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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To find this poster in a train station wrong?

781 replies

megadude · 15/02/2016 16:43

Hi Mumsnetters,

I'd be interested to read your opinions about this poster. I don't want to say right now what I think about it, as I'd like to know how you'd interpret it.

TIA,
Megadude

To find this poster in a train station wrong?
OP posts:
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8
usual · 15/02/2016 17:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BertrandRussell · 15/02/2016 17:31

"So am I victim blaming if I teach DD not to drink so much she becomes incapacitated? Not to get separated from her friends or to leave any of her friends on their own? Not to walk through dodgy parts of town? Not to leave her drink unattended in a venue? To only get licensed taxis and not accept lifts from strangers?"

But don't you teach your sons the same?

FayKorgasm · 15/02/2016 17:31

Theres a fairly nifty poster I posted one pg1.

gooseberryroolz · 15/02/2016 17:35

If there is only one poster and that poster only features women, then clearly that is iffy. But we don't know that.

ouryve · 15/02/2016 17:37

It's the fact that it's only women in that picture that rankles for me.

Is there a men's version? Men do some bloody stupid things when drunk and put themselves in untold danger.

maamalady · 15/02/2016 17:37

OP did actually say that she'd seen no corresponding poster with pictures of men.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 15/02/2016 17:39

All posters like this do is shift blame onto the victims, not the perpetrators.

Treats · 15/02/2016 17:40

One of London's most prolific rapists was a black cab driver. Always worth reminding people of that when they say you should get a taxi if you don't want to get raped.

mommy2ash · 15/02/2016 17:41

While people rightly will proclaim it's the rapists fault. Would you rather take sensible steps to ensure your own safety or take a chance as it's your right not to be raped. The reality is there are criminals out there who will take advantage of women who are alone and vulnerable. When I was younger and out with a group of friends the rule always was you go home with who you went out with and nobody gets left behind.

ghostspirit · 15/02/2016 17:43

to me it just reads be careful. i dont think its victim blaming. i think it says becareful there are alot of wankers out there.

if i was going out and someone said to me be careful. i would say will do... not your victim blaming.

bert i think the same as you about staying together not to leave a friend alone. not to go into dodgy areas... but hard to avoid where i live.. but anyway its not as clear as i thought. my daughter and her mate out and about. daughter wants to get on the bus asap to get home and away from from dodgy area. but her mate starts no lets go to such and such... im not getting on the bus bla bla... so does she g to such and such with this friend also putting herself at risk. or does she say im not going there and get on the bus leaving her mate to go to this dodgy place... its a hard one

OurBlanche · 15/02/2016 17:44

Treats, you might be missing my point. I agree with you, to a point. But, maybe because of the furore such posters cause within some groups, there is nothing better out there. Nothing that quite catches the attention as well and sends out a simple message.

As it stands it is a catch all "Be Safe" message... everyone who looks at it will read it differently, may or may not make changes to their journey. That it is not specific might be its strength.

But there absolutely should be one with young men in it, mixed gender groups or separate, for much the same reasoning.

TheFairyCaravan · 15/02/2016 17:45

I say it to my children every time they go out, when they're at home. They're young men.

ouryve · 15/02/2016 17:46

I couldn't find any reference to this one on google images, but I did find one with a man. He was a silly man who ended up falling down the stairs because he was running and not holding the hand rail.

So not equivalent, at all.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 15/02/2016 17:47

Women are capable of being cautious without a poster campaign telling them to be cautious. The poster is more likely to reinforce a potential rapists viewpoint that women bring it on themselves.

boredofusername · 15/02/2016 17:47

what is the poster suggesting that women should DO? What does 'taking extra care' mean in this context?

watch out for your friends, even if you've had a falling out, don't go off in a huff and leave them (or end up alone yourself), if you've hooked up with a hunky bloke, don't leave your friend to get home on your own, that sort of thing. Take care of each other.

However, I also understand where the victim blaming feeling is coming from. That said, the worst one I ever heard of had nothing to do with rape, but police who refused to prosecute a dangerous driver because his cyclist victim wasn't wearing a helmet. That did shock me, that was like saying you wouldn't prosecute a burglar because someone left their window open.

Sunnyshores · 15/02/2016 17:50

Agree Manchesters poster is better, but isnt Cambridge's poster aimed at women (as unfortunately it is mostly women who get hurt). You dont only get raped when youre drunk, so Cambridges poster has a more subtle, thought provoking, meaning I think.

