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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to want to see the will?

266 replies

tremble · 23/04/2016 21:46

NC for this, just in case. We've just found out a distant relative has died, and the funeral was yesterday. My DS and I are pretty angry that we weren't told, as we knew the relative when we were children and would like to have paid our respects.

We found this out today when we got a letter from relative's sister saying that the relative hadn't signed their will, so we and a few cousins and aunts etc will inherit a share of their estate. But the sister says she wants to honour the unsigned will and has asked us to revoke our shares so she can do this. We hadn't expected to inherit anything so we're not fussed about the money which probably won't be much, but we thought we'd ask to see the unsigned will so we can be sure that if we give up our shares then it goes to the right people.

But the sister says we're not allowed see it. She won't even tell us which solicitor is handling the estate and got pretty angry when we asked, saying we had no right. Her behaviour seems a little suspicious but we haven't really any experience with wills. Is it unreasonable to ask to see it? And what would you do?

OP posts:
WineOrSleep · 01/06/2016 08:31

So did you engage a solicitor op?

icanteven · 01/06/2016 11:01

This definitely isn't a zombie yet - I'd love an update, OP!

JinRamen · 01/06/2016 11:25

Wow! Hope you got it sorted! Sorry for your loss Flowers

tremble · 05/07/2016 18:00

Sorry to take so long to update this thread folks!

At my last update I had called all the agencies I could think of, including the police, and their advice had been to get a solicitor to sort out the legalities of the sister's actions.

The family at this point were somewhat divided in their opinions - some just wanted to take their share of the money, two believed my aunt's story of the Will and declined their share, some thought it wasn't worth pursuing further, and only two of us wanted to persevere.

In the meantime, the sister emailed all the ones who had asked for their share saying she had their cheques signed and ready to post, only she couldn't now because nasty rotten tremble had reported her to the police. So it went from "I don't want you to take your money" to "tremble has prevented me from giving you your money".

I let things slide for a week or two while I pondered what do to, then called the police again to get a reminder of the exact details they needed. This second call made things a lot clearer than the first. This officer explained that at this point in the situation, any action taken against the sister would be civil action, not criminal action, hence the need for a solicitor. He also explained that the police do not investigate accusations of fraud; they can only act on evidence of fraud. So if the solicitor discovered that the sister had broken any laws in her actions, they would pass the details on to the police. He said that what I said sounded like she had broken a few laws, but I'd need to get a solicitor to prove these points.

The fact that the sister has three times refused to show us the unsigned Will meant nothing, but if she refused to show it, or refused to name the legal Firm that drafted it to a solcitor, that would be considered proof the Will didn't exist.

My investigations that showed the sister hadn't followed the legal process to be Executor didn't count, but a solicitor's investigations would.

Also a solicitor would be able to establish if the decased had a joint account with the sister or not, because if not then the sister has embezzled all the monies from the estate.

So it was clear that there was no way to do this without incurring legal fees, and when I got a quote for the case from my solicitor, I decided I can't really afford to go through the legal expense to get to the truth. If we'd all been standing together and sharing the cost then I would have been happy to proceed, but I knew there was no point in asking the others.

Then I sort of forgot for a few weeks...

But another relative prompted me about it so I emailed the sister saying that despite all the evidence that she is a lying cow (well, words to that effect) I am not going to pursue it any further as she has caused enough unpleasantness, so could she just send out the cheques please.

And oddly enough, no-one has received one yet. Hmm

OP posts:
MrsLupo · 06/07/2016 00:23

Funny...I was just thinking about this thread today and wondering how you'd got along. It's a shame it's going to be too expensive to pursue. Have you completely made up your mind about that? From how you describe the civil/criminal process, I wonder whether it would not take that much digging (and therefore not incur that much in the way of fees) for a solicitor just to uncover the evidence the police need to get involved. At that point you could stand back and let the police get on with it. I know there isn't that much money involved (iirc) but it just seems so... wrong...

