to post the most middle-class question ever asked on Mumsnet?

[pollyandme]

I'm looking for somewhere in London where I can book a proper massage as a birthday present for my 6yo daughter.

Somewhere "naice".

Can anyone suggest anywhere?

Sorry.
Polly

My two year old will grab our hands at night and try to get us to start rubbing her back, head and legs. My son similarly pleads for back rubs and for us to gently stroke the nape of his neck as he goes to sleep. Both have loved massage since they were babies - most do, which is why baby massage is so popular, as are spas.

No idea why something that feels so nice should be seen as weirdly inappropriate for a kid. DS gets horrible stomach aches from stress and I have wondered about taking him to a natural health clinic for a course of massages - they do chiro and osteo on babies, after all.

OP, I googled as you don't need therapeutic massage, just treat, and Browne's Hotel in Mayfair (which is owned by Rocco Forte) do children's treatments. They would all be safe on a child, very definitely. They also do the best afternoon tea in the Capital - it's expensive, but unlimited on everything (except alcohol, if you opt for that menu). Would depend on how much you want to spend, but frankly we'd spend that combo on taking a kid and a friend to Harry Potter World or Legoland, so not sure why people are so scathing.

Right. Everyone is 'hung up on touch if they think paying strangers to massage your small child is unusual?

That's not quite what was said.

But people have said
it's deranged
it's stupidity
SS would be interested

FWIW no reputable therapist would allow a person to drop of a child for a massage and then head to Waitrose. At that age the parent would be in the same room.
Massage doesn't have to involve taking clothes off
Massage is perfectly natural and normal - EVEN for children
There is a difference between 'asking a stranger' and booking a qualified, experienced professional
Touch has been shown to be essential for young children to thrive

Massage is SO much more than pampering. Good massage can transform lives. Sadly there is a lot of ignorance generally about what massage is and what massage isn't.

Oh, and:

* Treatments are recommended for children aged between 4-16 years. Written consent is required for all treatments and an accompanying adult must be present throughout.

It's hardly a paedophile's charter, is it? "Work here, and spend almost all your time treating adults, with the occasional child... whose parent will stand by your elbow throughout. Those without an enhanced DBS need not apply."

Not sure how some here would handle it if their child ever needed physio.

I was at an inner city farm in east London yesterday and looked at the leaflets on activities nearby - infant massage was there! I thought I'd imagined it but you reminded me.

Well. I only went to the gym (for a class which is the VERY OPPOSITE of a relaxing massage) and all this happened...

So, various points:

1. It hadn't even occurred to me that it would be weird or in any way sexual. I don't find massages at all sexual just really lovely and relaxing. And as for risky in any way, well I full expect to be no more than a couple of feet from her the entire time.

2. My DD just loves having her back rubbed and frankly would get anyone she could convince to do it. Of course she likes Mummy doing it, but I know the difference between a professional massage and one my mate might do. The bonding aspect will be different here as it;s a special outing for her and Mummy (which as a single mum rarely happens).

3. As for middle class v chavvy, it was meant lightheartedly, and I honestly don't know or care where I sit on the working class v chavvy v middle class spectrum . It struck me as a particularly frivolous and unnecessary expense which I want to do anyway, and somewhere that looks and smells naice. Thus, I thought, ridiculously, stereotypically MC.

4. I think quinoa is disgusting but I do know how to pronounce it.

5. It's term time so nail varnish and whatnot would have to be taken off the following evening. There would be WW3. Thus nails not an option. And anyway, it's massages she likes.

6. In amongst it all, there were some lovely suggestions and a heartfelt thank you as I'm going to look now - CowShed, Neals Yard and a place in Mayfair that also does cream teas. I'll see what those are like and what I can afford.

7. I posted in AIBU as I couldn't think where else to put it, and also that some lighthearted banter about how ridiculously I was spoiling my child might be amusing.

8. I think you're all ace anyway. I've been away from MN for a bit - but it's nice to know you lot haven't changed a bit.

Px

sleep don't you know that Browne's of Mayfair is the HEIGHT of chavdom? I mean, you can't move for glittery iPhone cases and tooth gems.

Why is massage ok for adults but not children? It implies there is something indecent about it.
Do people really think that most people (including therapists ) are not to be trusted? how long do you think you could get away with being an indecent therapist before you were arrested!

I understand some adults don't like being touched by other people, but that doesn't mean that kids don't. This is something that is learnt rather than a natural human instinct.

Yes a massage for a little girl is slightly weird no place would offer pamper sessions like that I don't think

A friend's child (4) went to a 5 year old's pamper party where the kids were offered facials!

I would be a bit worried about letting another adult touch my child like that

However, each to their own but I would feel VERY uncomfortable allowing this for a child

Like what? What is there to be uncomfortable about? What do you think a massage actually is?
Some of you people are seriously odd.

@ Pollyandme for mature, measured, and generous response to thread.

Great response Pollyandme. I also applaud your last post.

Aaah Polly, you sound great! What a lovely idea - I would love to have the chance to take my daughter out for a treat and a cream tea!

