to wonder how the country will cope with hundreds of thousands more people each year?

[evilcherub]

If the UK is going to continue to have immigration of hundreds of thousands every year (which is more likely if we don't leave the EU) and the Tories apparently having no real interest in building more genuinely affordable homes (because lower house prices do not bring in votes for the Tories), then where are the millions of extra people and families going to live (when there is already a massive housing crisis and homelessness is going through the roof)? Also, what about all the extra schools needed, the extra hospitals (when at the moment they cannot cope and the Tories want to privatise them anyway), the jobs etc? Unless you are well off/bought your home years ago and have a well-established, well paying job, then immigration means extreme and expensive competition for housing, school places, healthcare, jobs etc. I just don't see it ending well.

The issues are a close to my heart, I am a lifelong language learner and have worked in EU countries and travelled a bit. It is just a bit more Brit or English bashing to my ears when I hear the soundbite/ refrain about language learning. The British are being logical in one way although it does harm our representation on the staff of European institutions..

There is the question of how we, as native English speakers, manage the priviledge of being native speakers of the 'world's first language'. We can certainly make an attempt at a bit of French or Spanish.

Our advantage is also our disadvantage: we have no urgent need to learn a second or third language the way the Dutch or French do, and of course its infinitely more difficult to re-activate that sphere of the brain as we age.

It's a bit rich to bash the English who emigrate abroad for not integrating and learning the language when simultaneously insisting that immigrants into the UK should be allowed to retain their culture, language and separate identity under the ethos of multi culturalism.

Your first point was bang on target Stepinto.

That's one thing that has occurred to me. It is harder in this country to access video content/tv in other languages. We had to buy a streaming box which we had to set up with some complicated software to get tv for my DH in his language (so he can watch his beloved team). Many bands from Europe sing in English or are hard to source. I've been so impressed that Rammstein still sing mostly in their native German. I am so glad my DS will end up with 2 or 3 languages on top of English but that is only because we have that mix.

It's not always great for the low wage earners, as I posted earlier some of my DH Eastern European colleagues are having to use foodbanks as contracts are being cut and changed, so in many cases the only beneficiary is the company they work for who are doing very nicely thank you.

It's taking from those who can least afford it on all sides.

It's also doing the countries at home no favours, draining them of young people. We saw summer festivities on TV in my DH home country and there were just mostly old people and children in many. Many of his colleagues say they don't know how the people back home put food on the table. It has not improved things for these countries taking much of their working age population.

I'm a Redditor and there's lots of people on there who always say things like 'apologies for my bad english' and that's the only giveaway that they weren't natural speakers/writers. When asked how they learned a LOT say it's from watching American and British programmes. I find this amazing. I mean I watch Anime and a lot of foreign Horror films but there's no way in hell I'd be able to pick up another language like they have

One of the things my DH says is that so much of teen/young culture is now in English that a huge incentive for teens abroad is learning English to access it. This is true of the music scenes etc. He said he learnt a lot of his English from lyrics off the back of records!

Arf, so very true Sport! I did the same as a teenager! Knew "I'm the Walrus" lyrics by heart! ;-)

That's one of the situation British expats face to my mind : most people, especially youngster, are so happy to have an opportunity to speak English with them that the prospect of learning an allegedly difficult language such as French doesn't sound that enticing.

Gray's it's because they really, really want to be able to listen to the music etc. My DH was fanatical about punk and metal and most bands were British or American, so he'd pore over lyric sheets etc until he understood them. It is a side effect of true passion.

Many languages aren't as difficult as they seem once you've learnt the rules, also it's easier just to learn through copying. That's how I've learnt DH language with the result that I also share his accent in the language!

I love that y'know, I love how he was that into the bands that he actually learned a whole new language just to be able to understand. It's brilliant

They did have English lessons but it was his passion for the bands that did it. It's why he's here too. He came on a holiday with a mate to see some of the bands he'd only heard about and 20years and 2 kids later he's still on the world's longest holiday.

He also is fluent in Spanish as well as he lived there too!

Haha brilliant!

I wish there had been more emphasis on languages when I was at school. I did French till year 8 then we could drop it, and I dropped it so I could take an extra science.

I suppose I could take personal responsibility and learn one myself but it would have been nice to have it mandatory at school

Why should distant, unaccountable elites and lobbyists bring about legislation that hasn't been voted on in Westminster, yet supercedes our own laws which have? In the UK a new government can repeal a law which has been proven unhelpful or no longer what the country feels is best.

But more than often, and whatever the country, Governements have an hypocritical tendency to put the blame on EU when passing unpopular laws or/and not taking responsabilities for their short-term bad decisions.

