To be furious at the messing around we're having regarding taking his kids on a holiday???

[SpiderStardust]

DP and I thought it would be nice to take both mine and his kids away on a holiday to America. My son is 15 and his sons are 18 and 20.

First issue we had was that in the past his ex has said she didn't want him taking them on holidays abroad "showing off" his money etc etc (she doesn't work and apart from that, doesn't like the hassle of going abroad). So for the past 6 years, his kids have no been abroad.

Well his kids are now adults so we decided to take them abroad if they wanted to go and there would be little she could do about it.

Well she managed to talk SS1 out of the first destination we had planned. However, now that it has changed to New York he says he definitely wants to come however, naturally she is refusing to pay for passports and his kids don't work so we said we'd buy the passports. Now, apparently DSS does not use a mobile phone, WhatsApp or any means of normal communication (bullshit) so DP has to rely on facebook messaging to contact him - which 99% of the time, DSS ignores.

Now we're waiting to book flights but really need to passports sorting first. DP said he'd give the money to DSS and he could sort them out. No reply. A day later he said he could transfer the money into his mother's account for them to sort it out from there - no reply. Finally, DP sent a message asking if they just want us to sort it all out - no fucking reply.

It's just ridiculous. This lad ignores all messages from DP unless he wants something. He says he wants to come on this holiday yet ignores every message about sorting the passports despite the fact that we've now offered to pay for them AND organise them. Meanwhile, we're hanging around like idiots not knowing whether to book flights or not.

I said to DP "do you not think it's a bit rude for him to ignore you like this when we're trying to sort out a holiday for him??" and he thinks the sun shines out of his arse and says "no he's not ignoring me, he just doesn't use facebook much". Bullshit - he logged in an hour ago, those messages have been sat there for days plus, he knows DP is trying to sort this out so surely he'd have the sense to check his messages even if he genuinely didn't use facebook much? and to say he has no mobile or other means of contact?? at 20 years old??

I'm just so frustrated. How is it so difficult to book a holiday with what is essentially, a group of adults??

As far as I'm aware, most contact orders expire by the time the children reach 18.

Having said that, most children have a clear idea of whether they want to continue having regular contact with the non resident parent before then. In fact, many teenagers are not so interested in seeing the other parent, not because the dreadful resident parent is not allowing contact, but because they are so busy with their own friends/life they really don't want to spend much of their time with either parent.

He apparently has no access to a telephone and he manages to use facebook messages absolutely fine when he wants something.

Yes, your DH is the problem. Not his kids. I don't like the sound of "snaps my head off" and "shit storm" one little bit

Just let me check I'm reading this correctly - the older "boy" is 20 and has learning difficulties and doesn't respond well to pressure, and this is the one you're contacting trying to get answers? Is that right? Or are you contacting the younger one?

Does he read the FB messages and ignore them or just not read them? You can tell when they've been read.

If he has read them, he is obviously ignoring you. If he hasn't he sounds a bit slack not surprisingly as mum and dad treat him like I treat my 12 year old (and I'm even sick of that)

I'd give him the ultimatum when you see him, it's only fair to give an ultimatum that you know he will actually be aware of. Just say that you are booking the flights on x date, let us know before then if you are able to come.

Yeah the contact agreement will no longer be legally enforced but DP is shit scared of the kids mother and won't do anything to rock the boat (especially something as god awful as turning up on a Thursday!!!). The kids themselves still keep up with the access agreement coming to stay every Saturday except this past year or so they've gotten into the habit of promising DP all week that they're still coming before messaging him at 4.30pm Saturday (minutes before he sets off to pick them up) saying that they're not coming this week etc. The whole situation is beyond bizarre. What annoys me the most is the way DP thinks it's all perfectly normal and reasonable!!!

I'd just go with your son.

Let DH use the time to connect with his sons (perhaps vacationing locally) and think about how future grown-up contact needs to go.

Forget about the SS, its your DH that is being a dick. Sort that out.

