Or are all men like this?

[pando]

Have NC for this one. This weekend DP left his text messaging app open on his laptop & I saw a couple of texts (shouldn't have looked I know, stupid me) that made me uncomfortable. I don't know if I am too sensitive (admittedly I have low self esteem, PND, anxiety) or if this is normal for men. They were to a colleague of his saying "have you seen the new starts? That girl with the dark hair is lovely", then "need to find out who she is", then a few days later saying another colleague had added her on facebook & DP was "jealous". Then I saw he was texting her (no name saved initially so he must have given her his number) with just general chat & now I see they are friends on fbook too. Am I overreacting to be upset about him talking like this about other women? Would love some perspective.

LoveBoursin I don't know if it is a deal breaker. I know I don't like it, it makes me feel awful but I don't know if it is serious enough to do anything drastic about it.

Please don't accept it as something men do. I feel passionately that you should only be with somebody who makes you feel great. You deserve that, you know? You deserve to be with somebody who loves you in a way that allows you to be comfortable with yourself. It is no good sharing your life with somebody who causes you to wonder if you should be making more effort with your appearance to stop them from pursuing other women. Be with somebody who can make you feel like the most beautiful important woman in the world even when you are sick, tired or heavier.

Good men who would never behave in this way exist. Plenty of them.

I'm not against men having friendships with women, but even seemingly innocent friendships can lead to something else - Men also have an easy cover-up excuse if they have affairs with women at work e.g. away at conferences, training, working late etc - apparently it is very common.

I sometimes wonder if I have "let myself go" a bit

Please stop that line of thinking right now. I'm assuming from your mention of PND that you have a young baby - that you are spending most of your time looking after and caring for? Fuck worrying about 'letting yourself go' - any decent man would realise you have more important things on your plate than painting your nails atm.

And to answer your OP, no all men are not like that. I'm happy to say that IME, most men are decent people who do not treat their partners like shit. To suggest that all men are lets the odd twatty one off the hook I think, as if they almost can't help it. They can - and he can. He is an adult (supposedly) with a young family and he needs to grow the fuck up, at the very least.

He is disrespectful at best but from your posts it seems could be actively looking for someone to start something with. You deserve better, and I can't help wondering how much of your anxiety/PND/esteem issues are linked to you putting up with that tosser.

Op this is such a small snap shot of your relationship, your DH may be utterly devoted to you, but a silly flirt?
what do you think?

I would be deeply upset if I came across this, but it would be massively out of character for DH. I have been out with men who have been massive flirts, and it undermined me.

Even if he is madly in love with your but also falling in with stronger character at work...the timing, when you have a baby is so in sensitive.

You know him you know your relationship....

if this happened to me and dh, yes our relationship wuold be on the rocks, but with other ex BF it would be par for the couse.

If you don't do anything about it, he will take it further. He's not a proper "lad" until he's shagged her... You are either an arsehole who joins in or you know how to behave, you can't be both.

(You meaning he!)

Wow you lot hard on men on mumsnet.
All of you talking about cheating it was a few general chat messages to this new girl at work , the op said there is no history of cheating (that she knows of)
All I see is a man talking to a girl from work, ok so he thinks she's hot and what that means he wants to take her to bed? Why can't people be friends with somebody or talk to somebody they think is attractive?

I know I have friends I think yes he's a very good looking guy, do I end up in bed with no them? No I do not. I am a happily married woman but I can still admire a good looking person.

I think the self esteem of the op is a big issue here.

I think the self esteem of the op is a big issue here

No. The big issue here is that the DH knows that his OH hates this kind of behaviour, and chooses to carry on regardless. It's the lack of respect that is the big issue.

BurtMacklimsWife thank you. Needed to hear that as sometimes I don't really believe it. Love your username too.

LaConnerie Thank you too. Funny you say you wonder if my mh issues are linked to putting up with DP's behaviour as I often think my my issues are linked to me being overly sensitive about his behaviour!

What I see is a man with a partner and child who is unusually keen to know who the pretty girls are.

BudsBeginning hard to say really. Previously would have said he's a flirt but wouldn't go any further, but things have been rocky since DS.

He's a creep, his behaviour is NOT OK - it would be a deal breaker for me, I couldn't trust someone who behaved like that. Sorry OP.

I think this is more than flirting, personally. Flirting is something that happens naturally and in person (and is perfectly OK if it doesn't go beyond flirting IMO) - going out of your way to text someone is more than that; it's calculated and deliberate.

Pinkheart interesting perspective. I just posted because the messages made me feel uncomfortable & I wasn't sure how much of that was my crap self esteem talking or whether others would find it hurtful too.

rideme you are right that he knows I wouldn't be comfortable with him saying those things, he is aware of that. I suppose part of why it hurts so much is that he does it anyway.

