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Original poster

to ask my DP why we arent engaged yet?

183 replies

BumbleNova · 04/01/2016 11:14

I dont know if I am being unreasonable or not. I probably am. We have been together 4 years, we have lived together for 3 1/2. I am sure we both want to spend the rest of our lives together, we have discussed it and we have agreed we want kids and (roughly) when we expect that to be.

So the issue is that "we" are buying a house together at the moment. well - I am buying the house (I earn a lot more than he does) with the understanding that it is intended to be our family home.

I am making a real and very hard earned commitment to our future. I have no problem that he isnt contributing financially, but I am unhappy that he isnt committing to me to the same degree? i.e that asking me to marry him should be his part of the deal?

we first looked at rings two years ago today. I honestly couldnt care less about a ring, I dont want a diamond. its what it symbolises. I feel very taken for granted.

how do I raise this in a non-accusatory way? I tried to raise it in a jokey way on holiday about a month ago and he got very defensive. I clearly tried the wrong tack. we got back from a few days just us in a very romantic place last night and I found myself crying silently in the kitchen when we got home. just sheer disappointment. help?!

OP posts:
Orda1 · 04/01/2016 14:07

^ you're right, I wouldn't want to propose to someone who wasn't buying jointly.

Original poster
BumbleNova · 04/01/2016 14:15

HPSauciness why would it get messy? he will have a lease, so if we go our separate ways, he will move out.

in response to why we arent buying jointly - there is a risk (that is being dealt with) that HMRC could seize his assets and/or make him bankrupt. to protect me until it is all sorted, it makes more sense to keep our finances separate, just in case.

OP posts:
SelfLoathing · 04/01/2016 14:17

Why is the OP buying alone a signal of his intentions?

Because if he really wanted to marry her, that house purchase would be their family home and their first real commitment. He would be saying "let's buy it together" and fighting to make a financial contribution himself of some kind. His mentality would be a "team mentality" taking into account the Op's higher earning capacity. He'd be all "right I can save for this long, get this much deposit, not much I know but we should be doing this together." or similar attitude -exploring ways to fairly joint buy.

Put it another way, what would you say to a woman who posted "my bf and I have been together 4 years, we've talked about getting married but aren't engaged, "we" are buying a house together but because he earns more than me it's going to be in his name alone"? For both parties, it reflects a non-team mentality.

I'm ABSOLUTELY NOT not suggesting that OP puts this guy on the title deeds at all to be clear. It's obviously in her financial interests to buy alone.

Just observing that joint buying is what you'd expect both people who truly saw marriage in the future to want and strive for - even if there is a disparity in their income.

SelfLoathing · 04/01/2016 14:19

there is a risk (that is being dealt with) that HMRC could seize his assets and/or make him bankrupt.

Cross post with the above.

I'd run for the hills. Not paid his tax then? Fiscally irresponsible?

funnyperson · 04/01/2016 14:22

OP if you want to marry him, propose to him.
If you dont want to marry him then dump him and make room in your life for Mr Right

Whatdoidohelp · 04/01/2016 14:23

The house must be entirely in your name. If and when you marry it will become a marital assets. Protect yourself.

Original poster
BumbleNova · 04/01/2016 14:24

I cant say any more without outing us both - but the tax issue is complex and not him being completely irresponsible - its living/being resident in different European jurisdictions over the last 5 years, different tax reporting requirements being self employed and differing VAT requirements in different jurisdictions. most of the argument is about when he has been resident where.

professional advisers on are the case, its an abundance of caution on his part.

OP posts:
SolidGoldBrass · 04/01/2016 14:26

I think it is very easy for men to dangle the prospect of The Proposal like a doggy treat when they have no particular feelings about marrying the woman but know that marriage is what she wants. It's a way to keep a woman running around in circles and wringing her hands and trying desperately to make herself indispensable to the man, while he gets to sit back and enjoy the attention and also keep one eye out for a better prospect.

knobblyknee · 04/01/2016 14:28

You need more than the mortgage in your name, you need a pre nuptial agreement. After 18 months of living together, doesn't he have the same rights as if you were married?
I dont think you are well suited, and it doesnt sound like he does either. You can do better.

AnyFucker · 04/01/2016 14:29

he has "tax issues"

Fuck yeah, he does

Lweji · 04/01/2016 14:29

After 18 months of living together, doesn't he have the same rights as if you were married?
Definitely NOT.

AnyFucker · 04/01/2016 14:30

Nope, the mistake here would be to marry this tax dodging weaver of fairy tales

JessieMcJessie · 04/01/2016 14:32

Unless you're a property lawyer, you should take legal advice on the terms on which he occupies the house as I don't think it's quite as simple as you granting him a lease, since a lease usually implies sole occupation by the tenant of a whole property or part thereof, whereas you, the Landlord, will be sharing his living and sleeping space. Not saying it can't be documented legally and your interests fully protected but it's a bit more complex than renting out a room or taking a lodger.

AnyFucker · 04/01/2016 14:34

wouldn't op be subject to taxation on the property if she "leases" the property to him as a landlord ?

Have you thought this through, op ?

HPsauciness · 04/01/2016 14:37

I still don't get it. If and when you marry, then you can't have a lease to your marital partner, can you- surely they then can register home rights over their marital home, especially if they have children who have to live in that home.

If he has complex tax affairs, and your assets could be seized, then surely having a joint asset (a house which cannot be completely separate legally during marriage) would be more risky than your current situation.

I am not a lawyer, as is probably obvious, but I simply can't understand why you want to tie yourself legally to this man through marriage, if you have spent so much time and effort not tying yourself to him legally to date!

HPsauciness · 04/01/2016 14:38

Do the professional advisors suggest you marry him?

ValancyJane · 04/01/2016 14:40

Hmm, I think you need to talk to him. It's not unreasonable to ask when he realistically sees himself being ready to get engaged/married. If finances are a worry for him, it might be that he's wanting to get the house sorted first, but him being defensive isn't a good sign.

I brought this up with my DP recently, we own our house recently and I'm expecting our first child this month. We've talked about marriage a lot of times, and knew we were both on the same page. It came up this weekend, after a bit of a morbid chat about wills etc over a family dinner (long story) and on the drive home I said to him that I felt getting married was more important to me with the baby, I'd like to have the legal side of things tied up and I'd like us all to have the same name. He'd been thinking along the same lines, so we agreed that at some point this year we'll probably nip to the registry office with our immediate family and tie the knot. But he knew that I don't really want a big wedding etc, is it possible that the cost element is concerning him at the moment?

Asskicker · 04/01/2016 14:41

Earlier you said

Asskicker - thats it. I dont want him to do because I said so.

Well you aren't on the same page the marriage. So either you have the chat and accept that when he asks it will be prompted by you.

Or stop getting annoyed upset and wait for however long it takes.

I think it's really unfair to get mad because he isn't doing something you want, when you haven't had a proper conversation about it.

sofato5miles · 04/01/2016 14:41

Jeez. Don't marry this guy!! You need to have your finances utterly separate.

JohnLuther · 04/01/2016 14:44

DP being done for tax evasion is a pretty big thing to miss out, why do you want to tie yourself to him legally whilst this is going on, unless you can wait until it is resolved? In which case why are you getting upset?

Asskicker · 04/01/2016 14:47

And yes I wouldn't marry him or plan a wedding until his taxes are sorted.

It maybe genuine. He may not want to co own a property as he knows some shit is coming his way. He may not want to get married incase you get smeared with that shit.

But he may be spinning you a tale. But I wouldn't put my partner in a position where they could end up clearing up my financial mess.

If he really is a decent genuine guy, I can see why he hasn't proposed. Why would you with the tax issue hanging over you? He may not want to drag you into it.

lunar1 · 04/01/2016 14:48

I imagine he's not wanting to make plans/financial commitments until the tax stuff is sorted.

VaticanAssassin · 04/01/2016 14:54

OP, you have said "I am a lawyer, never stand to lose half of my house- i have that sorted out legally.

And also say:

In terms of future childcare, our intention is that he would be the "house husband" and look after the children. I love my job and my future earning capacity is greater than his, so it makes sense.

So if you marry, in the unfortunate event that you divorce, he has to pick up and leave 'your' house, and presumably leave the children that he has spent years being the SAHD to?

Maybe you have your answer, OP.

WoodHeaven · 04/01/2016 14:57

I don't know. If I was in that position, I would have made it clear to the OP that I'm worried about the tax stuff and don't want her involved with it.

I'm wondering if the issue here isn't one of miscommunication or rather poor communiaction, with each of you carrying some worries of some sort (lack of commitment and whatever else) but not telling the other one about it.

How does that sound to you OP?

Sallyingforth · 04/01/2016 14:58

There are two types of living-together relationship. Both are perfectly reasonable and satisfactory. Any sensible couple will discuss together how they wish to live.

  1. Both partners wish to get married, and do so.
  2. Both partners wish to remain unmarried, and do so.

Anything else will inevitably lead to resentment and unhappiness, as many previous posters on MN will testify.