Women would recognise the image as them - girlfriends having a laugh on a night out, these are respectable, older looking women, so the poster says to me "these are ordinary women...they could be you....crime happens, to all women (drunk or not, mini skirt wearing or not).....be safe, make sure your friends are safe".

Surely people arent suggesting it would be better not to have this poster???

hefzi · 15/02/2016 17:52

Actually, I don't think this is victim blaming: like it or not, drunk people are more vulnerable, and the highest proportion of rapes happen to women.

Yes, absolutely, it's not OK to rape someone because she's drunk, because she's wearing a short skirt, because she's on her own etc etc But reminding women we still need to take care because sexual predators are out there? I don't see anything wrong with that.

I should be able to leave my home unlocked, go to work, and come back, and find my computer and camera just where I left them: because it's my home, and it's shit to steal, right? But the reality is, there are people who break into others homes and take their possessions - it's not "victim blaming" to remind people to lock up and leave their windows shut when they go out.

Likewise, I should be able to get out of my tree (or not touch a drop), go out in the city centre, walk the mile home taking any shortcuts I please, even if they aren't lit, wearing a mini skirt and a bra top, and not be mugged, have my bag stolen, be held up at knifepoint or raped. However, there are scum out there who will prey on women, drunk or sober, and if fewer people are around (because, y'know, it's the middle of the night) then it is sensible to take more precautions than I might if it was a sunny afternoon and all the kids are playing out.

Equally, when I was in my teens and 20s, "date rape" hadn't been coined: however, despite it being a solid part of the lexicon now, there are still men who think it's OK to fool around in a bar with a girl, go home with her - and then have sex with her even if she's not capable of consenting, or has passed out, or withdraws her consent after a bit of snogging etc Absolutely they are to blame - but at the same time, there's no harm in reminding women to be careful and not make it even easier for a predator to attack them, if at all possible.

I live in a city known for its nightlife, and though I have been out approximately half a dozen times in the years I've lived here, every time I shocked at how fucked up some young women (and they are mainly women - the blokes get fucked up by stay with their mates for some reason) get: alone, wandering in the street, trying to entwine themselves round passing (male) strangers, incoherent - often crying, usually barely able to stand. And this is by no means at the end of the night. Fortunately, there are black cabs in our city - so you can flag someone down (the police say it's not their issue), take their licence number and tag number (for safety) and pay for someone's cab home (as long as they can remember their address, and can come to agree that this is the best idea for them): but when a person refuses to engage at all, isn't passed out (so you can't call an ambulance) and just careers off to the next group of people - damn right, they are vulnerable, and there will be creeps who want to take advantage. So I don't see the harm in reminding people to take care of themselves and each other.

[Disclaimer:I lived overseas in my youth, and have been seriously - as opposed to "just" groped/fondled etc - sexually assaulted numerous times on my way home after a big night out, as well as raped at gunpoint by a taxi driver: alcohol, youth and a pervasive culture lacking in respect for women did not a happy and safe journey home make, all too often. I don't blame myself for being attacked - that was the low-life scum who chose to violate a vulnerable woman. I do, however, blame myself for allowing myself - more than once - to get both in the state and the situation whereby I was vulnerable to attack. In all honesty, a poster like this wouldn't have stopped me going out and having a blast - but it might have encouraged my friends and I to be more honest and open with each other about the toxic patriarchal society we lived and worked in, where police wouldn't follow up any accusations of rape if it happened on or after a night out...)

gooseberryroolz · 15/02/2016 17:54

Sorry to hear that hefzi Flowers

Great post.

Pseudonym99 · 15/02/2016 17:58

Is it not similar to signs in car parks telling you not to leave valuables on display? That is victim blaming, rather than telling the criminals not to nick stuff?

VeryPunny · 15/02/2016 18:00

The Underground runs poster campaigns every Christmas reminding people to be careful. Both sexes are represented.

Pseudonym99 · 15/02/2016 18:06

To find this poster in a train station wrong?

Its a bloody RAILWAY station. Not a train station.

Dieu · 15/02/2016 18:09

Faaaar too much being read into it. Nothing wrong with it.

thebiscuitindustry · 15/02/2016 18:09

YANBU. I think it's patronising to women, and one-sided because there isn't a poster telling men how to behave.

TooMuchRain · 15/02/2016 18:09

It would be fine if there were men in the poster, I would take it as a reminder to groups to look after one another but as it's only women it means the focus of what is probably a sexual assault campaign is the female potential victim - not the person actually responsible for the crime. Turn the campaign focus to those responsible, put up posters about consent maybe.

megadude · 15/02/2016 18:09

Pseudonym99, I stand corrected, railway station it is!

OP posts: