To cringe at the phrase "England isn't England anymore"

[Sounddofsilence]

Said by a friend.

Another one sounded off about Easter Eggs now being called Chocolate Eggs so not to offend people because it was on the news!

Argh!

it's not England anymore, of course it isn't.

We have changed as a society and england doesn't really exist anymore.

It's only a problem afaik when people are racist and/or look for the negatives all the time.
As far as the old England is concerned that went in the 60's with high immigration.
We have to include all faiths, belief, societal norms and races now.

Your friend who works in Tesco is telling lies.

It is disheartening how downright rude these threads always become. I imagine lurkers quietly reading that their views make them "terminally thick" and so on, will feel rather under attack and maybe they'll become more entrenched in their view.

If posters are so convinced that a certain view is wrong-headed, wouldn't it be better to calmly explain why?

Or is it ALL about performing the most vituperative virtue-signalling possible?

To be fair when racism and xenephobia is put out there its fine to call it, fine to object to it, and yes fine to do so in a brusque manner as it is not acceptable.

*It is disheartening how downright rude these threads always become. I imagine lurkers quietly reading that their views make them "terminally thick" and so on, will feel rather under attack and maybe they'll become more entrenched in their view.8

That's up to them, I'm not an evangelist.
If you post stupid, ill thought out, borderline racist crap just because someone has told you about it, with no desire to research it for yourself, then be prepared to be labelled thick. No problem with that.

I don't think that approach wins hearts and minds lurked.

And I don't actually believe that all immigration-scepticism (if that's what this is about) is racist. Futile, yes. Wrong side of history, definitely. But sometimes more inspired by economic or social concerns or just by sheer culture shock.

I don't see that personal insults help anything there.

No, I also have my own concerns about mass immigration. Coherent arguments I'll debate, but bullshit about Easter Eggs? Forget it.
I really don't care about winning heart and minds either, I'm not trying to occupy Iraq.

You can think what you like.

Most if not all immigration sceptiscism is based on a lack of understanding and a fear of the other, mostly by ignorance.

When economic research says that immigration has more economic benefits than costs, that even if we send all immigrants home the impact would be deterimental because of the fall in tax reciepts and the subsequent fall in demand on services wouldn't be sufficient to balance this..

www.ucl.ac.uk/news/news-articles/1114/051114-economic-impact-EU-immigration

Thats one study to link to, there are more. Hearts and minds don't seem to be won by logical, evidence based argument so ridicule seems to be the way to go.

Not at all lurked. I'm calling it aggressive despite being - I hesitate to say 'your' - the pro-immigration, lefty, progressive side of the fence myself.

Because It is aggressive and I'll/mannered and it doesn't help.

Well quite. You identify lack of understanding as a cause. So address it with your understanding of the facts.

We have changed as a society and england doesn't really exist anymore.

It does for me. I can think of English things such as strawberries and cream, warm beer, Wimbledon, cricket on the village green, Bobby Moore and so on. Doesn't mean to say I partake of any of them, but they are there, just as I'm sure Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish people can think of things that symbolise their nations but don't set it aspic (which is very English btw but makes me shudder).

There's also a shorthand for Britain - red buses, phone boxes and pillar boxes, policeman's tit helmets, queueing, rainy bank holidays - like today. That doesn't mean you can't enjoy other things in Britain or we can't add them.

I take umbridge with it and will call it out when I see it

Many of the comments here are thinly vailed racism and it needs to be pointed out. It also needs to be pointed out that when you say things like "England isn't England" you are showing massive ignorance and it should be called out.

Sorry, but the only way to stop it is to stand up to it and show it for the stupidity that it is, softly softly is not the way to go.

Sorry, but the only way to stop it is to stand up to it and show it for the stupidity that it is, softly softly is not the way to go.

Totally agree with you.

I do wish someone would explain what's so good about warm beer

It is quite possible to live in Muslim countries for years and years and years and still be racist. Apparently.

Its nice infront of a warm fire on a cold day, and has taste!

It pains me to have to point out that the amusing clip with the Muslamic moron at the EDL rally was made by Press TV, which is a propaganda channel of the Iranian Government, and is thoroughly disreputable as well as being absolute shite.

Does anyone doubt that a television company could go to Iran and find a similar slackjawed fuckwit to mouth off slowly about Christians or Jews?

I say that because I am English, and a sense of fair play runs in my blood

So Scotland and Wales aren't the same as England then
Why single out one country out of the 4 that make up the UK
So the Scots, Welsh and Irish are not indigenous either hmm
perhaps you should all be condemning 'Britain isn't Britain any more'

this...personally, i find is still quite Walesy, though. so maybe its different the other side of the Severn.

"Thats one study to link to, there are more. Hearts and minds don't seem to be won by logical, evidence based argument so ridicule seems to be the way to go."

That study refers to immigration from within the EU.

The figures for non EU immigrants would be very different. Just look at Sweden and Denmark for examples.

Limited.. they do find wallys to film on CNN/BBC/Fox etc, all those prats that burn USA flags etc, just as much propaganda.

The attacks in Sweeden and Demark are not fair to use as examples because they tend to be rare (thats why they make the news).

Oh it's an EDL moron that I sound like,is it? I knew I was right not to click

Whats more is we don't see on our news Western sex tourims, human rights abuses by western soldiers, we call civillian dead "colleteral damage" etc.

Still doesn't pull back from the fact that using a lot of these arguments is racist.

Well if you say: "England isn't England anymore" you do. Sorry :)

I wasn't talking about the attacks in Sweden and Denmark. Non EU citizens there (and all across Europe ) have a higher unemployment rate. Of those, more than half are long term unemployed. Therefore that type of immigration does not contribute to their host societies and is in fact a drain on resources due to the amount paid to them in unemployment and other benefits. Those are facts. link here