He said his son "is just like that! he does want to go, he just doesn't read facebook messages!"

Ask him how you're all meant to get in contact with him then if he doesn't respond to anything else.

No the youngest son has learning difficulties. It's the eldest son we're trying to communicate with!!

He does read the messages, it shows that they have been read.

Boxroom?

oh it gets worse, there are rigid contact arrangements in place and if he is to see the "boys" on any day other than a Saturday it has to be pre-arranged. She would go off her head if he just turned up on a Wednesday or whatever. Honestly the kids are treated like small children by the pair of them.

Oh that's ridiculous- they are grown men for goodness sake.

Are you sure the facebook account is even being used by your DSS? It maybe an old account that he doesn't use anymore? If his mother is that controlling it may be her logging into it??

How come your DP hasn't asked his son for his mobile number???

If I were you I'd ask DSS one more time, face-to-face, and then if he doesn't sort it - tough, go without him

I think you know well, what the problem is. You know that they behave like that because DP just bends himself backwards to accommodate them.

The problem is, they are not children any more, and no amount of "bending backwards" is going to sort their lack of care in the long term. I think this is the time when you let go and wait for them to come back when they are ready (whatever the contact arrangements that are in place).

I would also avoid comparing the contact an 11 year old wishes to have with a parent or not with that a teenager may wish to have. DS was ok to ring his dad regularly when he was younger, now rings him very seldomly and always under duress. Different ages, different circumstances, and all that...

He took them away last year. We were meant to be going somewhere as a family and from what I can work out, eldest had a moan and DP ended up booking somewhere completely targeted at DSS1. I thought it sounded shit so me and my DS didn't end up going on a holiday last year. Am I bollocks putting up with that again.

Sorry, my misread.

Look I think your DP and his ex are being total wankers about this situation, and the end result is that either you are going to be massively out of pocket or you're going to go without them.

I actually think I agree with the PP who suggested you go alone with your DS, and leave your DP to try and work it out with his sons (although that's really shit for the younger one if it doesn't pan out) and maybe he could take them by himself another time.

It all sounds horribly frustrating though.

I'd book for you and your son!

Yes it's definitely his current facebook account because you can guarantee that at 4.30pm on a Saturday, just as DP is about to go and pick him up he logs on and sends him a message saying that he's not coming. Usually with no mention at all of the other unanswered messages.

Also DP has asked him about his phone, there is apparently no point in him having the number as he doesn't use it.

I just wish he'd be honest and say "Look, I'm too old for all this and that's why I ignore you" !!!!!!

Your husband needs to cut the bloody apron strings.

There is no 'contact arrangement'. There are no assumptions about when he sees them, or about holidaying together.

They are adults!!

I remember when I was dating and I specifically only dated men with older kids as I didn't want to be tied to contact agreements and messy holiday arrangements etc when my kids were becoming independent. The way it's worked out here I might as well have dated someone with bloody toddlers.

Your DP is being delusional- he is pussyfooting around his eldest son in a bid to keep him sweet and convince himself that he is important in his son's life. His son is only interested when his father is doing something for him.

I'd be giving DP the deadline- definitive answer by Saturday as you'd expect a message by then about contact time, otherwise you book for just the 3 of you. (Or just you and your son!)

You know what, I'd fuck the lot of them. Book somewhere nice for you and your son and leave them to their petty games and treating adults like little kids. Then dump his ass when you get back after realising how nice it is without him.

My step kids are adults and they decide when they want to see us - it revolves around their grown up lives, not their mother.

I think you should message him yourself. All he needs to do is get photos taken and fill out a form.

But I think your dp is being a dick and allowing these boys to run his life and he's basically living his life in limbo waiting for them to get in touch, see him etc.

If the oldest isn't working then what's he doing with his time? If he's a student, fair enough but if he's at home then there's no excuse for not paying for his own passport.

I'm not sure how you put up with this crap.