to ask if some drivers really do have this opinion about motorcyclists?

[Shinyredbike]

I ride a bike. A shiny red one in fact

I'm a member of a biker group/page thing on FB and came across a rather nasty post, it was a screenshot of someone ranting about motorcyclists and how irresponsible they are, how they should grow up and get a car and stop messing around on their toys (bikes).

He also suggested that it wasn't his responsibility to look out for bikers when he is driving, as the adverts suggest you should, and that bascially if you ride a bike its your own fault if you get injured or killed as you shouldn't be on a bike in the first place.

Now, obviously this particular guy was a prick but is his view actually quite representative of a lot of drivers? Ok they might not say it so harshly but actually I do think, from the conversations I've had with car drivers that a lot of them do seem to feel this way.

I know a lot of bikers do ride like twats and obviously they shouldn't, and I can't blame car drivers who dislike bikers who act this way but aibu to wonder if some drivers really do just inherently dislike bikers even when they don't ride like twats?

Fwiw, I don't ride like a twat, I don't speed, overtake stupidly or filter when I shouldn't. Actually I don't really filter at all because in most cases I don't feel safe doing it but I've had some pretty harsh comments directed at me just because I prefer bikes over cars, as if I am some sort of idiot with a death wish!

I think motorcycles are great, and would LOVE to have one of my own... but they do make me nervous when I'm driving. They're just less predictable than car drivers to me. I'm a good judge of what other cars will do on the road, when they're going to overtake, if they're going to turn off (even before they start signaling often) etc, but bikers do a lot more weaving about within the lane and it's harder to predict what they're going to do, and when they're going to go for it!
Even though I'm super aware that they're there, because I do check my mirrors... they just make me nervous and I would really rather they were ahead of me on the road.

I do (bi)cycle also whenever I can get away with it, and find cyclists pretty predictable... maybe it all becomes clear once you take up motorcycling!

Magrat, I also find that those kind of bikers are the ones that refuse to give me 'the nod' and then sneer at me because I'm 'only' on a small bike At the end of the day we are all bikers no matter how many cc's you have! I ride on my small bike all year round and virtually every day, wind, rain, snow, the lot, because I just like being on a bike - the feeling when you go smoothly round a nice corner is awesome!

"How could you not hear a bike "doing 70+" approaching, just out of interest?"

Well, I'm almost deaf in one ear, and with the windows closed air conditioning on and lanes with very thick trees, you can't hear it when it's around a corner.

I think a lot of motorcyclists do drive irresponsibly weaving in and out of traffic and generally going too fast. Then again a lot of car drivers are reckless too. There was an accident near us recently where the inquest revealed the rider was doing 106 mph when he crashed into a tractor. Sorry but yes in my honest opinion a lot of them do appear to drive recklessly.

I have to say, I ride 300+ miles a week for work (a bit more than 15000 miles per year) and have never seen motorbikes going between two cars driving at 70mph on the motorway. In fact, over winter I've rarely seen other bikes (apart from police riders) in the road at all. I have seen (and experienced) plenty of cars trying to move into my lane on motorways and dual carriageways whilst I was still overtaking though. In fact, I had one this morning, who I would have reported had my camera not been out of batteries.

The best and safest option is NOT to try and block them, but allow them to get through as safely as possible. Often the view of the road is different on a bind to in the car. You sit higher up and you don't have those stupid beams blocking half the view.

My uncle and my husband have both been involved in serious bike accidents. My uncle was involved in 2. In all cases, the car driver was to blame and neither were riding recklessly. The first accident of my uncle was witnessed by an off-duty police rider though, which was lucky because the woman who knocked him off and tried to leave him for dead attempted to lie and say he was speeding. He wasn't, as the police could verify.

I don't very often see reckless motorcyclists on motorways in fairness. They're all pretty sensible. It's only on the lanes that they appear to be knobs. I don't know why though.

On the filtering thing - I've always wondered:

1. If you filter through slow moving traffic, then get to a bit where you can't get past - a lorry, say - is it part of the filtering that you're then allowed to pull into a space, taking up a full 'car' space (rather than being alongside, IYSWIM, not implying that road space is only for cars)? Only it feels to me as a car driver, like queue jumping, and while I never ever stop motorbikes from doing it, it does irritate the crap out of me as I often have to brake to let a bike in that's just sailed past me.
2. On the filtering by going in between opposing lanes of traffic, is it normal to ride in the opposing lane? I.e. You're overtaking a stream of traffic travelling the same way as you; the other lane is clear, so you use it. When a car comes towards you in the oncoming lane, is it accepted that because you're committed, that car has to slow/pull over to avoid you? There's one stretch of road near me where this seems to be the rule, and it seems counter intuitive.

I find it very frustrating when I see one in my rear view mirror and then over the space of the next few miles they're switching between left wing mirror, right wing mirror and rear view mirror randomly. It does make them a lot harder to keep an eye on. Plus the loud loud loud engine and revving thing are frustrating. I know "think bike" is important but it's a two way street.

I drive, cycle and ride a horse so I know there are complete bellends in each demographic...

