to stop my daughter going to the party?

[SharingMichelle]

Daughter is 9.

For most of the past 2 years she has been friends with a group of girls who are very mean, always preoccupied with who's speaking to who, who likes who, passing messages about not speaking to each other. Horrid and silly and exhausting. Just to be clear, my daughter is every bit as bad as the others. She's not a leader, but she'll follow anyone and be dreadful and thoughtlessly mean if she thinks it will win approval from the popular girls.

I was always there to talk to, and to gently advise throughout all this. Dd is lacking in confidence (not an excuse) and I do try to encourage her to feel more sure of herself, and to do the right thing.

A couple of months ago it reached a point where she was just so unhappy and anxious and she decided to not be friends with them any more. She hung her bag on a different peg in the hall and they have never spoken to her since.

She mostly reads by herself at breaktime, though she does have a friendship with a girl called T. She is not massively keen on T, but they have playdates, and have books in common.

Enter P. P is new to the school and suddenly my daughter and P are best friends. I was under the impression that DD, P and T all spent break and lunch times together.

Now it's P's birthday party tomorrow and I needed some info about something so messaged T's mum asking her (dd had told me that T was going). Turns out that T is not invited to the party and that my dd and P have been whispering about it and leaving T out all week and giggling at her. Ugh. I'm so disappointed with dd.

I was to ask for her version of events, and if it's true I'm not going to let her go to P's party. What do you think? What would you do?

I try and keep school and home separate. I'd let her go to the party but go and see the head in the morning and discuss what the school are going to do about the situation.

Honestly? I think you are over-involved in your DDs friendships. You cannot force her to be friends with T. It is obviously unkind to 'bully' T and I would be having a discussion along the lines of 'how would you like it!' but really, take a step back. It is likely to get worse as she gets older and she's going to have to learn from her mistakes.

I would let her go to the party.

Hmm. I think it would depend on how many are going to the party, and what the format is, ie is there a charge per head.
If it's a big party with low cost, then I'd be tempted to do as you say, but let P's parent know today.

If there is a cost involved, or only a couple have been invited, then I think it would be shame to spoil P's party. Must I'd be damn sure thinking of an alternative way of showing your DD that her behaviour is seriously bad and has consequences.

I wouldn't let her go that sounds like a fair punishment. I would also explain to P's mother why she is not allowed to go.

School aren't going to do anything. I tried asking them for help before.

Yes, I think I probably AM over-involved. I do find it difficult. I just want her to be happy, without being unkind to others. And that never happens and I'm not sure why. And I want to help her fix it. Bad, I know.

I think that they are behaving like 9 year old girls ...

Of course have a chat about appropriate behaviour and leaving people out but I'd be wary of assuming that it genuinely was all week or all the time. Or that T is blameless. I got fed up of refereeing such arguments with my daughter as it always seemed that everyone had a vastly different view point about what went on.

I think missing the party is too harsh. Plus very disrespectful to P/her family. And may well cause your DD to blame T which will not help the friendship.

No charge for the party, it's at home.

I'm feeling so cross and disappointed with dd. She has been to T's house twice this week to play! And now she's behaving like this. She was also chatting to her dad about the bullying that happens in her year at school, apparently blissfully unaware that her behaviour is in exactly the same camp.

Don't let her go. Her behaviour has been horrible.

You sound like a terrific mum, but you will be enabling her behaviour if she goes. It's like she's being rewarded.

Don't consider a punishment until you've got her story. It's not fair to make s decision without letting her say her piece. If she has been doing this then ask her what she thinks the punishment should be.

I don't get this. Are you saying your daughter shouldn't be allowed to go to a party because P (not your daughter) whose party it is hasn't invited T? You don't even know whether P and T have anything in common at all, nor is it up to you who P invites to her birthday.

Or is it because T's mum has said your daughter has been mean at school? Frankly, T's mum is going to feel a bit sensitive about T not being invited, but it's not necessarily true that they have been behaving like she says all week. Banning a 9 year old child from a birthday party because they haven't sensitively handled another child not being invited sounds - I dunno, a bit much? Especially without any outside witness (e.g. teacher) to back T's story up.

I'd let her go tbh unless teacher said that your daughter has behaved in a bullying way. You're not the friendship police, so although I understand your frustration at the politics going on here, unless your daughter has been misbehaving it would be mean IMO to keep her away.

I know this view is in the minority but you are right. You sound like a great mum, don't encourage bitchiness, you are teaching your Dd a lesson now that will her her behaviour greatly in future. You are still her mum wether it's at school or at home. Don't let her go to the party, sounds like a fair punishment.

I wouldn't stop her going to the party - that's punishing the other child too. I would punish her behaviour in some other way.

I would let her go but I would be very clear about the home conciquences if it were to happen again I.e no future play dates with P. She might not have understood that exclusion is a form of bullying and that it is very wrong.
I would also take her over to T's house and make her apologise for her behaviour.
I would talk to the class teacher about some class pshe work around friendships/bullying.

The problem is that you are completely over-involved, two playdates in one week with a child she's not that keen on is a recipe for trouble, and now you are reaping the consequences.

I don't see why you should intervene at all, if you hadn't called T's mum (which I never do about parties because sure enough, the person never is invited or there's an issue) to discuss the party, T's mum wouldn't have known about it.

At some point, you have to let them get on with it.

It's also quite good that your dd has a new friend. Perhaps her and T just aren't that close. Perhaps it would be better if T found a better friend than your dd.

