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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To find this poster in a train station wrong?

781 replies

megadude · 15/02/2016 16:43

Hi Mumsnetters,

I'd be interested to read your opinions about this poster. I don't want to say right now what I think about it, as I'd like to know how you'd interpret it.

TIA,
Megadude

To find this poster in a train station wrong?
OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
OurBlanche · 15/02/2016 17:14

It's always a pity when a good message gets bolloxed by such idiocy.

ZiggyFartdust · 15/02/2016 17:15

I totally understand why people say these posters are "victim blaming". But I don't really agree.
If someone burgles your house its entirely their fault and not yours, but we still recommend you lock the doors and use an alarm. If someone in a pub punches you in the face its entirely their fault and not yours but I'd still say be careful where you go drinking and get out quick if someone kicks off.

Refusing to help women protect themselves because its not their fault if somehting happens to them is just bloody stupid. Of course the only one at fault in a rape is the rapist, but until we've worked out how to stop them doing it, you're a fool if you don't take sensible steps to look after yourself.

FayKorgasm · 15/02/2016 17:16

I'm going to throw this fact in. Most rapists are known to their victim statistically.

gooseberryroolz · 15/02/2016 17:16

Victim blaming is wrong, but the deluded, manic standing-on-our-rights version of feminism (or any other ism) that tries to silence personal safety messages (of ANY kind, targetted at ANY audience) is positively dangerous, TBF.

LineyReborn · 15/02/2016 17:16

Ffs.

Treats · 15/02/2016 17:18

But BackforGood - what is the poster suggesting that women should DO? What does 'taking extra care' mean in this context? Supposing a vulnerable young woman should stray into the path of an aggressor, what "extra care" should she take to avoid becoming a victim of crime?

My objection would be the lack of a clear message. There might well be specific safety issues that could be addressed if the public had greater awareness of them (the ones on the Underground about people falling down stairs and escalators are a case in point). But this one just implies that there are unspecified risks associated with women going out at night, and suggests that if they take some undefined action, they might be able to protect themselves.

I dislike the idea that the rail company will be able to claim that they're taking action to reduce crime off the back of such a meaningless poster.

gooseberryroolz · 15/02/2016 17:18

X post with Blanche and Ziggy Smile

For all we know, that poster has been put up in response to specific local incidents or intelligence, be that a sex offender, or a spate of train platform accidents.

wickedwaterwitch · 15/02/2016 17:19

Pmsl at the idea that people who don't like this poster are 'deluded, manic standing on our rights feminists'

That's a really great reasoned argument Hmm

wickedwaterwitch · 15/02/2016 17:20

Quite, treats.

AlpacaMyThings · 15/02/2016 17:20

LineyReborn I'm NOT responsible if I am raped. The rapist is.

Maybe so but I would rather have my wits about me to avoid being in a situation where this happened, rather than being so pissed to not know where I am and end up being raped!

Treats · 15/02/2016 17:22

gooseberry - "For all we know, that poster has been put up in response to specific local incidents or intelligence, be that a sex offender, or a spate of train platform accidents."

So why not say so? And provide proper advice about what to do? It doesn't even mention how to contact a member of train staff if you've been threatened or attacked. It's as though, as long as they've passed on their vague warning about unspecified threats, they no longer have any responsibility for your safety.

gooseberryroolz · 15/02/2016 17:22

Wonderful misquote there wicked Hmm Hmm

I was CLEARLY talking about an (expression of) ideology or attitude, not people.

Any appproach that calls out personal safety precautions as 'victim blaimng' IS dangerous.

I fully expect the Suzy Lamplugh Trust to be picketed before long.

CrotchetQuaverMinim · 15/02/2016 17:23

I never understand why people always go on about the fact that most rapes are committed by people the woman knows, and none of these strategies will protect against that. It seems to be a totally separate point. Yes, it's true, and there needs to be help and support for women in those circumstances. But even if there's only a tiny minority of rapes that fit the 'stranger attack' description, I still don't want to be one of them, and it makes me feel safer to stay with friends and walk in lit areas - of course it doesn't reduce the risk entirely; it doesn't mean someone shouldn't be able to walk where she likes and with whomever she likes (or not); it doesn't mean that someone who is attacked is in any way responsible. But it still seems a sensible thing to do, even if it only slightly reduces the risk, even if the risk of a stranger-attack is only a very small subset of rapes, etc. I don't really see it as victim blaming to suggest precautions like that.

But I still didn't interpret this poster as anything to do with rape, but to do with being drunk, wearing heels, wearing flimsy clothes, and getting caught in train doors, slipping on stairs, getting trapped in the gap between the train and the platform, and all those other things that a railway company would be hoping specifically to avoid.

LineyReborn · 15/02/2016 17:23

'end up being raped'

Charming.

gooseberryroolz · 15/02/2016 17:23

So why not say so? And provide proper advice about what to do?

Agreed Treats, it is a bit general/ambiguous.

lazyarse123 · 15/02/2016 17:23

I completely understood and agree with everybody that women do not ask to be attacked, but saying that a minority of men don't seem to understand that no means no, so anything we can do to protect ourselves can't be a bad thing. You only have to watch those police tv programmes that show men and women falling out of pubs and clubs with no idea of what could happen to them.

blindsider · 15/02/2016 17:24

Treats

Valid points.

Witchend · 15/02/2016 17:24

It's saying look after your friends, and stick together. I've seen a similar one round here with a mixed group, so don't see it as victim blaming at all.

usual · 15/02/2016 17:26

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

OurBlanche · 15/02/2016 17:26

It wouldn't be a snappy poster, then Treats. It would be more of a passenger scaring tract.

Not good business; scaremongering; still aimed at women not men...

Ages ago, the first time I was told I was a rape apologist and was obviously still suffering from repressed emotions regarding having been raped (I do love MN, really) I asked if MNers could design a more effective poster... I still await a single response.

Maybe it isn't all that easy after all!

blindsider · 15/02/2016 17:28

Certainly a poster featuring men would not be a bad idea either, as I think statistically they are far more likely to be the victims of crime.

0christmastree5 · 15/02/2016 17:28

Professionally offended anyone??

LineyReborn · 15/02/2016 17:28

The only person I know who ever fell down an escalator pissed at a train station was a bloke.

BertrandRussell · 15/02/2016 17:29

Professionally unoffended, anyone? Grin

Treats · 15/02/2016 17:30

OurBlanche - I think that's ridiculous. A poster is meant to convey a message and this one fails utterly to do that. We can't even agree if it's meant to tell us to protect ourselves from rapists or avoid falling off the train. It fails utterly as a piece of communication.

Posters can be snappy and informative. If there's a specific risk that passengers can protect themselves from if they have a bit of extra information, then put up a poster that conveys that effectively. If there isn't, then don't.