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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU - Mother hoarding money

113 replies

rubberdubber1970 · 09/04/2016 14:25

Ok here's the scene
My father spent half his life moving money from account to account to get the best interest rate, he invested heavily in stocks and shares and mostly made money.
Money became his god, he would never spend, food was always cheap cuts, never any heating on in the house, bath was only allowed to be filled half way, no holidays, wore the same clothes week in week out etc etc

My mum always a housewife used to complain about his meaness.
My father died 5 years ago leaving a tidy sum (about £350,000 in cash) and the house
My mum is 75 and not in the best of health, I have moved her to a place near me so I can help her out.

My brother has rheumatoid arthritis and struggles to work every day, but has to work to pay his mortgage.
I have chronic tendinitis in both arms (yes it hurts to type) but I run my own business so can't stop as I also have a mortgage to pay and don't get sick pay
I have spent about £5000 on acupuncture, therapists, physio to try and cure it

My brother has no children (only grown up step children) I have a daughter and will not be having anymore.

My mother in law (aged 93) is in a care home at £730 per week, she had £63,000 now most of it's gone for her care home fees.

My mother has turned into my father, she struggles to walk, but won't get a taxi, she won't turn the heating on, won't phone my brother because he has a mobile phone so costs more, even when I bought her some special offer wine she queried the price that I said she owed me.

All the while she sits complaining about the rate of interest she is getting from the bank - Forgot to mention she has two private pensions and a full old age pension - she has an income of £1000 per month and out goings of £600

For the last 5 years I have been telling her to spend her money, I have been brutal telling her that if she goes into a care home that they will take it. I've explained about inheritance tax and how her estate is above it. My father spending his life avoiding tax, she seems happy to give it to the system.

I have begged saying if you don't want to give it to me or my brother, or her only grandchild then at least give it to charity - but to do something good with it.

AIBU? I know it's her money, but she could really help out my brother and aid his suffering, but she won't listen, the money just sits in the bank earning a total pittance.

OP posts:

BitterAndOnlySlightlyTwisted · 09/04/2016 15:59

Care-home fees are money well-spent. If you knew the standard of local authority-financed care-homes you'd be glad your mother has the means to go somewhere better if the time came. A grand a week at the moment so she has the means to barely cover three years (or thereabouts) before she'd be moved to a local-authority one.

You're eyeing up her money thinking that if she won't spend it on herself now, rather saving it for the care-home eventuality, then she should spend it on her children. That's not very attractive any way I look at it.

Her money, her decision.

BitterAndOnlySlightlyTwisted · 09/04/2016 16:02

I've realised that that my maths is wanting but my opinion still stands.

DinosaursRoar · 09/04/2016 16:03

It also seems that you always assumed your dad controlled the money and it was his will that you would live in a way with no money spent, this was something he imposed on your mum, as well as on you and your DB, however - you accepted this was 'his way' but are annoyed at her keeping these habits because to you, now she can spend the way you assume she always wanted to, but your Dad didn't let her. From here, it seems less like he was controlling with her, more she agreed with his approach to money. She might have grumbled about his meaness, but clearly didn't think he was wrong.

It's hard if you have taken someone by their word and believed them that they didn't like living a certain way, but clearly your Mum didn't mind, she didn't stop your dad acting like that and has behaved the same.

She's not turned into your Dad, she's been the woman she's always been and acted in the way she always has towards money and spending.

LaurieFairyCake · 09/04/2016 16:03

I think it's about the change. The OP describes in the past that she complained about meanness but is now trying to live like that.

I think age concern say 21 is the temp required for an elderly person.

At some point it crosses from ordinary thriftiness to neglecting self. Not so bad in a young and healthy person but not good in an elderly person.

There's still loads who die every year due to inadequate heating.

ImNotThatGirl · 09/04/2016 16:06

Why do people automatically assume she doesn't have capacity just because she's super, super frugal? That's not how it works.

LaurieFairyCake · 09/04/2016 16:07

No it's not - it's the change that's the problem.

MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 09/04/2016 16:08

I'm quite tight. Maybe I should be put in a home and my money controlled by someone more profligate? Or am I ok because in only half the op's mother's age?

limitedperiodonly · 09/04/2016 16:09

Bloody hell. It scares me that in less than 30 years time someone might not think I'm fit to run my own life and others will be backing them up.

It's her money. Her financial affairs are her own and she might have made provision to avoid inheritance tax, if she wants to do that. She's far from needing someone to take power of attorney if she goes through her bank statements with a magnifying glass and it doesn't sound like she's neglecting herself.

When she eventually dies you might find yourself with a wonderful windfall and will still be young enough to blow it on taxis and turning the central heating up a notch.

In the meantime, try to hold on to that thought.

MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 09/04/2016 16:09

What change? Sounds like it's always been a bit miserly in that house.

ImNotThatGirl · 09/04/2016 16:09

It's not a change if she lived with a man like that.

