formula

[Emma2506]

Ok so I don't want to turn this into a whole ff vs bf war but I find it highly offensive to ff mums who can't collect advantage points/clubcard points, shops aren't allowed to have any offers on etc for formula. I understand it's the LAW but why is it acceptable to have deals on alcohol yet ff mums are penalised for choosing to ff or not being able physically able to bf? I know the excuse is shops promote breast feeding but I'm struggling to get my head around why a bf mum would buy formula just because it's on offer if she is doing well bf and it's FREE!

Probably a reaction to the hormones in let down, Cats. The body can react to them in really strange ways. I get an allergic reaction (shortness of breath, hives etc) to the hormones in milk let down and am on medication for it. It actually resulted in me having a full blown anaphylactic attack the day after DS was born (that was fun...). The human body is weird sometimes!

Sand I didn't know that was possible!

"and the disallowed "my child turned out OK on formula" anecdotes that aren't allowed "because they're just anecdotes" in here as well"

Actually there are literally tens of thousands of these anecdotes which are wheeled out on mumsnet every fucking time sometime anyone makes an informed argument for breastfeeding having benefits and backs it up with some research references.

And actually, it's incredibly reassuring. No formula fed child on mumsnet is ever ill. They all grow up into incredibly healthy, brilliant adults.

The marvellous thing about this is that as most children in the UK over 6 weeks are fully formula fed, we can stop worrying about the NHS. Who needs it when no formula fed child is ever ill!

Except maybe it's still important for the legions of sickly breastfed children out there that you hear about on mumsnet during the ff/bf discussions - you know, people's exclusively breastfed neighbor's/friends/SIL's kids that are always bloody poorly and underweight.

Ho hum.

However, it's good to see that there's a fair bit of insight on mumsnet into the hateful profiteering by formula companies. Their marketing strategies in developing countries are awful and even in the UK it's pretty unethical, particularly when you keep in mind the fact that a disproportionate number of their customers come from the most disadvantaged groups in society.

One of my motivations for exclusively breastfeeding my two younger children was to avoid handing my cash over to these bastards.

I'd like to ask people who bf long term, how did you manage with older dc when you were stuck to the sofa with the baby?

If I ever have another I think I will have to see bf through come hell or high water as ds2 did not get on with formula so it's made me despise the stuff.

Neither did the midwives in the maternity ward Cats who initially had no what caused it - apparently it's really rare (lucky me...!). The allergies consultant I'm now under had heard of it though and treatment is working.

I had a reaction to the blood thinners that confused everyone on the ward, luckily it wasn't anaphylactic though. Glad treatment is working!

I'd like to ask people who bf long term, how did you manage with older dc when you were stuck to the sofa with the baby

I couldn't be stuck to the sofa with the baby! I just fed everywhere and anywhere, at the kitchen table, in the bathroom, in the car, at a football match, at the school...baby just had to get used to having feeds interrupted and waiting a few minutes.
Currently feeding DC4 and luckily she is the most relaxed chilled out baby. Although she feeds an awful lot at night, so I think she might be trying to make up for it then? It works, anyway.

"Utter baloney re lack of education. We know it all,over and over again"

The Infant Feeding Survey 2010 (the last full one that the government intends to fund) showed this not to be the case. One in four mothers questioned in this survey wasn't able to name a single health benefit of breastfeeding.

One in four.

mini that's surprising because everywhere I go I see breastfeeding promotion

"I'd like to ask people who bf long term, how did you manage with older dc when you were stuck to the sofa with the baby?"

You breastfeed anywhere and everywhere and you lower your standards in the home. You may have to prioritise your baby's feeding above your toddler's/older child's schedule. Children survive this short term disruption to their life, amazingly.

If 90% of Rwandan mothers can exclusively breastfeed their babies for six months (which they're encouraged to do because of high HIV rates and unaffordable and unsafe formula) despite the fact that almost all of them have no maternity pay or leave and much larger families then we do, then I reckon it can't be impossible for us to do it as well.

How lovely tiddly, see I just couldn't have imagined doing that, I couldn't see past the fog.

The latch was the biggest hurdle for us, it really hurt and I was advised not to put up with the pain and break the latch, but even after doing this 10 times he's still slide off and bite the nipple, by which time he'd be really upset, so I'd just put up with the pain. I couldn't see how this would work at the school, at ds1 swimming lessons and so on.

