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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU - vegan dinner party guest EATING FISH

709 replies

isitginoclock · 13/05/2016 20:06

We're throwing a dinner party. I've just excused myself to the loo to write this because I'm FUMING!! One of our guests has recently become a vegan. I spent bloody ages making her a mushroom pate for starter which she happily tucked into whilst we ate our salmon tartare. She then asked if she could try some salmon.

Wtf?!?!

I've bought loads of different stuff for her to eat and spent all frigging day cooking it. Why do I bother?!

OP posts:
Offred · 15/05/2016 17:42

We are in the north west of England. Vegetarian options for adults are hard to come by never mind in children's portion sizes.

Offred · 15/05/2016 17:46

And it is her problem if she has no food to eat. How she speaks about herself and her choices (which I happen to think are very mature given that she made them at 5) is designed to help other people understand her choices best.

That is the main point of language. No vegetarian is going to complain about the lack of rennet/gelatine. Many will complain about including it. Manufactured vegetarian foods do not contain rennet/gelatine and home cooks/chefs is restaurants/cafes should use the same standards - that they don't is down to lack of knowledge that rennet/gelatine are animal products not being under the impression that all vegetarians eat animal products IMO.

Kit30 · 15/05/2016 17:54

Does she cater for the omnivores when she extends a dinner invitation? No? Call her out and don't invite her again.

AndTakeYourPenguinWithYou · 15/05/2016 17:57

We are in the north west of England. Vegetarian options for adults are hard to come by never mind in children's portion sizes

I can't imagine where you must go, the NW of England was no problem to me 25 years ago as a vegetarian, it can only be far better now. Perhaps you are just too picky.

SuburbanRhonda · 15/05/2016 18:07

Actually, offred, most restaurants don't list gelatine- and rennet-containing foods as suitable for vegetarians. It's getting easier all the time. I was unlucky with The Gherkin.

I'm stunned to hear that you can rarely find vegetarian dishes in restaurants in NW England. Can you be more specific and I'll google for you - bet I can find 10 restaurants in five minutes if you give me your two nearest towns. I'll also look up the menu for your nearest theme park Smile.

Londonmamabychance · 15/05/2016 18:07

I'm sorry but this made me laugh. If I'd gone though the effort of making a vegan option, and my guest ate it, and then asked to TRY a bite of salmon, I would have felt happy she obvs thought the salmon looked tempting and felt comfortable enough in the company to ask to try it, and I would secretly have congratulated her in my mind for not being completely fundamentalist in her new lifestyle choices. (Have respect and understanding for people wanting to be vegan and vegetarian and have no problem catering for them, but do generally think extremism in any form is unhealthy).

Asking for a bite of salmon hardly inconveniences the host. I think the OP's annoyance reveals an underlying resentment of having to have made the vegan meal in the first place. Which is fair enough too, if you're a bit pressed for time etc, it can be a pain! But then the annoyance is more about the actual resentment of the vegan having special demands, rather than her asking for a mouthful of fish.

WhoTheFuckIsSimon · 15/05/2016 18:17

I'm not vegetarian at all but I always tick the vegetarian box for conferences and also on airplanes. It's not as mass produced as the main option and generally is a bit nicer.

So yes, I would be the "vegetarian" having a fry up the next day!

WhoTheFuckIsSimon · 15/05/2016 18:18

Dh is strict vegan and it's a total nightmare eating out. We can only go to Indian restaurants or possibly Mexican.

whois · 15/05/2016 18:33

Dh is strict vegan and it's a total nightmare eating out. We can only go to Indian restaurants or possibly Mexican

Ghee in Indian restaurants not an issue?

What about actual vegetarian/vegan restaurants? Or chain restaurants that specify vegan things on their menu? Or any restaurant and tell them on booking you have a vegan.

HowBadIsThisPlease · 15/05/2016 19:02

"I think the OP's annoyance reveals an underlying resentment of having to have made the vegan meal in the first place."

yes this is the whole point. The whole making of the food was conditional (in the host's mind) on the guest behaving in a certain way, which she then violated, hence the outrage. A conditional offer of hospitality to your guests is not real hospitality. Putting things out that are on offer to some guests and not others, is just tripping them up if they are innocent enough to believe in your good will. She was not a real host. She was a bitchy frenemy.

The reason why I am so intent on pointing this out is that it is meanness masquerading as ethics. It's the doublethink of this person that needs to be challenged.

I also think it is important to point out for philosophical reasons, that not all definitions work on this very newtonian "if x, not y" basis.

"Catholics do not use contraception"
"Sarah is a Catholic and she uses contraception"

Both of these sentences can be true in slightly different ways, at the same time. While the above is sort of true, and a useful rule of thumb, there are many things to being a catholic and not being great at it doesn't disqualify you from being one. There are lots of categories like this. I'd say that vegan is one of them. And I would say that the closer you are to giving a shit about actual food ethics, the more open you would be to seeing it in this nuanced way.

SuburbanRhonda · 15/05/2016 19:06

I'll have a pint of what you're drinking, howbad Grin

CasanovaFrankenstein · 15/05/2016 19:07

Re the ghee, plenty of Indian restaurants will leave out ghee if requested esp if check ahead first.