Fidelia · 06/07/2016 08:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Penfold007 · 06/07/2016 09:06

Thanks for the update. I bet no one gets a penny from this woman. I'd be tempted to speak to HMRC. The Scottish will I executed was seven years ago, last month a lost pension fund contacted me and paid out around £1800 and HMRC were right on it taxing it at source. Oh and yes I made sure the beneficiaries got their share.

tremble · 06/07/2016 11:47

MrsLupo

I agree it's wrong and, due to a history with this woman that I won't go into, there's nothing I'd like more than to see her in court. But I've already advised everyone involved that I'm not taking it any further so if I changed my mind I'd just look vindictive. Which I possibly am, but I want to avoid being the baddie in all of this because I really don't think I am!

However if she doesn't pay up, the rest of the family might change their minds and agree to getting a solicitor between us after all. That'll be fun!

Fidelia

Yes, I got as much information from them as I could, but a lot of it just couldn't be given out to a pleb like me. That's why it needs a solicitor to request the details to then pass to the police.

I think from what the sister has said that it can't have been a joint bank account, because on the death of the relative, the funds would legally revert to the sister anyway so she wouldn't be trying to cover her backside now. But again, I can't get that kind of info myself (I have tried!). Absolutely everyone I spoke to said I need a lawyer.

Penfold007

I don't think I would get any information from HMRC due to DPA restrictions. Again, it needs a more formal body than me to be speaking to the right departments.

How amazing that seven years on, there was still some more money found. I know it's no compensation for the loss of your relative, but a welcome surprise, I'm sure.

OP posts:
Fidelia · 06/07/2016 13:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MissBattleaxe · 06/07/2016 14:03

How frustrating OP! What she's done is so illegal! Can you try and get one of those half hour free surgeries with a solicitor? or try CAB for free advice? I wouldn't worry about looking vindictive if you've changed your mind. Nobody has their cheques yet so they'll soon see you were right!

Mycraneisfixed · 06/07/2016 14:21

Nothing wrong with changing your mind. I'd hold out for my share.

DeathStare · 07/07/2016 02:54

A family friend (who knew he was dying) had a will drawn up leaving his estate how he thought he ought to (rather than how he wanted to). However he then had second thoughts and decided not to sign the will.

An unsigned will is not a sign of the deceased's intent - in fact quite the opposite could be argued and the fact that it is unsigned could be taken to mean that it absolutely not what the deceased wanted, either because they had a change of heart or because someone else had the will drawn up and presented it to them.

tremble · 05/08/2016 21:39

Just thought I'd tie up the final loose end of this thread - cheques arrived today. More than the relative estimated. I've decided to donate half of it to an animal welfare charity as I know the deceased relative was fond of animals.

I also received a long ranting email in which she decided to tell me some "home truths" (she barely knows me!) but to be honest, I just glanced at it as she was clearly just venting, mostly assumptions that are not worthwhile correcting. She now sees me as the ringleader who tried to get some kind of revenge on her for some imagined slight, and has told them all that I was the one telling them lies. I don't know if they believe her or not, and am sort of past caring.

At least I know I tried to do the right thing. Thanks everyone, who offered helpful advice and support, and told me I was definitely not being unreasonable!

Flowers
OP posts:
SimplyNigella · 06/08/2016 07:15

Well done OP, sorry to hear about the nasty email but you've handled things really well.

KERALA1 · 06/08/2016 08:18

Yes well done!

I work in this area and a poster up thread criticised the solicitors for not ensuring the will was signed which I thought rather harsh. You take instructions, ensure will reflects clients wishes and client understands the law etc then your send the will and make an appointment to visit client to get it executed. If the client ignores you and wont engage further there isn't much you can do really. I have several clients like this, I keep phoning/emailing/writing/texting to arrange a signing but if they won't engage further thats that.

PotteringAlong · 06/08/2016 08:26

I think you've definitely done the right thing - you stood up for your deceased relative and had his estate distributed correctly, not as thieving relative saw fit Flowers

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