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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To find this poster in a train station wrong?

781 replies

megadude · 15/02/2016 16:43

Hi Mumsnetters,

I'd be interested to read your opinions about this poster. I don't want to say right now what I think about it, as I'd like to know how you'd interpret it.

TIA,
Megadude

To find this poster in a train station wrong?
OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
limitedperiodonly · 16/02/2016 14:13

Most men are not footballers. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that most footballers are not rapists. But some men are. Society chooses to turn a blind eye to that whether they earn a lot of money or not.

limitedperiodonly · 16/02/2016 14:17

Why do you find it so hard to come to grips with the fact that the ex-Sunderland player's girlfriend appears to be standing by him? Presumably she doesn't think his behaviour towards other women affects her. That's how many people think.

OnlyLovers · 16/02/2016 14:19

I am just uncomfortable with the notion that all men need telling not to be a rapist because I genuinely believe that most men are nice, decent people.

NN, you may find this surprising, but quite a lot of hysterical/ranting/shrill/hairy-pitted (delete as you wish) feminists like me hold this belief too.

If we want to change society, we can start by not having posters up that basically say 'You won't get raped as long as you don't walk home alone/at night/in the dark.' As long as this kind of myth exists, people will believe it and nothing will change.

NNalreadyinuse · 16/02/2016 14:21

I think society allows some men off the hook according to whether they belong to a specific group (not necessarily footballers, whi are just an example) whose value is deemed to be higher than that of the women they treat badly.

ghostyslovesheep · 16/02/2016 14:21

I was thinking of Ched Evans who still continues to believe he did nothing wrong - he just doesn't get it despite being convicted - he doesn't think it was rape and he never will - he seems to feel he had a right to have sex with a very drunk woman who didn't concent and he had never met before while his mates watched - and he doesn't see why he's wrong

BertrandRussell · 16/02/2016 14:24

"I am just uncomfortable with the notion that all men need telling not to be a rapist because I genuinely believe that most men are nice, decent people."

Yes, I think most men are nice decent people too. You aren't falling for the lie that feminists all hate men are you?

Most people don't drink and drive either. Are you uncomfortable about the campaigns to stop the minority that do?

NNalreadyinuse · 16/02/2016 14:27

Only I have never used the terms hysterical/ranting/shrill/hairy pitted to describe anybody on this thread and frankly your post has pissed me off. I have not been anything other than polite.

I don't believe the posters are saying 'you won't get raped if you do X'. I believe they are saying that you might be able to minimise attacks by opportunistic rapists. That is not to say that if you do otherwise, what happens is your fault.

Some people clearly don't think that mist men are decent people, if they believe all men need telling not to be rapists.

stopfuckingshoutingatme · 16/02/2016 14:27

megadude

sweet fucking jess that Rape Trial

I will never understand defence barristers who do this, or the rapists obvs

Oh dear, you must have been spitting

ghostyslovesheep · 16/02/2016 14:28

I think lots of men are nice - I also think there are a fair few men who collude with unpleasant behaviour by their mates - despite being 'nice' because it's dicks over chicks etc

If more men stood up to be counted maybe the world would be nicer all round

I don't think all men are rapists at all

I don't think women are stupid or need educating about rape

limitedperiodonly · 16/02/2016 14:30

Many people deem men to be of a higher value than women. Yes, even in Britain.

You just have to look at the number of people who believe that women lie about sexual assault and therefore men need to be protected from them.

Obviously NAWALT. Just the ones who aren't like us

OnlyLovers · 16/02/2016 14:31

NN, I didn't say you had or accuse you of doing so. I'm using terms that have been used by various posters on this thread, some tongue-in-cheek and some seemingly not.

I have not been impolite to you.

JeanneDeMontbaston · 16/02/2016 14:33

Oh, come on, NN.

I routinely walk past posters in my GP surgery telling me to get tested for the clap, listen to adverts on Classic FM warning me about prostate cancer, and get emails from my workplace telling me to turn off the lights.

I do not feel horrified and aggrieved, and go dashing up to the relevant authorities to tell them I am a boringly eco-conscious woman with no known STDs.

Why would posters educating people about rape be any different?

BreakingDad77 · 16/02/2016 14:33

"I am just uncomfortable with the notion that all men need telling not to be a rapist because I genuinely believe that most men are nice, decent people."

But I would say many turn a blind eye to their predatory mates antics. Which I guess that campaign earlier about "not being that guy" comes from.

NNalreadyinuse · 16/02/2016 14:33

Drink drive campaigns are targetted at a small group of people. The don't rape people posters won't impact on men who rape because they genuinely dont think like normal people.

I also think the drink drive campaigns work because their are proper sanctions in society for drinking and driving, not because everyone saw the error of their ways. So what we need are proper punishments for rapist.

Btw, I am a feminist. Nowhere have I ever said that a woman is to blame for any attack on her.

