Pissed off with friend, is this fair?

[MintyChops]

Ok, had some friends round for lunch with their kids, one of them came on his own with his 3 year old daughter. At one point after lunch we were in our sitting room, kids playing, adults sipping wine and he asked her to stop doing something (can't remember what) and she had a bit of a tantrum and threw the large hat she had in her hand at him. It knocked a glass of red wine all over my relatively new and extremely expensive curtains plus a cushion.

I quickly tried to clean it up, my husband helped me and he........sat there. He did apologise but made no move to help clean up, sent his 3 year old to say sorry to me and advised us to get it dry cleaned then went home. I was very surprised and then later very annoyed that he didn't help sort the mess his daughter made AND didn't offer to pay to have it cleaned. Have I lost perspective on this? I can't imagine not trying to help clean up a mess one of my kids had made and offering to pay for any costs.

To give a bit more background, we have a dog who hates joggers/runners and will try to bite them. A couple of years ago this same friend was in our house, ran past the dog and the dog lunged and ripped his jeans. He was very upset and we offered to buy him a new pair of jeans. He told us it would cost €300 as they were Diesel jeans. We gave it to him even though I thought it was a huge amount of money especially as the jeans were quite old and I have felt odd/a bit resentful about it ever since.

I suppose my question is AIBU for being pissed off that he was willing to take a lot of money from us for something our dog did but not willing to offer to pay the s for something his daughter did?

You said in your first post that he advised you to get the curtains dry cleaned.

I'd take that as his offer to pay.

Ring him and say something along the lines of "Hi X, we've had a quote of X amount for the dry cleaning as you requested, they need to get to work on the stain right away so would you prefer to send me the money up front now or shall I send the bill on to you after the curtains are done?"

I agree that id have taken the get it dry leaned as an offer to oay so get a quote.

Inonow you dont want to address the dog, but did he run past the dog in your house? If so why would he run in your house? Im wondering if he intentionally wound up the dog. Cant think of another reason for a grown man to run inside someones house.

I'm not going to ask him to pay for the dry cleaning. If it had happened with someone else's kid and they had offered to pay I would have appreciated the offer but wouldn't have accepted the money so it feels wrong to ask for it. It has crystallised for me that I do not like him and part of that is a values clash. My DH and I are very generous, so are most of our friends - he is conspicuously mean in comparison. We will be seeing a lot less of him, not in a pointed "dinner party you are not invited to" way, but a lot less.

I love the cynics who thought he ran to provoke the dog and end up with money for jeans! He ran because his daughter was in the hall, knocked something over (an empty cardboard box leaning against the wall I think it was) and gave herself a fright and cried out. His instinct to protect his daughter overrode his knowledge that the dog would chase despite all of us roaring at him to stop stop STOP. Understandable but I have decided he is an asshole for taking so much money from us. SO there (pleasingly childish!!!!)

i think you are both unreasonable, really.

He should have offered to help clean up and perhaps offered to pay for dry cleaning- iit would be polite to at the very least to offer to do the former. Although, if he is strapped for cash maybe he didn't want to offer to pay when he didn't have the money to do so. I can understand why you might be a bit narked he didn't.

YABU too though. Yes, he accepted payment for your dog damaging his jeans after it attacked him but I think it's a bit different TBH. You know your dog bites and did not take reasonable steps to control it and thus prevent anything untoward happening (telling people not to run around your dog and/or shouting at someone not to run is not, iMHO, controlling your dog). So it was negligence on your part which led to your ex-friend being attacked by your dog and it is only right that you paid to replace his jeans (although I agree it is a ridiculous amount to spend on jeans if you really are skint, but that's another matter entirely!). He would have been within his rights to take the matter further.