For instance, Blair is the one who put a lot of pressure to E.U to broaden the Union to newcomers. In doing so, he wanted to weaken the traditionnal German / French leadership and fair enough, who could blame him? Yet, when this has provoked in the long-term an immigration en masse from Eastern citizens : Bam! It's all the E.U's fault. Same thing with Cameron who has previously fought to prevents E.U from regulating cheap chinese steel imports. Comes the Tata Steel Crisis : obviously, that is officially due to Europe's rules restricting State aid.

And so on with France. French farmes are the ones who receive the most subventions in EU and yet, they struggle to maintain a decent standart of living. For ages, French governements have said they couldn't help it as they had to comply with European quota on moilk when the truth is that they don't want to force the supermarkets to lower their marge benefits by buying milk to the producer at a fairer price.

So, it might be true that the Commission is ruled by an unelected Elite (although again, not voting the law) but same can be said about our national governments : Public School Boys in England and Enarques in France, all united to mainatain their privileges.

Yes, sportinguista, the English music/popular culture influence is very strong.

Also, English is a high-status language so "acceptable" in a way that minority languages are not. My kids are bilingual German/English (we live in a German-speaking country) and are encouraged, praised and admired for their proficiency in English.

Having said that, an old lady did once castigate me for speaking English to my children on a bus and demanded to know why I wasn't teaching them German so not everyone thinks of it as a blessing.

Sorry, off topic AGAIN, will shut up now ....

Can't we talk about opera and language learning instead, much more fun?

It's a bit rich to bash the English who emigrate abroad for not integrating and learning the language when simultaneously insisting that immigrants into the UK should be allowed to retain their culture, language and separate identity under the ethos of multi culturalism.

I have lived abroad all my working life (unless you count teenage PT and student jobs). I am bilingual, as are my children. I speak a third European language fairly fluently as well. However, I have definitely and proudly retained my British culture, language and identity, and my children are regularly exposed to British/English-speaking culture in the form of books, films, visits "home", etc. etc. The two aren't mutually exclusive. Not for us anyway.

In Scotland all immigrants should drink 2 pints of Irn-Bru to get the right to reside in the country.

Plus

1. Dance the Slosh to a high standard.

1. Name the team that beat England at Wembley in 1967 and go all misty eyed whilst doing so

1. Eat a Munchy Box in under 5 minutes.

1. Identify all soft drinks as 'juice'

And well said Myosotis, there's a lot of truth in that.

I just can't leave this thread alone, can I?

Also, English is a high-status language so "acceptable" in a way that minority languages are not. My kids are bilingual German/English (we live in a German-speaking country) and are encouraged, praised and admired for their proficiency in English

Very true Nolts. Everyone praises bilingual English-French family in France but the ones who dare to carry on speaking arab to their kids are frowned upon.

Mind you, that was the same case for children from Italian or Portuguese ascendant 40 years ago. I guess that in many time from now, it'll be seen as trendy to speak Polish in Richmond streets. ;-)

I Just can't leave this thread alone, can I?

Well, I guess that as expats, we' re anxious about the referendum result. :-)

That's too big a concern for our future to be treated lightly.

LikeDylanInTheMovie, I reckon you're a big Belle & Sebastian fan? So am I!

Around here the second language is mostly Urdu. Most of the kids speak English as well, as do the parents, often mixed in the same sentence. The only drawback with Urdu is it has limited possibilties outside that community and Pakistan as it's not one of the major world languages. Arabic however does have a good chunk of speakers and is useful as a business language if coupled with one of the other majors. Whilst important to use the home language it's important to have the language of the country too.

For instance, Blair is the one who put a lot of pressure to E.U to broaden the Union to newcomers. In doing so, he wanted to weaken the traditionnal German / French leadership and fair enough, who could blame him? Yet, when this has provoked in the long-term an immigration en masse from Eastern citizens : Bam! It's all the E.U's fault

I see so the EU is a tool any government of the UK can use against its own people.

Even more reason to remove the stick.

The more languages the better, I think. I'd love to learn another one but not sure if my aging brain cells are up to it. I really envy my kids being brought up bilingual and taking it for granted, it was a hard slog learning German from scratch at 13!

StepintotheLightleave

Some of us would say even more reason to be very careful what UK government you vote for ...

Myosotis

at Polish becoming de rigueur in Richmond

Yes, there's a certain level of personal interest as an expat (or migrant, as I'd be called were I a Romanian, Pole or Latvian) but I've always just felt instinctively European; I don't understand the "us" and "them" mentality.