a seat, so why would you need to give up your seat?

And would never hesitate to give my BC seat away to a distressed pregnant woman, or an elderly person taken ill, for example

How did I miss this? Really, OP? You'd be willing to give away your (hypothetical) BC seat for which you'd paid 5 or 10x the price of coach, just to be nice?

You do realise that there's most likely an unwell/uncomfortable pregnant/elderly person on almost every flight?

needastrongone can I ask if that £80 upgrade is with Thomas Cook?

It's just that this is what they charged me to fly to Orlando in what they called the premium cabin - don't think they used the word "business" though I could be wrong

Very worthwhile it was, too

DH was in first class once. It was because he was flying with work from India to London and was then expected to put in a full 9 hours work at the London office as soon as he landed after his 13hr flight ( or could have been longer not sure as it's a long time ago).

Much as I'd love to experience a bed on a plane, if that's patriarchy and class oppression in action, then I'm happy to be part of the proletariat thanks very much.

Agree with posters saying, he sounds rude, but er, most of us wouldn't have gone in there because we haven't paid to be in there.

As for the...the revolution starts here arguments: DH might be in business class - not as some privileged rich male - but as a worker drone who, if he wants to keep his job, has no choice but to go to India or America for two weeks - straight from work here, straight to work there. Why shouldn't he be allowed to sleep on the plane when he doesn't even want to be there?