An accident leading to damage is not on a par with your negligence with regard to the dog, although I know you feel it wasn't accidental as it was caused by his child and can see where you are coming from, although don't entirely agree. I would tend to view a small child having a temper tantrum and throwing something (especially at what sounds like a busy gathering when they can get a bit wound up) as an accident- although clearly an accident caused by bad behaviour. I think this is because I very much doubt the child intended the wine to be knocked over or could be expected to have foreseen this as a potential outcome- similar to an adult accidentally knocking something over when not looking properly, for example. But, again, that's my view and I accept others would say that as child behaved badly, it is the parents responsibility to rectify any problems caused by their child's behaviour and can see that as a valid viewpoint. In similar circumstances, I would probably chalk it down to experience and I wouldn't be having red wine, young children and dogs around very expensive upholstery and curtains that I wanted to stay that way! I really wouldn't want my guests to pay for accidental damage, but I accept that others might.

I wonder if you liked him more, would you still feel the same way about the whole thing?

Jacks, I think if I liked him more I would feel differently but I would still be surprised that he didn't take any responsibility for his child especially as he (rightly) held me responsible for my dog. I think if a normal adult knocked a glass of red wine accidentally they would try to help clean up and offer to pay for any damage. I know I would.

I have said before that I am not precious about the curtains etc and I know they may well take a few hits BUT I would never treat someone ELSE'S possessions so lightly.

Believe me, I won't be having this guy and his kid round again and the dog will stay in peace with people who know how to behave around him.

His instinct to protect his daughter overrode his knowledge that the dog would chase despite all of us roaring at him to stop stop STOP.

You have this dog in a home where there are children? Madness.

He did apologise but made no move to help clean up, sent his 3 year old to say sorry to me and advised us to get it dry cleaned

Could this not have been him offering to pay? He told you to get it dry cleaned. So I'd take that as an offer tbh. It might not have been explicit but in the circumstances he was possibly a bit flustered. I'd text him 'we couldn't get the stains out so well be getting them dry cleaned as you offered. Can we send you the bill?'

If you're going to distance yourself anyway what have you to lose?

Any normal, decent person would immediately scramble to their knees, run and get a cloth/detergent/white wine and ask how best to help clean it up, and be visably mortified. Then say" if this doesn't come off, please let me know and Ill get i pay for it to be dry cleaned".
Because he failed to do any of this I would seriously text and let him know how much the dry cleaning came to, as the fury at his lame arsed attitude would build up in me and I'd hate myself for being such a walk over.
Minty, please at east ask for half, or text him and just say " re. sat thanks for suggestion of the dry cleaning, it came to ££ and it worked! ..." and leave it at that, to at least see if there is any decency in him whatsoever.

I think there's an element of social ritual involved in joining in with the cleaning up. Women tend to understand that making a token effort to contribute to sorting the problem, even when there are people competently on the case, shows an acknowledgement of their part in the problem. Men often don't get that and apply purely rationalist principles:'There were plenty of ppeople already', 'I might only make it worse' etc. I've had moments where I've been surprised by my husband not making an effort to join in with resolving a problem partly created by our children, even when that joining in would be token at best because someone else had the problem well in hand. I'd jump up automatically because I have learnt it's part of the social dance that says 'I'm like you. I understand the impact of what has happened here. I want to bear my part in resolving it'. But men often haven't learnt those rules, or don't see the logic to following them. So I wouldn't be too hard on the man for not joining in the cleaning up. If he said sorry, suggested a solution and made his daughter apologise, that may have felt sufficient to him. I agree he should have offered to pay for the dry cleaning; it's up to you to decide if you have the will to demand it. A good line is 'I felt sure you'd want to pay for this so this is the bill.'

Believe me, I won't be having this guy and his kid round again

Amen. He does not sound nice.

But men often haven't learnt those rules, or don't see the logic to following them.

I must be a man then

I would have offered to pay, or clear up if I was one of the first few, but I wouldn't scramble to pretend to clear something up if several others happened to get there first.

I just don't know if I want to ask him for the money. It's the principle of it that has annoyed me and I think it would be a very uncomfortable conversation considering how strapped I know they are. He has now dropped off something called "Wineaway" (doesn't work) and sent a text saying "So sorry for the spilt wine, let me know if we can do anything more to clean the cushion and curtain". I don't think that is an offer to pay.