As for the people carping on about chavviness - firstly, the middle class comment was clearly light-hearted, secondly there is nothing more déclassé and suggestive of social insecurity then sneering at something harmless that makes someone happy.

Polly, I don't see anything weird or inappropriate about this. Mt 6 y o would love it

Oh and italiangreyhound you do sound lovely, but frankly I have two lovely but demanding daughters, a business to run, a mortgage, a tricky ex-husband, a loony mother and a complicated love life.

So I'm not really in the best place to take on a third child right now.

But if that changes I'll ABSOLUTELY let you know.

And thanks for the

Is she especially stressed?

Pamper party for a seven year old? FFS!whatever happened to musical bumps, trifle and the Hokey Cokey??

Hear, hear! God, I'd have been bored shitless at one of those at the age of 7, kids must have more sitting down power than the 7 year olds I know!
Let kids be kids, and not mini adults. Makes me a bit thinking about it.
Bring on the hokey cokey and then the sleeping lions

My friends and I loved getting those little packet facials from Superdrug and slicing up cucumbers for our eyes. Does anyone else remember VO5 hot oils?

We used to have little 'pamper sessions' on some Saturday evenings.

We also loved party games and everything else your typical 7/8 year old would enjoy.

I don't see the problem here at all.

sleep don't you know that Browne's of Mayfair is the HEIGHT of chavdom?

I can't say I spend any time whatsoever fretting about the class signifiers involved in activities I take the kids to, as long as they enjoy them. Tad twee and Hyacinth Buckety to do that, IMO. Nothing more redolent of social insecurity really, is there?

My DD just loves having her back rubbed and frankly would get anyone she could convince to do it.

Boundaries, please. Not happy with the 'anyone she could convince' thing you have going on with that. Boundaries in all things.

This is like those mums who take their dds for pole dancing classes because the girls just LOVE pole dancing. Then they post the vids on youtube. Boundaries, people, boundaries.

It's not the same at allkawliga. It's a backrub.

Not everyone comes from the perspective of "any and all touching = sexual".

That pole dancing analogy is nonsense,it's not even on the same planet.

I very much doubt OP's DD is going up to strangers in the street and asking for backrubs, nor that she would be happy with some random walking up in the street and doing it. It is more than likely OP used that as a turn of phrase, not literally.

Stop jumping to your over sexualized conclusions. Get a grip.

Why don't you phone the physiotherapy department of your local maternity hospital, ask them for the contact details of the baby massage teacher and have a class with her with your dd. That way your dd gets a massage, and you learn how to do it.

Book cream tea separately.

Soneone on my fb recently had a pamper party for her 5 yo. She posted pics of her beautiful DD with her gorgeous curls straightened and having her nails done. Her "friends" were her older sister and her friends. They were having a good time. The little girl whose party it was supposed to be looked as if she was going to burst into tears. On every single photo.
The mum actually commented
"Well she doesn't really like that sort of thing, but she's a little princess and needs to learn to take care of her appearance. She can't run around in mud forever"

She's 5 ffs! She can run around in mud as much as she likes!

But, if it's something your child would genuinely enjoy then I don't see the harm in having a little pamper session. I think the massage thing is a bit far, not many people do children's massages.

No, I don't generally allow DD to approach strangers in the street to ask for back rubs. Y'know, not unless I'm REALLY busy.

And she's having a proper old fashioned birthday party with cake etc.the following day. It's not with the Hokey Cokey and charging around though as she's not a child who enjoys boisterous noisy games. So they're making and decorating paper mâché picture frames - because she adores crafts.

By which I mean, I'm not projecting my own likes/preferences onto her and doing this because I enjoy it, (or indeed give her a birthday party which fits what I think a 6yo party should be), but trying to give her a gift which is something I know she loves. Literally, actually: "what would you like for your birthday DD?" "A back rub for A WHOLE DAY Mummy!" (I was rubbing her back at the time admittedly.)

And god knows we don't need any more 'stuff' in our (tiny) home.

Also, they're not mutually exclusive are they? You can jump in puddles and do the Hokey Cokey AND allow them to have a pampery thing too, if that's what they enjoy.

But I'm less keen on make-up and sparkly nail varnish on little ones than I am about a wholesome, feel-good, massage. Not anti, especially, if it's what your child likes, but it's a bit early to I still the idea that to be pretty you need to do stuff to your face/hair.

And no, she's not especially stressed, but she is very sensitive. And we've had a tough few months.

Px

Why is massage perceived as an 'adult only' activity? It's fine to massage babies and over 18's but not children?

Massage has many benefits. It's much more beneficial than having nails done and hair curled, but it is getting compared to that and pole dancing. It's not even close to the same kind of activity.

Massage has been shown to improve, in children, the symptoms of asthma, arthritis, stress and anxiety, headaches, sleep problems and also children with ADHD and autism have had improved behaviour as a result of massage.

But thats not to say massage has to be used when there is a problem - if someone enjoys it, no matter what their age, why shouldn't they get a massage? Even if there isn't a problem, it will still be beneficial - massage works to aid the physical, the mental and the emotional.

Op, great response. And I hope (although I don't expect) that this thread has helped to educate even just one person a little bit about what massage is - and what massage isn't.