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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

To think that the 'Calais Camp' situation needs to be resolved ASAP!

999 replies

Kreacherelf · 24/01/2016 14:20

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3413566/Port-Calais-closed-migrants-storm-harbour-make-Spirit-Britain-ferry-desperate-bid-reach-UK.html

This is just getting ridiculous now. France need to take this problem to the EU and ask for help dealing with it immediately. It has gone on for too long and needs to stop.

I don't know what the answer is. I think the UK should take anyone under 18, and their family members. Other than that, everyone else should have to apply for asylum in France or risk arrest. Not a perfect solution, but the only one I have.

OP posts:
tangerinesarenottheonlyfruit · 30/01/2016 21:27

Thank you emilybohemia I should not forget there is still hope and compassion Flowers

(Even if not much evidence of it on this thread!)

WidowWadman · 30/01/2016 21:27

Moreshabby I don't share your nightmares as it's such a small proportion of people arriving in Europe who seek to go to Britain. And really we're all descendants of migrants in some way or other. Humans move, it can't scare me. Quite the opposite.

OneWingWonder · 30/01/2016 21:29

tangerine

'My grandfather left his country illegally in WW2, and avoided conscription into the Nazis after his country was occupied.

He travelled illegally, and settled in the UK. He joined the war effort here, and then stayed after the war.'

The key phrase you use is ' he joined the war effort here '. Can you imagine the uproar from the left if we made access to asylum in the UK conditional on military service against IS?

OhforGodsake · 30/01/2016 21:31

Don't worry Moreshabby judging from the volume of posters on this thread alone, the majority of people in the UK feel exactly as you do about the future of our country and how immigration is to be very carefully managed.

emilybohemia · 30/01/2016 21:32

Tangerine, your grandfaher sounds fascinating and very brave.

tangerinesarenottheonlyfruit · 30/01/2016 21:33

Sorry? Where did you infer that from?

Ordinary people were being conscripted in Britain then. He didn't sign up on condition of asylum!

Saying that access to asylum in the UK conditional on military service against IS only makes sense if we were all being conscripted, which we're not Confused

I'm not sure what your point is?

My question was, was my GF a criminal for travelling illegally to Britain when he had the chance, rather than staying and being forced to fight for the Nazis?

SnowBells · 30/01/2016 21:36

tangerine SnowBells if you had close family in the UK, and nowhere else, would you not want to head for the UK too?

I'm the wrong person to ask. I haven't lived near my side of the family for nearly two decades! The last time I saw my dad in person was 2013. We speak on the phone, of course. My family is spread all over the world - and when we meet up, it's like we've never been apart. I don't get this whole 'being close to family' thing.

tangerinesarenottheonlyfruit · 30/01/2016 21:36

emilybohemia he was :)

He was smart, and compassionate, and had a way of asking seemingly innocent questions about the world that were designed to make you think!

He was at sea in the war.

Ha used to say "All war is a racket!" and told tales of how he witnessed Allies and Germans secretly trading out at sea.

But that's another story for another time ...

tangerinesarenottheonlyfruit · 30/01/2016 21:38

SnowBells it's not about being close to family, it's about survival. Imagine you have nothing but the clothes you stand in, and you are living in a makeshift tent, in desperate conditions, with little food and no idea when it will end. Your child is ill and there is no medicine to treat them.

Your family say "come to us, you can live with us".

You'd go, surely?

OhforGodsake · 30/01/2016 21:39

Oh and we can't wait for you to regale us with it Tangerine Grin

tangerinesarenottheonlyfruit · 30/01/2016 21:45

emilybohemia another thing my GF said to me was "you don't need papers. If you need to go, just go".

Now things have changed a lot since WW2 of course, but I was stuck in NY after September 11th, and at first no one had any idea what was going on. We were worried it might be the start of WW3.

The planes weren't flying and I was stuck.

I remembered what my GF had said and started thinking about how I would get out if WW3 had in fact started - I figured I really didn't want to be in the US if it went to war. I started thinking about where in the world my friends and relatives are, and planning how I might travel over land or sea to them from the US.

Of course the planes started up again, I flew home and it was nothing more than idle speculation really. But in that moment I did see the world a different way - one I might need to navigate myself to get to a place of safety.

What's missing in all this anti-migrant/refugee chat is any empathy, or understanding that we would all probably act the same given the circumstances.

SnowBells · 30/01/2016 21:51

tangerine I would claim asylum in France or whichever country people have passed through to get to Calais. Result would be no makeshift tent, food will be available and medicine, too.

My parents are actually helping a genuine Syrian refugee family (Christian Syrians - who are much more in danger over in Syria). This family didn't choose to go to freakin' Calais. They are housed. They get food. My mother is quite conservative, but she speaks highly of this family because they really want to integrate, and they're helping them do so. Plus my dad's a retired lawyer, so is a huge help.

