AIBU to be relieved that another child hit my son back today :/?

[Tonis2297]

Okay I know I'm going to be completely blasted for this but DS is 3 1/2 he has suspected asd along with a few other problems MAJOR behaviour problems he is constantly lifting his hands to other children and his 9 month old sister we obviously do not hit him and always go on about kinds hands etc but he doesn't care he bit me last week and drew blood head butting me etc , today he through a toy at another child and the child retaliated by scratching DS face part of me feels guilty about this but the other parts glad that someone (his own age) has finally stood up to him as he really is a litlle bully I feel like such a shit parent

You're not a shit parent. Honestly. Lots of children go through this phase and it's horrible for us parents.

Is he in preschool? How are they handling the situation?

Thanks lettherebecupcakes, they are not handling it were hoping he gets moved in August to a Sen unit it's so much calmer and quieter for him , the nursery just keep saying it's not his fault , he doesn't understand etc when imo he does there just making excuses

But, in the nicest possible way, if he has suspected ASD then he may not 'understand'. He may know the rules but his brain isn't working the same way as a NT child's is, it isn't making the same connection. If he is feeling a sensory overload then he is simply lashing out. No 3 and a 1/2 year old, even a NT one, is ever really a bully. They can exhibit behaviour which is challenging and can feel like they are a bully, but they are still v young. And if he has other issues then another child hitting/biting him will not send the message it would to a NT child. It would add to his feeling of distress.

This is not to suggest that someone with ASD cannot understand codes of behaviour or even be disciplined but I suspect it will have to be done completely differently.

If he has ASD he may not really understand or he may understand but have no other way to communicate what is going on inside. I wouldn't use 'bully' for an NT child at 3 never mind a one with ASD.

More than likely this child retaliating will have zero impact on his behaviour. Though he may deliberately go for or avoid this child in future. It's good that there is something set up in the near future.

Is your ds quite bright? I found it hard to tell initially when my ds was just being naughty or when his behaviour was as a result of his asd because he was so articulate and affectionate. Tbh I still find it difficult to work out at times.

Anyway, you're not a bad mum.

I don't know about bright he has a lot of learning difficulties and a lot of his words are copying us without understanding it iyswim , I just don't know I think I'm just fed up being a 3 year olds punchbag

Sorry I just realised my post made it sound like your DS was going through a phase, obviously that's not the case if he has suspected ASD. Apologies, it was my clumsy way of trying to say it's not your fault!!

Aye least his nursery aren't blaming him. I've no experience of ASD, but is at advisable for nurseries to put things in place as if he definitely DOES have ASD? Maybe it would help if you could go to them with a list of suggestions to try. Perhaps ask for ideas on the SN board?

Op, believe me I understand. But I really think you need to adjust your expectations. He is 3, he is so young. SEN or not, 3 year olds have absolutely no understanding of how other people feel. Please don't say it's his fault, it really, really isn't and thinking like that won't help you or him.

How far along are you on the diagnosis? Why is he being moved to a SEN placement, because the nursery can't cope? How long has he behaved like this - could there be another reason, change in home life etc that he is lashing out against (not trying to put the blame on you)

I think you need support. Do you have any autism support groups near you? Anyone you can talk to who has experience of ASD?

He isn't a bully. He probably can't help his behaviour and that isn't an excuse, it's a reason. Saying that, nursery should be working with you to come up with strategies to help, even if it's something like noticing he lashes out more if he's tired, so to help, they move his nap time a bit earlier. Stuff like that.

My ds was like that at 3. He still hits now but it's nowhere near as bad. More of a slap on the arm than anything.

Copying phrases is called scripting. Sometimes what they are trying to communicate is not about the words, it's about something it reminds them of. Sometimes they just like saying the words or reminding themselves of the show that they heard them on.

It can be really hard work.

You could contact the NAS and see if they have any support groups in your area.

We are waiting for the assessment for the diagnosis he sees paed and speech and language they've both agreed he has autism although there not doing anymore till the genetics results are back (been waiting since flipping January ) his nursery say they can 'meet his needs' yet they've cut 1 hour and 10 mins off every session because he doesn't cope nope nothing has changed at home he was OK in the 2-3 room but it was much smaller maybe 20 kids then they just upped and moved him it's a class of 88 children 😳 !! It's far too noisy and busy imo but the nursery don't seem to care !

www.autism.org.uk/services/local.aspx

I've literally been phoning round everyone the last couple of weeks begging for there help he isn't sleeping great up till 3am sleeps till 7am and then back up till 3am the next morning I'm exhausted, I already have experience my brother and sister both have aspergers and growing up was horrendous to put it nicely there was no support and my mum suffered a nervous breakdown followed by years of depression so no point even talking to my mum , dad still doesn't believe any of them has autism he sticks his head in the sand and dp is working full time and is supportive as he can be

Oh yeah and the support groups near me you have to have a proper diagnosis on paper to go pretty shit !

Sorry zzz am I missing something?

Just out of interest. What genetic testing are they doing? My ds just did the ados assessment.

For some support groups like early bird you need an assessment but the NAS ones are just like coffee mornings. You could try some generic sen support groups or look on Facebook to see if there are parent led groups.

The sen groups here on mumsnet are pretty good too.

Can nursery not drop him down to the younger group again? To be honest if they say no, I think the nursery are really failing you here. They should never rush a child up to the higher age group of they aren't coping. And it's extremely hard to get a proper diagnosis for ASD in toddlers so they have to be able to manage this type of behaviour. Do you know what the staff to child ratio is? Is there another nursery he could go to - appreciate this would be unsettling for him and may make things worse but where he is doesn't sound great. I think it would be unwise to put him in a SEN setting without the proper diagnosis first.

Soapboxqueen - it's for fragile x syndrome and some other things I'm not quite sure yet.
Zzzzz - sorry I didn't know what you meant by the first post I don't think he should be in that class either I was happy with him in the 2-3 room he also had access to the sensory room while in the smaller class and used to often visit the baby room (only about 3 or 4 babies in there at a time and more age apropriate toys for him) they've both been taken away from him because of lack of staffing in the class, I think I'll give NAS a phone tomorrow and see if they can help with some support

I'm with zzzzz. They can meet his needs but can't iyswim? They can by making reasonable adjustments - keeping in smaller class with age appropriate peers (developmentally wise) and age appropriate toys. They aren't by putting him in a class room full of noisy children where he can't understand or navigate the social aspect, make himself understood or manage the sensory aspects of the environment.
I'm sure they can't decrease his hours either if he's entitled to 3 hours then they need to provide the 3 hours - with support if necessary.

My DS is also 11 with ASD and struggles in a classroom of 25-30 as per the norm for this age. There is no way he'd manage 88 - he can't even manage the changing rooms for PE!

I meet with SENCO but she's useless and tries to hide out my way because she doesn't like when I question her and more or less told me it was my fault ds is the way he is because I told them they need to be more consistent with him (he has two different key workers 1 Monday Tuesday and the other Wednesday Thursday Friday in the other room he only had one who he really connected with and trusted as did I) he's supposed to have 1-1 30 mins a week which isn't enough imo , he does have SALT who changed in January his old one was fab and he really came along way , the new one has newly qualified and doesn't actually work directly with ds he sends instructions to his key workers pointless again we have another multi agency on the 11th so I will be pulling this all up then as I feel he's being badly let down , also we have yet to see the educational psychologist we've been on the list 18 months Ds has alot of other disabilities other than said suspected autism , that's why I thought SEN setting might be better for him