ImNotThatGirl · 09/04/2016 16:11

I agree with the recent posters. It's her money and her life. If she refused to flush the toilet to save water, you might have a point but honestly, people need to back off their older relatives. I see it all the time at work. Their money, their choice. 18 degrees is not that cold either.

MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 09/04/2016 16:13

18 degrees? Positively balmy!

LaurieFairyCake · 09/04/2016 16:13

Yeah. It'd be better not to check that the changes in her personality (from complaining endlessly about the thrifty life she was forced to live to suddenly having tons of money and not putting the heating on) aren't down to a debilitating disease that nearly 30% will suffer from.

Because you know, 'checking' - that's a bad thing.

Far better for her to die of cold like loads of other elderly people

OP - SS and age concern can assist you with this if there's any possibility that she might be suffering from self neglect.

ImNotThatGirl · 09/04/2016 16:15

Age Concern doesn't exist anymore, it's Age UK if you do need advice OP.

limitedperiodonly · 09/04/2016 16:15

BTW, I complain about the rate of interest I get from the inheritance from my late mother too. But at least there was an inheritance.

LaurieFairyCake · 09/04/2016 16:15

Recommended elderly home living room temperature is 21. 18 in other rooms.

24,000 deaths last year caused by the cold.

ImNotThatGirl · 09/04/2016 16:16

Laurie, I see far more older people being told what to do with their money (and being financially abused, although I am certainly not accusing the OP who clearly cares very much about her mum) than dying purely because they're too thrifty and a bit mean with money.

DinosaursRoar · 09/04/2016 16:19

Laurie - but the OP doesn't say she complained endlessly - just she moaned a bit about her DH's extreme meanness, that doesn't mean she didn't agree with the less extreme ends of his meanness, nor does it seem like she did anything to try to change the way they lived.

The OP assumes her mum was as helpless as she and her DB were to change the way they lived as children, but her mum was an adult, it could have been that her DH /the OP's Dad was controlling and wouldn't allow his DW to live the way she wanted, or more likely, given she's continued to live like that when her DH died, she agreed with him.

The inadquate heating does need to be talked about with her, but from a health point of view, the rest of it, tellign her not to save her money, not to walk but get taxis etc (and if you can walk, I would say always do, it's the elderly that stop that go down hill quick), then perhaps the OP needs to accept her mum is not going to 'spend spend spend' just because her DH has died and she now "can" - it's only the OP who thinks she couldn't spend before.

LaurieFairyCake · 09/04/2016 16:20

Financial abuse is a problem of course. My sis is an adult social worker and they see that a fair bit - usually towards the end after the money's gone though.

I don't think that's down to the money being stolen after POA though, more to bullying etc.

MovingOnUpMovingOnOut · 09/04/2016 16:23

I've seen money being taken after POA but I worked in banking for a long time so that's where my exposure was.

I think lots of people moan about things but when push comes to shove they like the familiarity of the status quo.

So long as the op's dm isn't hurting herself it's really up to her what she does.

ImNotThatGirl · 09/04/2016 16:23

People are living longer and longer, even with multiple chronic health needs. She might be frightened and sometimes, it hits people all at once that they could live another 10 or 15 years in poor health. Older people are allowed to make bad financial decisions. Younger people do it all the time. Unless the OP tells us that she has other reasons to be concerned about her mum's cognitive state, jumping straight to assume dementia is OTT.

thecatsarecrazy · 09/04/2016 16:27

My dad owns the house, has a tidy sum in the bank but sits freezing in the day time because heating is to expensive.
Recently he offered to sign over 30k each to me and my brother but when I brought up using it as a deposit he said I couldn't spend it . So I told him no thank you.

LaurieFairyCake · 09/04/2016 16:28

I'm not assuming dementia at all. I just think the op may need to check.

Quite a few die from self neglect who are allowed to too - you're allowed to do this if you have capacity. You're allowed to make bad financial decisions, live in a hole int road, eat only double cream if you have capacity

What shouldn't happen is that scared elderly people die of the cold or self neglect because they've a mental health issue or disease that prevents them looking after themselves.

This can't be decided by anyone here (including me, the capacity assessments about 70 pages) but it still may need to be done.

LaurieFairyCake · 09/04/2016 16:30

thecatsarecrazy

What did he want you to go with it? Keep it in the bank like he does?

Cornishclio · 09/04/2016 16:43

I agree it is crazy but beyond reinforcing the message some people just will not spend it and hoard for whatever reason. My mum has a very good pension which will more than cover private care home fees so she has gifted a lot to me, my sister and brother and in turn we have gifted to our children who have gone through uni and bought houses etc. I cannot understand anyone who does not want to minimise inheritance tax for their heirs. Why pay more than you need to. If you think at some point your mum may need a power of attorney set up do it now while she is still compos mentis. I have just done one for my mum.

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