Original poster
megadude · 16/02/2016 14:34

I still am I guess. He got off, by the way. It did open my eyes to the dangers of false assumptions about rape, and that trial by jury isn't working.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 16/02/2016 14:35

"Some people clearly don't think that mist men are decent people, if they believe all men need telling not to be rapists."

But all campaigns about anything cover loads of people they don't apply to! (ThwtMs a rubbish sentence, but you know what I mean) I never drink and drive, but I don't think there shouldn't be posters up about it. I don't fare dodge, or drive tired or speed or shoplift or wash chicken or put water on chip pan fires or walk on the live rail or jump, run, divebomb or pet in the swimming pool..........

NNalreadyinuse · 16/02/2016 14:35

There, not their.

OnlyLovers · 16/02/2016 14:37

The don't rape people posters won't impact on men who rape because they genuinely dont think like normal people.

I find this argument fundamentally flawed. How do you square it with the many, many cases of rape where the victim is quoted along the lines of 'I'd known him for a long time and never imagined he was capable of something like this'?

How are you you distinguishing a 'normal' man from 'a rapist'? How does your view on this explain the oft-repeated on here stat that 90% of rape victims already knew their rapist? Did they realise he wasn't a 'normal' person and ignore it? Were they genuinely ignorant of the 'fact' that he wasn't a normal person? If so, isn't that a lot of women who were happily consorting with a not-normal person but not realising it?

NNalreadyinuse · 16/02/2016 14:37

My phone is about to die. Am not being rude if I duck out for a bit now, while it charges.

ghostyslovesheep · 16/02/2016 14:38

The don't rape people posters won't impact on men who rape because they genuinely dont think like normal people - I disagree - I think many rapists are normal people with a fairly normal societal view of women

they ask for it
they are up for it
how they dress shows they want male attention
they so no but mean yes
she is naked in my bed so I have the right to sex
I married her so I have the right to sex
I paid for dinner
She kissed me
She's a tease
She's likes it rough

etc

Rapists tend to be 'normal' men

BertrandRussell · 16/02/2016 14:39

We're getting into deep waters about definitions of rape here-maybe not for this thread.

How would you feel about w campaign that said "Look after your mates- if someone looks as if he's going to do something he might regret - stop him"

JeanneDeMontbaston · 16/02/2016 14:40

Drink drive campaigns are targetted at a small group of people.

No, they're not. What about 'Think. Don't Drink and Drive'. Isn't that addressed to, well, everyone who has access to a car?

It's the same thing.

I really don't follow why you think rapists 'don't think like' other people.

If it were really that simple, don't you think we'd have solved the problem? Or do you think all women who are raped by men they know well, are just not very bright and didn't notice that they were going out with men who didn't think like other men?

Back before marital rape was criminalised, there was a time when it was commonplace for people - men and women - to express shock that anyone could imagine a man forcing his wife to have sex, was rape. It was a mainstream view.

That has now changed, and I can't imagine someone calmly saying 'oh yes, Dan sometimes has to force Sue, but it's a wife's duty, isn't it?'

limitedperiodonly · 16/02/2016 14:40

I think it would be a useful public service to all men telling that they might be guilty of rape in certain circumstances. Because it is a complete defence to a charge of rape to say that you didn't know you were doing it.

That's why many of those men who wind up in court accused of rape - which is not the same as the number of men who could be there - are acquitted.

They successfully argue that they believed they had consent. That doesn't mean the woman doesn't feel she was raped. It just means that the man was confused.

It would clear up a lot of misery and misunderstanding on both sides if we had a public information campaign spelling out to men what rape is.

Like this one

BreakingDad77 · 16/02/2016 14:42

Drink drive campaigns are targetted at a small group of people. The don't rape people posters won't impact on men who rape because they genuinely dont think like normal people.

There was some interesting facebook discussion when ched was in court as some guys honestly believed he was not at fault as they had often taking a blotto girl home.

moopymoodle · 16/02/2016 15:31

It's a bloody poster. I can't see how it implies anything bad! When I was attacked I was late teens and I admit looking back I got drunk, wondered down a back street and it was a bad choice. No it wasn't my fault at all that some loonatic decided to attack me but I learnt a massive lesson that night to stay safe and luckily my best friend interupted him. Now my 30 year old mindset is different, I wouldn't dream of putting myself into dangerous situations. Am I making myself accountable for for perpetrators?! No. I'm using my common sense to stay safe as clearly some evil perverts don't have any. It's all ok saying the blame lies at the rapist, we already know that.. but a rapist doesn't care if they are at fault. So the best anybody can do is not put themselves in situations where a rapist might lurk in order to attack women. The fact of the matter is there are plenty of women who (like myself when I was 18) make naive choices when it comes to safety. This poster is a good thing, there's no need to over analyse and make it into something its not. Yea it doesn't display much info but if it means women stick together in unsafe areas then what harm is done.