Fwiw I personally really hate the stupidly loud exhaust thing, I know its partially supposed to be a safety thing so drivers can hear you coming but I just find it annoying and it hurts my ears. I've heard many riders suggest that you wear hearing protection (ie earplugs) otherwise you risk long term hearing damage from it but this seems dangerous to me as you won't be able to hear what is going on around you.

I've always wondered about the filtering thing too tbh, which is why I rarely do it. I can't see more than a few cars ahead of me so if I filter and then there is no where for me to pull in are cars obligated to let me in? I always worry that they won't and I'll be left in a dangerous position :/ Which is why I don't even consider filtering unless there are 2 lanes or I can do so without crossing over into the oncoming lane, I just feel its too risky but then maybe I just haven't had enough practise at doing it.

Humpty, as a biker you should only start filtering having identified a safe spot to pull back into the traffic if necessary. As a car driver you do have an obligation to let the bike back in again, since filtering is a form of overtaking, and you are also supposed to facilitate safe completion of overtaking manoeuvres whether carried out by bikes, cars, white vans of whatever. It is not reasonable to put someone's life at risk to save your 2 inches of tarmac and the space is not a "car" space by the way. How ridiculous!

MrsMorton, it is necessary to move around the lane more on a bike. This is to increase visibility into bends and also to avoid debris, diesel which are not a problem for cars, but can be fatal for bikes. It's not "weaving" it's using the road appropriately for bikes. I have to say, I agree with many of the police riders I've spoken to who say they think drivers should ride bike for a couple of years before being given a car licence.

I would say though that many more bikers have completed post test training than car drivers, which in itself says a lot.

Shiney ear plugs don't block out all sounds, only certain frequencies. They are not intended to block out the sound of the engine (which can help tell you where you are in an appropriate gear etc), but do block out wind noise, which can be significant and therefore help increase concentration.

the space is not a "car" space by the way.
The main problem is that it's not 2 inches but thr safety distance we keep to the car in front. It's annoying and dangerous when someone pulls (offen suddenly) into that space.

When you're in a queue of traffic doing 50 on an A road and you're tonguing my exhaust pipe, you don't need improved visibility around bends and you couldn't spot diesel on the road anyway. Just saying...

You can't tailgate and then say you're being deliberately difficult to monitor in the interests of improving your own survivability.

I don't tailgate MrsMorton and yes, I can spot diesel on the road, having done significant post test training. Just saying...

tonguing my exhaust pipe -

That'll be the same safety distance when you're 4x4 is 2 inches from by back wheel when I'm doing the speed limit would it?

*your not you're. Stupid tablet.

If that comment about safe distance was to me it's, let's say... silly, not only because I don't drive a 4x4 but I keep my safe distance from all road users as much as possible.
The truth is that most lane switchers often insert themselves in spaces that are safe distances kept between vehicles. That space is not for the twats who want to change lanes. It's to avoid crashes.
When they do push into that space it causes the vehicle to break more suddenly and thus increase the likelihood of a crash behind and also tends to create or worsen queues.

Filtering is not switching lanes and pleased to hear you are one of the small minority of drivers who keep a 2 second safety gap when driving at normal speed (I do too, for info and increase the gap further if someone starts tailgating). I very very rarely see people keeping anything even close to a 2 second gap these days and there is certainly no consideration for the fact that bikes slow considerably faster than cars from the tailgaters I experience almost every day.

I always let motorcycles go ahead. I don't see it as queue jumping at all. I don't know why as I get pissed of if car drivers queue jump. I suppose it's because letting a bike through won't slow me up and I'm happier when they are ahead of me.

It's just the done thing isn't it? It's like being extra considerate when large vehicles want to change lanes.

This pretty much sums it up.

yes Bitchy that's about it. I ride a , drive and used to ride a 650cc. Driving skills boosted massively by learning to ride a bike. Esp. observations and politeness. Moany-arsed drivers piss me off a lot.

If you filter by going between cars and switch lanes only when there definitely is enough space is fine.
It is annoying when I'm going at a steady pace in a queue keeping a safe distance and then someone just inserts themselves there. It doesn't delay my overall journey, but as I explained earlier it's dangerous for themselves, those behind them and can affect the flow of traffic.

Once, many years ago I was on my way to work in a city centre, on my first bike, a 305cc Kawasaki. I'd filtered through some stationary traffic to the front of a queue at some traffic light where a motorist in a car had kindly left almost a car's length space behind the solid white line. So I stopped there, near the centre line, in front of and to the right of the car Said motorist then shunted me forward and shouted at me to fuck off cos she got there first

Also on this commute, Id have to travel along a one way street. This street had three lanes. There were roads off it on each side. I needed to either be in the centre or right hand lane, as eventually I had to turn right.

I hated using the right hand lane. But why? I hear you ask. Because every day without fail, someone in a car would try and make a right turn across me from the centre lane. Not a lane change, a right turn. Usually without indicating. Certainly without looking.

My experience of motorcyclists is that (sadly), I've witnessed some really irresponsible behaviour, for example - overtaking when it isn't safe to do and then cutting back in at the last minute and driving too quickly.

I fully support the Think Bike campaign, and am always cautious when I see a motorcycle however, riders also have a duty to Think Car as well.