Yet people obviously do get over the initial difficulties.

But my sil brothers wife didn't experience any pain at all.

Thanks Cats - I'm lucky it is working as DS just pukes everywhere when I've tried formula (think it's a cow's milk intolerance as opposed to a one baby protest against the evil formula companies... ).

mini isn't it exhausting though?

Sand mine is milk intolerant. He has neocate but is still reacting to something. I think my body is just crap at female things (awful periods, awful pregnancy, can't give birth naturally and can't bf without pain).

See I could have coped with the constant feeding it was actually easier than making bottles, I just couldn't get him to latch properly, well either of them. The worst part was repeatedly breaking the latch, trying again, the baby ending up in a frenzy.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, all this money that goes into promoting breastfeeding to women who don't want to do it and will never want to do it, should be going towards providing practical breastfeeding support to the women who want to do it but are struggling. Proper lactation consultants (I cannot for the life of me remember the official title sorry) rather than overworked midwives trying to do everything at once, on every postnatal ward up and down the country.

It's all well and good saying "Get a private lactation consultant", but I was a 19-year-old student mum. I couldn't afford that kind of outlay, no-one in the hospital pointed me in the right direction, and online resources for my area are pitiful. A private lactation consultant just isn't an option for many mums.

We don't have a local La Leche League that I'm aware of, nor was there any breastfeeding support services in the county until a few months ago. It makes me feel more than a little bitter when I see all the numerous posters and leaflets telling me how great breastmilk is as opposed to formula, when I'm sure they could get the message across with half as many leaflets and twice as many avenues of practical support available to mums.

I was FF and have IBS - but it's due to a genetic condition I was born with, and no amount of breastmilk would have changed the innate structure of my bowel any more than it would put collagen in my DNA, or any of the other symptoms of the condition. It's a chronically underdiagnosed disease, so I don't think the emphasis placed on all this " of FF people have IBS" is as accurate as people think.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, all this money that goes into promoting breastfeeding to women who don't want to do it and will never want to do it, should be going towards providing practical breastfeeding support to the women who want to do it but are struggling.

This would be amazing.

ehlers danios by any chance Ovaries? I have hypermobility and they're looking at EDS, I have IBS too.

"mini that's surprising because everywhere I go I see breastfeeding promotion"

Only in healthcare settings. Nowhere else.

Lots of women don't want to breastfeed or say they want to but have very ambivalent feelings about it. Some of these women will be metaphorically putting their fingers in their ears and going 'la la la' because they really, really don't want to hear anything that will make them feel anxious or guilty about choosing not to breastfeed.

Remember that in some parts of the UK more than 1 in 4 babies isn't breastfed at all. There are areas in the UK where breastfeeding is so far outside the experience of many women that it's almost not on the radar.

In the poorest parts of Derbyshire and Yorkshire breastfeeding initiation rates are only 20%.

In the UK extreme deprivation and formula feeding are common bed-fellows.

Meow you certainly can't control your periods or the way you give birth.

The fact that most women start bf and stop tells me it's extremely difficult and there's not enough support.

These threads only ever seem to make people feel guilty.

"I've said it before and I'll say it again, all this money that goes into promoting breastfeeding to women who don't want to do it and will never want to do it, should be going towards providing practical breastfeeding support to the women who want to do it but are struggling."

Any other areas of healthcare where we should stop promoting healthy behaviours and move money into treatment instead?

Reducing smoking?

Reducing alcohol consumption?

Encouraging healthy eating?

Encouraging exercise?

People like smoking, sitting on the sofa, drinking beer and eating chips as much as they like not breastfeeding.

Do you think that the NHS should stop all health promotion as some people don't want to hear things which make them feel negatively about entrenched behaviours which they don't want to change?

mini

Surely these women go into healthcare settings though? If they want to ignore it then what can be done?

There are areas in the UK where breastfeeding is so far outside the experience of many women that it's almost not on the radar

I somewhat agree with that, it was just assumed I'd bottle feed and I don't know many people who bf. Or I didn't until I had my own dc

Not my experience of healthcare though, lots of bf promotion everywhere I don't see how you couldn't see it!

Erm hold on a minute, nobody said treatment.

She said practical support.

Pyjama I think people assume that because it's natural it's easy, which isn't right. Many women aren't aware how tiring, painful and difficult it can be and without proper support people will stop