AbelMancwitch · 15/05/2016 19:22

It's getting soooooo much easier to be vegetarian/vegan out and about (and I'm also from the NW.) Lots of high street chains are stating to cater for vegans; you can get a vegan burger in McDonalds, Nando's is awesome, handmade burger co have about 5 vegan options, zizzi now do vegan pizza and Marstons pubs have a clearly labelled vegan option.

Plus in Manchester there are tons of exclusively veg/vegan cafes and restaurants.

bigpigsmum · 15/05/2016 19:27

We have this similar issue at every family party - one vegetarian - there was 3 but the son realised he has canines for a reason and the husband realised he liked bacon butties far too much!

You should try catering for the single veggie at bar-b-que's too.

Here's an interesting one though, a Muslim friend of mine 'explained' that she could eat fish because it would die naturally if out of water - so there are obviously more tsunami's leaving dying fish on beaches than we think, nothing to do with man's involvement, a trawler vessel and large net then?

Personal choice and the free world - you gotta love it!

limitedperiodonly · 15/05/2016 19:28

the annoyance is more about the actual resentment of the vegan having special demands, rather than her asking for a mouthful of fish.

Londonmama that's what I would have said, if only I'd thought about it properly.

limitedperiodonly · 15/05/2016 19:31

it is meanness masquerading as ethics. It's the doublethink of this person that needs to be challenged.

And this from howbad. Very succinct. That's wot I thort.

randomsabreuse · 15/05/2016 19:32

Pizza Express do a vegan pizza. I ordered the extra cured meats to go on it... probably spooked the chef somewhat. Was amazing to have pizza again!

I try to minimise the impact of DD's food issues on others so it is a VERY odd request!

FeckOfffCup · 15/05/2016 19:37

*Kathyjoy
*
Well the guest tells everybody she's vegan so what choices does the OP have?

  1. Make an entirely vegan meal so everybody has the same thing
  2. Make a vegan dish for the vegan and meat dishes for the meat eaters

I don't see why the meat eaters should all have vegan food just because one vegan is at the meal, when they would like to eat meat. So OP would have to go for choice 2 as how spectacularly rude would it be to serve a fish dish to a vegan (can you imagine that version of AIBU?)

So it's a bit slap in the face when the vegan then happily tucks into the fish. All a bit pointless really, if she would've eaten the fish anyway she should have just said 'don't worry about sorting out a vegan meal for me'. If it was me, and I fancied the salmon, I wouldn't have eaten it or asked for it, as i would feel bad that the OP had gone to effort to make a vegan meal for me.
You can't be a little bit vegan, and you can't eat just a little bit of fish and still be a vegan. If you don't want to be vegan then don't be. But just make your mind up fgs.

Doesn't make me angry particularly, I just think it's a bit daft and a waste of people's time. It's a bit bad manners IMO.

originalmavis · 15/05/2016 19:37

Really? Somebody told me that there was egg in/on pizza express bases.

SuburbanRhonda · 15/05/2016 19:39

How do they leave out the ghee. casanova?

I thought it was what everything was fried in - do they do a completely separate dish fried in vegetable oil?

Offred · 15/05/2016 19:42

? Too picky? Really? Now you are really just looking for problems.

I don't drive. Whilst I know that there is good veggie food in the egg in Liverpool and a wealth of choices in Liverpool we are only able to deliberately plan to go somewhere like that and travel for over an hour to get there with four kids (three of whom are not veggie). We always go to the egg for her birthday though.

In my town there are French and Italian restaurants and pubs.

All my siblings are vegetarian, it isn't that any of them or DD is too picky. It is that we live in a reasonable sized town that doesn't cater well for veggies. I don't understand why you feel it is necessary to pick apart and patronise TBH.

My boss was having a nightmare trying to find a restaurant for the staff lunch that will even plan a menu with a veggie option. I don't even know why I'm feeling like I have to justify this!

But go ahead

Offred · 15/05/2016 19:42

*in manchester

SuburbanRhonda · 15/05/2016 19:44

I don't see why the meat eaters should all have vegan food just because one vegan is at the meal, when they would like to eat meat.

Because it's nice to try something different sometimes? You know, broaden your horizons a bit? If you want to eat meat, eat it some other time. It's not the Last Supper.

AndTakeYourPenguinWithYou · 15/05/2016 19:50

If there are italian restaurants you can get vegetarian food. There will be plenty on an Italian menu you can eat, esp since you have no problem with rennet so you're fine with parmigiano/ grana padano.
Like I said, picky.

FeckOfffCup · 15/05/2016 19:58

Because it's nice to try something different sometimes? You know, broaden your horizons a bit? If you want to eat meat, eat it some other time. It's not the Last Supper

Yeah but the OP is the one cooking, it's her house, if she fancied meat why shouldn't she have it? I'm sure she's not gone her entire life without having had a vegetarian or vegan meal. Doesn't mean she has to cook one just because a vegan who isn't a vegan is coming for dinner