To think volunteers prepared to work for free can be very damaging

[feellikeahugefailure]

Just that really. If there are large numbers of people prepared to work for free for certain jobs it really suppresses the wages in that industry and people get used to having (armature) labour for free so wont pay for it.

Anyone else finding this?

My rural school 1980 used to get creates of books sent from the library service - they'd swap them over every term. But the books belonged to the local library service. We didn't physically go there but used the service.

Last rural town I was in all the nearby local schools did a trip to the local library with younger DC - all got the signed up with the library service - and that was done despite my DC school having a really well stocked school library.

The library facilities sound different to where we are. The local school schools do not use libraries and that is the same for outlying rural communities as well. The libraries are no further away in many cases than the job centre. On balance with those issues it would be depend on location as to whether the library is used which is a lottery and not in my view a basis for keeping them open when the taxes could be better allocated. re purchases and bills the vast majority of people have phones and can access free wifi from other sources.
In an ideal world I would love the libraries to be open so that all can access them ,but the cuts now mean that other essential services are being cut and therefore I think that libraries are a lower priority

How do school children get access to books in your area ponty?

I volunteered locally to be a friend to an allocated, isolated oap.

I was told in no uncertain terms that I would absolutely not be getting a work reference for at least six months as they knew people only applied to get work experience.

Patronising in extremis - my qualifications piss on any voluntary work - but I found it sad that people were volunteering just so they could get a paid job, and not because they wanted to make an oap's week a little brighter.

There is no dedicated job centre in my local town. Guess where it is?

Gracekelly your experience shows how you're damned either way. Get voluntary work if your unemployed. Good idea in theory. But ask for a reference? You have to show comittment for six months. People can't wait that long for a reference. Just a weird attitude.

They use school books

On balance with those issues it would be depend on location as to whether the library is used which is a lottery and not in my view a basis for keeping them open when the taxes could be better allocated.

It's a local government service funded by local government money so it makes sense it varies surely as different councils prioritise different services hopeful according to local need ?

Though I'm not sure what requirement central government places to provide the service.

I suppose area I grew up in - the library used some of their money to have a wide range of books to lend to the schools giving the schools access to a wider range - rather than each individual school having to buy a reduced range with money from school budgets.

It seems an efficient way of running a service to me - and there may have been price reductions with bulk buying available. Mind you it was a troy run council notoriously hard to get money out of so efficiency would have been high priory - I wondering if they can afford to run the service at all now.

I don't think it is inappropriate in the cade that Gracekelly describes. It's a befriending service for the elderly - not at all appropriate to have people dipping in and out as volunteers to have something to put on their cv.

Granted the local government chooses how to allocate money but the physical location has a huge impact. On balance I think the libraries do not benefit the public, reduced opening hours means that the very people who fund them via tax can't access them.

It's hard to understand your argument. If they provide no benefit, why do people use them? There is nothing stopping libraries opening well into the evening (our central library does) if someone is willing to pay to do so and I've never known a library that wasn't open on a Saturday.

So all schoolchildren have access to a wide range of reading material? Not just "school books", ie the reading scheme? I cannot believe on Mumsnet I am defending the wider use of libraries. I think that for some, just because something doesn't benefit them, they can't see the point. How depressing.

I am not saying libraries are of no benefit but that given the lack of government funds this is a low priority. The location of a library does have an impact on the use, in many areas the library hours have been cut so much that if you have work in traditional hours you cannot access them very much at all Saturday morning tends to be the exception.

I think any service where you're forming a relationship with isolated and vulnerable people should insist on a minimum volunteering commitment.

In addition the library cuts have affected the hours when most people are at work, therefore the very people who pay the taxes can't use them.

There are many tax payers who don't work 9 to 5 - shift and night workers, pt workers all pay tax, home worker or office workers who can nip out at lunch or finish early once in a while to access. Plus many people retired people who paid taxes all their lives, and still pay council taxes as well as children of tax payers who use libraries. So idea of tax payer not benefiting - is odd.

Plus many libraries open open Saturday or one evening late.

If I was being cynical I wonder if the reduction in the quality and availability of the service was an attempt to reduce access and demand so in a little while it can be claimed that it's not a worthwhile service to keep going because demand is not there and there would be fewer regular users around to object.

After second world war - we had debt loans it took 2006 to pay off - bombed out cities massive shortage of food, housing industries destroyed and geared to war - we didn't close down public libraries we set up the welfare state.

It's hard looking round to think we are in a worse position than then - after all we found the money to bail out the banks and bomb Syria. Though I agree local council face some unpalatable choices for funding priories.

I think that for some, just because something doesn't benefit them, they can't see the point. How depressing.

One of my Children's GP was being telling me we can't afford libraries any more - in response to mention of possible reducing hours in our local - then read their local paper where their library was being closed and not ten minutes later was saying they'd be writing letters and marching to stop it. Turns out it was a temporary closure as they did some building work - but it was fine in our part of UK but not where they live. Sadly an attitude I'm increasing encountering.

Ha. Saw this today:
terribleminds.com/ramble/2016/02/18/scream-it-until-their-ears-bleed-pay-the-fucking-writers/
I know the conversation has moved on, but I'm still boggled that I didn't know.