For those STILL wittering on about the dog, for the last time, I haven't asked for any opinion in the dog. Please stop going on about the dog. 🐕

I don't think you can liken a child accidentally knocking over a glass of wine, to a dog attack!

Sigh. It's about how you do or do not take responsibility afterwards. Not whether the two things are the same (which I didn't say).

In the dog case your friend was lucky to get away uninjured and was probably very shaken. Taking responsibility could quite reasonably be taken to include having the dog destroyed.HD probably thinks you still.owe him! If it had gone to court he would have very likely some the money for his trousers.
The other situation was a genuine mistake with. contributory negligence of drinking red wine near pale.soft furnishings with small children about
You have insurance for this.

I actually see why the OP did bring doggate into this, think any of us would probably still be thinking about his and its parallels, however different the specifics of the situation.

Minty, what will you respond to his text? I would still say- its ok, but I had to have them dry cleaned so hoping ti all comes out".... and at least see if he offers, but then refuse his money.

OP: I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure your friend could not have insisted your dog be put down as your dog was on your own property. Ignore all those insisting your dog should be put down. Your children clearly know how to behave around the dog, as should their friends if they come over. Knowing how to behave around dogs is something all children should be aware of.
Re this friend... Why is he still your friend, or rather, why are you still his friend?!
£300 for a pair of Diesel jeans...he was taking the mick.
I would have no hesitation (in the circumstances) in asking him to cover the cost of dry cleaning.

Ha ha! I admit, I didn't say it but I had an image in my head of your friend holding out his trouser leg as he ran past your dog in the hopes it would give chase, latch on and rip them so he could wangle a new pair out of you!
I have no time for mean people. Meanness is such an unattractive trait.

Though I didn't realise your friend was strapped for cash so... I guess he bought his fancy jeans when he was better off financially.
Sounds like he's trying, though you should maybe say you think you'll have to get them dry-cleaned and see if he stumps up....even a contribution...

I would want some expression of regret that was more than apologising, but I probably wouldn't accept money to have them dry-cleaned if offered.

He does not sound sorry enough through his inaction.

You think he's an ass because he asked for 300 euros when your dog attacked him. And you feel he now somehow "owes" you to pay for an accident.

He probably thinks you're an ass because you have a dog that attacks in your home while there are small children about. Posters are going on about the dog because he's done you a massive favour by not calling the police. So no. Don't bill him. Because he can still alert someone you have a dog that has previously attacked left unsupervised amongst small children.

WOOF! Enough!!

For those not banging on about the dog, thanks for not totally missing the point of my question. I will reply that the curtains are in the dry cleaners and I am hoping they can sort them out. I'm not going to ask him for a contribution and if he offers I will say no thank you.

He is part of a larger group of friends and that is really the only reason we see him. I am going to quietly phase him out a bit, enough that I won't have to see much of him but not so much that it makes it awkward. There are some events we always do as a group so it is inevitable he will be there but no more invitations to our house.

Schmoo I agree that people should know how to behave around a dog. 🐩

I think YABU. The incident with your dog is relevant in that it could have been a lot worse and was caused by negligence on your part and you should never put others' in harms way like that, just telling people not to run doesn't cut it into. So you did get off lightly there and I think you owe him one. Ok so you replaced his jeans and I do see the comparison you are drawing but actually, you were responsible for that damage and for the presumably scary experience it must have been. Replacing the jeans the right thing to do. Not the same as damage caused accidentally by a child having a strop in which nobody was in any danger.
Also don't get people saying 'why does he have expensive jeans', very judgemental. For one thing they might have been a gift or a one off treat for himself...or should people who aren't well off only be allowed to shop in Primark?

If the child had purposely picked up the glass of wine and poured it down your curtains it would be different. This was an accident.

You purposely have a dog where a father cannot run to help when he perceives his child is in danger for fear of being attacked by the dog in the process. The dog attack would not be an accident, it would be negligence on your part. How can you be sure no child makes the same mistake and runs around this dog? Utter madness.