To think right wing small c conservatives are winging the debate all over the Western World.

[AmyWatt1972]

Social Conservatives (not necessarily torys) are doing well across countries across the world.

Trump is likely to be the next republican candidate and if certain polls are right could win up to 43 states.

www.usnews.com/opinion/articles/2016-01-08/new-poll-shows-donald-trump-is-a-real-threat-to-hillary-clinton

www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/09/05/poll-shows-gops-two-rival-wings-combine-to-50-percent-for-2016/

In Britain the no EU poll is surging ahead and I heard on the big questions that only 7% of women are feminists. Polls are also showing that the public is taking conservative stances on refugees and monarchy.

Aibu to think 2015 was the year the left wing lost the argument and 2016 the year real conservatism is brought back to life.

P.S Thanks Corbyn and The Guardian.

Scotland, or large parts of it, was actually a very conservative-voting country until the eighties, amy. My FIL was a Tory party member and did lots of canvassing at that time and found it easy work until about the time of the poll tax.

They look down on those who shun benefit payouts for work and seek to loftily inform them that benefits claimants are innocent victims, whereas those who actually work are uppity and need taking down a peg or two.

In what way?

And it's not looking down on the working class to call someone who is working class racist if they are.

I think liberals will lead us into the next war through misguided actions that are I'll thought-out.

I'm a middle of the road moderate and would rather difficult decisions were made in out best interests than short term fixes implemented due to societal pressure.

I'm definitely conservative with a small C, I respect Jeremy Corbyn but don't think he's got any viable economic solutions, my respect for the Guardian had been nosediving for some time even before all the Cologne hand wringing coverup, but I do think the idea of Trump as leader of The Free World with a shiny red button available to press is the scariest thing I can imagine.

It isn't racist to be concerned about immigration, especially if the levels of immigration is impacting directly on your quality of life and that of your immediate family.

Yes abraid it was the poll tax and opposing devolution that knackered the Tories in Scotland. I'd argue the toss whether the SNP are left wing or not. Under Salmond (ex banker) they were very free market.

I do wonder if the left see how they're helping create the rise of the right by blocking discussion and shouting down debate on contentious issues. I think they don't.

Agreed.

Sorry but does anyone here understand what being conservative with a small c means?!

It means you have conservative values but are not actually in the (UK) Conservative party. It has nothing to do with the strength of your conservative values....

Stamped what concerns exactly? How is immigration impacting your quality of life? Are immigrants beating you on your way to work?

I don't know anyone who is a liberal socialist politically who fits into the small c conservative view point.

Immigration isn't impeding my quality of life, because I am not working class. I can afford, if I needed to, private healthcare, private education and am a homeowner.

Immigration impedes quality of life by numbers. It isn't racist to be upset when your child cannot get into the local primary school, when you have a non life threatening but nonetheless painful condition the NHS aren't able to treat for months or to realise any hope of social housing is futile and private rents are eye wateringly expensive.

This is in no way the 'fault' of immigrants personally, and I don't know anyone from any walk of life who claim it is. The concern is simply at a population level - that we have too many people crammed into too small an area in many parts of the UK and this impacts everybody but the working classes most of all.

Stamped

Then the issue is a lack of funding in education and healthcare and housing. Not immigration.

Which would again lead to raised taxes, which disproportionately affects those earning the least.

Stamped not if you implement a Robin Hood tax and tax second homes, then there's the option of legalising prostitution and drugs and taxing the industry...several ways of increased revenue that don't involve hitting the working class

I'm all for increasing our population but only if our infrastructure improves alongside the increase.

Where I live it is dire. Loads of new houses, bad roads that can't cope with the influx of people, no new schools, the hospital hasn't expanded in decades, the town centre car parks can't cope, it's a joke. Foresight and planning.

And there are all sorts of immensely complex reasons why that hasn't happened and will not happened - realistically, it does rather come down to the idea or concept that the UK does indeed have both unlimited space and unlimited funds and it has neither.

Quite apart from the school and healthcare issue, if we assume for arguments sake you are correct, and that what needs to be done is force prostitutes (famous indeed for their adherence to the law ) to pay tax and those who own second homes to pay more tax and there will be enough schools and enough GP appointments for all, there is the matter of space.