I have been through this with my youngest, and the solution is always to stay out. Once you start promoting some friendships, and hoping they stay away from others, they are always drawn back to the ones you don't want! In my dd's case, it peaked in awfulness around aged 8/9 and is actually better in Yr 5/6.

Of course you can have the 'would you like this?' type of talk, but in my experience it has little effect and what has the most effect is them learning this stuff for themselves.

I wouldn't stop her going to the party, it's a shame you mentioned it to T's mum.

i Agree with you op and whycant. Someone said this is what 9 yr old girls do, no its jot. This is the making of a bully. Her previous friends were bullies. Op is a great mum parents are supposed to teach and guide their kids. Shes tried and its fell to deaf ears she needs to learn the hard way.

Falling out with friends theb being friends again this dort if fickle behaviour is natural at that age but bullying is not.

I can recall the girls and boys who were bullies in primary wrnt on to be korw viscious bullies in secondary the behaviour didnr just go away

Don't let her go to the party, sounds like a fair punishment.

But you don't have any evidence. Don't punish for something you've not seen yourself, or haven;'t heard about first hand from someone else. There is far too much tale-telling in schools and teachers jumping to conclusions. This is quite similar - T's mum says something, she must be right, kid must be punished. I would simply say that if this has been going on you are very disappointed and hope that you don't receive any similar reports in future. But at the moment you are effectively going on what T has told her mother. And if it's true why has T's mum had her at her house?

Chinese whispers and all that.

I don't agree with those saying that OP is over involved in her dd friendships. If what T mother is saying is true, this is bullying, its nasty and while it may seem trivial, if it goes unchecked it can literally ruin lives.

asking your daughter for her side of the story is a good idea, but she has already lied to you;

(dd had told me that T was going)Turns out that T is not invited to the party

she obviously knew T was not invited, so it was a deliberate lie, for that I would not let her go to the party, and depending on what her side of the story is, and if she was bullying T, I would probably have a further punishment. I loathe bullying and bullies whatever the age

I would suggest that she apologises to T - if she does, she can go... If she decides not to/there isn't enough time, I probably wouldn't let her. However, I might decide on a different punishment, but I definitely think she needs one... It isn't fair and she does need to learn that. However, if there is a reason (not that it means it's okay) I would 100% let her go and just talk to her about the best ways to resolve things.

At 9, it's probably not that bad - it'll be worse in Secondary School

Good luck x

I would agree if there were a clear cut case of bullying, but it seems T's mum might be motivated by being pissed off by T being excluded from the party, rather than any actual incidents. What is the 'excluding'- from the party? (which is perfectly reasonable) T's mum is kind of saying what T the child says- who says her version is the truth here?

If the teacher told me that my dd had been unkind and teasing another child about not going to a party, I would believe that and punish that.

But T's mum may be right, perhaps the Op's dd doesn't want to be friends with T as even the Op says she's not that keen on her. Sometimes these things can't be forced, and I don't see it as 'exclusion' to move away from one friend and make another one myself, because the alternative is to keep friends with people you don't get on with!

It seems to me the adults here are over involved, and are as much telling tales on each other as the children, and I honestly would try to step back and leave them to sort it out.

This isn't incompatible with having a stern word with the Op's dd about being kind, but ultimately, I think preventing her going to the party, on the say so of T who is peeved she isn't going, would be unwise, and if this happened, I suspect their friendship would be over anyway.

I disagree that the OP is over involved - she's parenting and I suspect that if your child was on the receiving end you'd want a mum like that instead of someone who doesn't give a shit.

Given that your daughter is happily going to T's house after school but bitching about her at school (assuming your happy with the 'evidence') then I agree with not allowing her to the party. And I would spend some of that time having a talk about what friendship means.

"To have a friend, you have to be a friend"

No, I wouldn't want a mum who made playdates twice a week with a child who I wasn't 'massively keen' on. I have learned after two girls going through this stage, that they have to choose their own friends, even if you might wish they chose otherwise.

She distanced herself from the unpleasant bitchy group which must have been very difficult. She's hanging out with someone she doesn't really click with particularly, they've been flung together because it's either that or be alone. Now a new, genuine friend has turned up, someone she really has a bond with and you're going to scupper it by not allowing her to go to the party.

You cannot solve every problem for her or make her into something she isn't.

In the nicest possible way OP, back off, she needs to figure some stuff out for herself and you are the safe place to fall if it all goes tits up.

So one girl is good enough until a new one appears?

I'm more concerned about the meanest and whispering and exclusion going on to a play date friend.

She made a good decision to avoid the other girls, and is now in need of friends - let her go to the party -

Have you spoken to p mom?

Punish her in a different way, for her unkindness and take her to apologise to T! Worth it's weight in gold to the parent and might make DD think again about doing it! Don't underestimate the power of a sorry

I think you can't take T's mum's version of events as gospel because she's only heard her daughters side. Between that and what your daughter says is probably where the truth lies.

I don't think banning your daughter from the party because T isn't going is fair either - it's not upto her who P invites and it sounds like they've just gotten excited about the whole thing and managed to make T feel excluded. Not nice, but probably not intentional either. Sounds like two 9 year olds who've gotten caught up in things to me.

I do have to ask, though, why are you arranging playdates with T when your daughter has said she doesn't like her much? It's not really fair on T or your DD, because it's making T and her mum think there's more of a friendship than there is.

I think your a great mum who's recognized that her child may be bulling and whats to do something about it. Its important that you get the truth and then maybe decide on the party from there.