Why would you put your kids through the struggle of Calais, when you could have chosen to do what this family did?!?

TwistedReach · 30/01/2016 21:54

snow bells. There are people in calais who have applied for asylum in france. They have been stuck there for months. They are not housed and they do not have medicine.

emilybohemia · 30/01/2016 21:54

That must have been terrifying for you tangerine. We would all do the same. The're just the same as us.

OhforGodsake · 30/01/2016 22:11

No they're not

SnowBells · 30/01/2016 22:14

tangerine

I was also in the US at the time of September 11. I was spending the summer there on an internship - one of the internships I was offered was in the North Tower, located where the plane hit (major losses). In a 'Sliding Doors' moment, I didn't choose to go for that one.

Nevertheless, when I was there, I had no family around me... but I had new friends (I'm still in touch with my then housemate). And I never had the feeling I was alone. Likely due to my past (traveling around growing up and losing quite a few family members before their time was up) that you have to learn to make things work wherever you are, and that life is too short to think "I have to go to the UK to live my life."

The earlier you can settle somewhere, the earlier you can continue living.

Woodhill · 30/01/2016 22:16

That's good snowbell. The Christians have had a terrible time in Syria. In the U K a man who was Moslem but converted to Christianity was beaten up by his community. This is worrying.

OhforGodsake · 30/01/2016 22:20

If they were the same, they would not put their children's lives in danger. They would not abandon them in Calais, on their own, as soon as they spot the first opportunity to make a break for themselves. They would not leave wives and daughters back at home to fend for themselves in a war ravaged country. They would not force themselves into a country and beg for sanctuary and then rape and assault their female hosts.
In those respects, they are not the same.

OhforGodsake · 30/01/2016 22:22

When was that woodhill? Was that recently?

LumelaMme · 30/01/2016 22:23

What's missing in all this anti-migrant/refugee chat is any empathy, or understanding that we would all probably act the same given the circumstances.
Oh bollocks.
There have been plenty of sensible posts suggesting that encouraging people into the hands of people smugglers, into leaky boats to risk drowning at sea is NOT the kindest thing to do, and suggesting instead that the camps in neighbouring countries be made better, for the sake of the refugees, and for the sake of the reconstruction of their countries later.

Plenty of people have pointed out that emptying the jungle into Britain will just cause it to fill up again, with more people paying over their life savings to people smugglers and risking their lives at sea.

I grew up wondering what I'd have to do if I was forced to leave my home at short notice, since that happened to my GPs. From the time I was a teenager, I knew what I'd pack. I have a cousin, much older than me, who had to run as well, and until she was an adult she kept a little bag of her special things, ready to grab in case she had to run again.

So thanks for accusing me of lacking empathy and understanding. But you just keep on polishing your haloes and saying that anyone who disagrees is obviously a total bastard. Force people like me out of the discussion, and then it will be you folks vs the far Right.

Fan-bloody-tastic.

TwistedReach · 30/01/2016 22:24

Ohforgodsake, from that post you do seem to see only bad in 'they'. 'They' who are bad, and 'us' who are good.

tangerinesarenottheonlyfruit · 30/01/2016 22:27

OhforGodsake.

Maybe, just maybe, the people in Calais are the same because they are not choosing to put their children's life in danger, but think getting to the UK is the best option for them all?

Maybe they are not abandoning them out of selfishness, but out of a desire to do the best for all of them?

Maybe they are only leaving wives and daughters because they see it as the best chance for all the family - if the father stayed he would be dead - if he leaves he may be able to save the family.

Definitely, as a group, they are not fucking rapists!

Maybe the real problem is you are seeing people who are in reality just like me and you, as less than human? Can't you see?

WidowWadman · 30/01/2016 22:29

Who would have thunk? www.huffingtonpost.de/2016/01/29/story_n_9116048.html?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=facebook-focus-online-politik&fbc=facebook-focus-online-politik&ts=201601301225

(NB: I don't doubt that there were actual cases of assault and rape, but I'm not surprised at all that some of the accusations turned out to be false)

tangerinesarenottheonlyfruit · 30/01/2016 22:32

LumelaMme

I said was talking about anti-refugee/migrant chat not every post!

I have no idea why you took that personally?

The examples you mention are not devoid of empathy. The posts that other refugees (see OhforGodsake's last post for just one of many examples) are.

LumelaMme · 30/01/2016 22:44

I took it personally, tangerine, because I've been lumped in as bigoted and prejudiced by your mate emily, so I assumed that I was on the 'wrong' side.

Her words, btw. Nice.

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