It currently takes me an hour to get from one side of town to the other.

I like nature; I like wildlife. I don't want it to vanish under housing estates.

I don't want to be unable to sit down on a bus or train.

There's an environmental impact as well as a social one.

A labour voting devout Catholic would have left wing political views but may well be a social conservative on matters like equal marriage, abortion or premarital sex.

Exactly. I'm not sure what point OP is trying to make but it is perfectly possible to follow right of centre economic an fiscal policies and be liberal on social and cultural issues. The majority of the current Tory MPs probably fall into that camp.

Stamped no one is suggesting unlimited space or funds.

Re prostitutes many prostitutes would be happier with it being regulated meaning less abuse of them, less fear of prosecution, more access to benefits for those on low incomes etc. most prostitutes are vulnerable ladies not hardened criminals

With regards to space, UK cities are some of the flattest in the world. Go to Tokyo, Dubai, anywhere in the states. High sky scrapers. Using the whole space. The UK needs to consider that.

As well if we could encourage less people to have second homes we could actually use up many of the empty properties in the UK again meaning less space would be taken

So essentially, the answer is skyscrapers, scrapping second homes, and legalising and thus ensuring tax is paid, on the sex industry.

High rise buildings frequently bring social issues with them: they aren't really suitable for families and for elderly people.

Empty homes aren't generally kept for tax reasons but as letting properties, and preventing people from owning them is not going to solve the housing crisis but add to it. People will always need to rent.

The sex industry can be characterised by the few who earn a lot from it - escorts - and to consider them first, if sex can be seen as a transaction, how could one tax it? It's unlikely the 'service users' would be willing to pay by debit card or cheque even if the woman insisted on this. Escort agencies pay tax: individual workers generally do not. This would not change.

Those who are more vulnerable would not stop being vulnerable because of tax. A red light district with a heroin addict charging £20 for sex (I worked with these women; I know that's the going rate or was in 2008 anyway) is not going to hand some of it over to HM tax revenue.

At any rate, we are hugely digressing! We cannot keep adding to our population without this having an impact and in some of those instances that impact will be negative. If you are affected by it, it is not racist to point this out.

well it is if you ONLY focus on 'foreign' people being the issue - large families and people under occupying also cost and take up housing, people with 'self caused' health problems cost the NHS - plent of immigrants work and pay tax ...

I really get cross with some of the right views on class - all working class people are anti immigration - all Guardian readers have no idea how working class people feel and hate the working class

I am working class (raised in a terrace house in Liverpool by a single parent) and I read the Guardian - I don't hate myself - I know plenty of pro refugee working class people

I know a fair few middle class selfish tory types

I wish the right would stop trying to claim they are somehow the voice of the workers - it's laughable

Stamped they're not suitable for everyone but some residential and offices could definitely be done in high rise buildings, meaning space could be used more efficiently.

Second homes for rent, private landlords usually charge appalling rates and that's adding to the housing crisis. Lowering the amount of rent someone is allowed to charge would have a similar effect

No, but a regulated sex industry in which prostitutes are helped with addiction and other mental health issues and work for legitimate companies might.

Yes I agree there will be negstive as well as positive impacts to immigration, however it's the way they're discussed that's the problem. Complaining the train is overcrowded is fine complaining that immigrants shouldn't be allowed in because the train is overcrowded isn't

well it is if you ONLY focus on 'foreign' people being the issue

This too.

The alternative to the population surge is to place restrictions on family size, which is an abhorrent view to most of us I am sure.

I will repeat: a concern about the pressure on schools, healthcare and public services because of immigration is not racism. A desire to see green is not racism. A wish to get from one side of town to the other without a backlog of traffic is not racism.

Of course, it would be misleading, not to mention ridiculous, to state these things are solely because of immigration, but I really don't see how anyone can deny that our country is currently under pressure due to the numbers of people living in it (and as previously mentioned the poor infrastructure) and that as such, having open borders is perhaps something that should at least be debated without accusations of racism being bandied about.