I wouldn't be madly worried about my DP saying, in conversation with a friend, that a new girl at work was attractive. I might make a similar admiring remark to a friend if an attractive bloke joined my team. I wouldn't be happy about the rest of it, though. It's one thing to make friends with a new colleague in an organic way, but what he has done doesn't sound like that, it sounds like him engineering getting to know her because he fancies her, which would upset me.

Pando IMHO you arenot being over-sensitive at all!

My self esteem is fine but I would be devastated if my DH was sending messages to colleagues about somebody he 'fancies'... To me 'fancying' someone implies an intent to act on a feeling, rather than just thinking 'hmm they're nice' - which we all do sometimes.

Nothing wrong with flirting, but as others have said, harmless flirting happens 'ad hoc', at the time, face to face. Sending flirty messages takes it over the line I think.

My rule is always - would you act that way in front of your partner? And vice versa. He is doing this behind your back, which IMHO makes him a bit of a shit

He's a flirt.

He doesn't care that it upsets you.

He will keep doing it even if he promises to stop because he doesn't really care that it upsets you and thinks you are being unreasonable to ask him to stop.

He's a twat and will not change.

Sorry.

I think behaviour like this, would challenge anyones esteem and mental health

I suppose part of why it hurts so much is that he does it anyway.

Exactly. It's a betrayal. Nobody else can tell you objectively 100% whether his behaviour is right or wrong (though the vast majority here think it's wrong!)

But the fact that he knows how it would make you feel and does it anyway, goes against everything that is the point of being in a loving, equal relationship.

One's self-esteem does tend to suffer when you're being treated poorly

It is really reassuring to know I am not being completely irrational about this. With the last time, the messages about his colleague's friend, he did say a few times he thought I was overreacting. It's hard because so much has changed at once- this new job of his, DS being born, me feeling so crap about myself. It's hard to know what's connected IYSWIM. I am really pleased to hear I am not being over sensitive about this though.

He's definitely always been flirtatious face to face but I don't mind that really as he's like that with everyone, it's just him being friendly

So, he's flirtatious with his 'bantering' lad friends, too, OP? Or is that just reserved for new female colleagues, who are the subject of the banter?

I have several close male friends and a husband who has far more female friends than male - and he works in an insanely macho industry that would make the world of Top Gear look like a meeting of the WI. He still doesn't feel the need to 'keep in with the lads' by doing 'let's perve on the new girl' banter.

Honestly, OP, don't lay any of this at your door for not being as fun and perky-buttocked as you were when you first met. As a previous poster said, you're worth far more than making desperate physical efforts to stop your husband behaving like a drooling schoolboy and competing with the lads to flirt with the new colleague.

Pinkheart, are you not capable of seeing the connection between the OP's bruised self-esteem and the fact of her being married to someone who seems to band together with equally juvenile male colleagues to see female co-workers in terms of some pitiable Hot Or Not paradigm?

Oh Pink come on, this is not just one person noticing the aesthetic qualities of another! He is intentionally pursuing a 'friendship' with her because he likes the way she looks, that's creepy and disrespectful. We all know that humans sometimes find other humans attractive regardless of marital status, that is not a revolutionary viewpoint. I'm sure my DH sees attractive women at work - that's fine, it wouldn't be fine if he was making a fuss about it and telling other people!

Pando You must not settle for feeling like this. I know what it's like, constantly feeling not good enough and wondering what you can do to make yourself enough. I am being completely honest when I say that there IS more than that. There are men, good men, who will make you feel secure enough to love yourself in a way that you didn't know was possible. I'm glad you like my username! Are you a Parks fan? You deserve to be loved like Ben loves Leslie, remember that! 😁

But what do I do? We have our DS. What can I do? I need to make this work for DS

It takes 2 people to make a relationship work. And I wouldnt define "working" as a relationship that involves raising your DS to think its ok to be disrespectful to women. Is that what you want for him?

My ex also said I was 'irrational' and 'jealous' over his online and real-life contact with a girl (I sporadically saw messages that made me uncomfortable). When I flipped out one day and went through his whole chat history, it was clear they were having an emotional affair. The best thing was, he continued to maintain that I was being irrational and jealous even after I confronted him with reams of print outs, where I have neatly labelled and cross-referenced every kind of infidelity in colour-coded highlighter pen.

I was so humiliated I didn't tell anyone. He subsequently told my whole circle of family and friends that I had had an affair!!

I'm recounting this because it's a great example of the way that you NEED to keep some critical distance and have your own perspective on this. Because what he says isn't necessarily a true representation of what's actually going on. The fact is, he knows this behaviour makes you uncomfortable and he continues anyway. Even if it's so-called 'just flirting', that still makes it deeply disrespectful of your thoughts and feelings - and dangerous for the stability of your long term relationship as a consequence.