to object to MNHQ forcing a MALE/FEMALE gender binary on my account.

[HairyLittleCarrot]

I don't have any GENDER.

My MN account forces me to pick from two 'genders'.

I can't even opt out, it's a forced binary choice.

I'm not agender, pangender, cisgender, transgender, male gender, female gender or ANY GENDER.

If you want to know my sex, I am happy to provide that information. But you'll have to add that in as a field, because it doesn't exist currently.

Sex and gender are not the same thing. If you insist on collecting data by gender and making it a forced choice I would like an option as follows:

"Reject gender as a harmful, made up, bullshit concept".

Then when you analyse your account database you can say
X% identify as female gender
Y% identify as male gender
Z% reject gender as a bullshit concept.

AIBU to request MNHQ to alter my account details so that they do not misrepresent me?

The difference between gender and sex is the difference between placing the recently convicted male child rapist into female or male prison.

Crime was committed as a male, using a penis. As far as I'm concerned, you go to a male prison for that.

Or, if you don't want to go to a male prison, don't commit the crime. There. Wasn't that simple.

Er, female. Because I am female. Because my sex is 'woman'. And I'd have serious issues with someone whose sex is male and whose body is male using those toilets because they ticked a box saying they felt that their 'gender' was female.

an example for you.

Well i'm going to be too honest with you all and say that i've been reading the last part of this thread whilst on the loo. And ive just realised there is no toilet roll left on the roll. This is clearly a very big, real (apparently this matters on here right now) and immediate problem for me. And yet i still think that OP's issue matters too. There is room for many issues. Big ones, small ones and bathroom ones.

You may feel like you don't have a gender, OP, but the majority of people do, as well as a sex.

But that isn't "bashing" transpeople, unless women are no longer allowed to voice an opinion on who they share safe space with?

honestly if I didn't read MN I wouldn't have a fucking clue what I can and cant' say any more. Who knew that gender was fluid - well me of course! thanks to MN

I've just looked up the word gender...and I'm confused. Surely gender is better than what sex you are? Oh right, you want MN to put in masculine, feminine or neuter - is that what the issue is?

That's not bashing transpeople, Eloquent. I'm not saying I don't think transpeople should exist, or that they shouldn't be treated well, or shouldn't go to the toilet. I'm saying I don't want men with men's bodies in women's spaces because they say they feel like it.

I'm so fed up of this 'gender doesn't exist' agenda, seemingly perpetuated by people who cannot accept that it's ok for there to be difference between men and women. Difference isn't always bad you know. Oh yes, the world would be a far nicer, politically correct place if we were all a-gendered and asexual, but it will never be the case (thank god, how boring would that be). Saying things like this can be very alienating for people struggling with gender issues, just because you don't believe that gender isn't 'real', doesn't make it so. Tumblr may be a better platform for this sort of view, to be honest.

YANBU

re: rivierakid

"I'm not agender, pangender, cisgender, transgender, male gender, female gender or ANY GENDER.

To be agender is to not feel as though you have any gender, so by definition, you are agender.

Agender is a term which can be literally translated as 'without gender'. It can be seen either as a non-binary gender identity or as a statement of not having a gender identity. People who identify as agender may describe themselves as one or more of the following: Genderless or lacking gender. Gender neutral."

No, that's not true about agender... just as there's a big difference in meaning between aseptic and anti-septic, the same applies to gender... in which case "anti-gender" should be a viable option

< passes loo roll to Elf >

How is anyone supposed to know what is right /wrong when there are so many bloody options, think YABU to expect not just mumsnet but all of us to keep up!

such anger and hostility at the start doesn't help the cause

RudeElf i really hope you have found a solution to your issue, having weird mental images!

Danger

Gender is now about what you feel you are, whereas sex is what you biological and irrefutably are.

Not so long ago both gender and sex meant the latter, I think.

Leelu6
When you use public loos, what loo do you use, male or female?

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace
Er, female. Because I am female. Because my sex is 'woman'. And I'd have serious issues with someone whose sex is male and whose body is male using those toilets because they ticked a box saying they felt that their 'gender' was female.

Seek
How can you have an issue with the concept of gender, but support separate toilets for men and women? Separate toilets = made up segregation. (Does anybody have anything other than 'unisex' toilets at home?)

Words have gender. People have sex.
HTH.

I am older, everyone I have ever spoken to my age is like this when you ask them what their gender identity is, even when you explain the idea. They do not have any. Because they were not brought up with this brainwashing.

fascicle

Toilets are segregated by sex not gender

Much like prisons were until recently.

I am not the only person who rejects the idea of gender.

I'm fine with how other people define themselves.

I object to being defined by what someone imagines my "feelings" to be.
I don't want to be shoved in a box where I don't belong.

Barry are you actually in trans spaces? Because those of us who are call the state of being without gender 'agender' - feel free to Google.

It's all well and good saying gender isn't a thing... Until you are in a position where you feel you have been assigned the wrong one.

I don't think people should be asked their gender unless they volunteer the information. Because of some of the bullshit attitudes that are shown here.

YABU to get upset about something like this - does it matter really?
cba to RTFT - I don't have a gender on my MN account - just didn't fill it in - and after hackergate I have a fake (different sex) name too.
I get more annoyed about the endless data gathering about people that goes on ...
eg for a council arranged training course registration they asked for a whole host of information including gender and martial status - I was WTF???? Why do they need to know that? On enquiry I didn't actually have to complete either - or lots of the other information they were gathering about me - apparently they only really needed the things 'typed in bold' - my name and organisation I worked for iirc ...

I agree with you, OP. Sex I am happy to put as female. I am now refusing to put a gender on forms

thanks Alis so a person with ovaries and breasts can say in gender they are male if that's what they identify as but if it said sex they'd have to say female. So having gender is Ok but the fact there isn't a 'non of these things' isnt. I do think there should be an 'opt out' box to signify none of your fecking business. But I'm really not on board with the I'm no gender thing. Just me and I'll get flamed but hey ho.

I don't see this as a trans issue at all. My sex is female ( born female ) but I could temporarily feel more male than female ( & therefore tick the male gender ) next year I could feel differently. So in my view, 'gender' doesn't really represent anyone as its so open to personal feeling.

I don't want to be shoved in a box where I don't belong

Aww shame. No one is shoving you anywhere. How dramatic.

YABU.

I genuinely couldn't give a shit about this crap and am getting bored with hearing about it.