Mother wants to bring a chicken to my vegetarian Christmas dinner

[queenofthepirates]

That's kind of it in a nutshell. We've invited 10 people over for Christmas dinner including my mother. We're veggies and I've put together a lovely Scandi veggie menu. She's told me she's bringing a chicken and I've said please don't. Firstly because we're veggie and I don't really want a dead bird on the table and secondly I can't see why she can't last a few hours without meat.

My relationship with her is very strained this year, she's been pretty horrible to me and I'm getting to the end of my tether.

AIBU to tell her not to bring meat or stay at home? She could always come over after lunch if she's going to insist.

if you really can't eat anything other than meat, decline the invite

I think you've missed the point a little, Micah by not reading the thread. Most people are not absolutely defending the right to only eat meat, merely if it is a compulsory vegetarian day, then the vegetable dishes on offer have to appeal to everyone who is about to eat them. OP's menu doesn't sound so good for a Christmas Day lunch, even some of the vegetarians on the thread have agreed that.

There are lots of vegetable-only dishes that could be eaten and would be suitable for a Christmas lunch or dinner. I think the OP is being difficult as she doesn't appear to like her Mum very much, so is merely trying to make a point and let her Mum know that although she has been invited for Christmas Day, the OP doesn't really want her there and is going out of her way to make the Mum feel uncomfortable. OP could make a bit more of an effort and offer more of a variety of vegetable dishes. People who eat meat don't, generally speaking, eat only meat. They eat vegetables too (I know - amazing, isn't it)? . OP's menu sounds to me to be more like a vegetable side-dish, whether accompanying a meat offering, or other vegetable dishes.

If I were OP's Mum, I would by now be declining the invitation, as it is quite clear that she's not really welcome. What a shame. I understand that OP has a difficult relationship with her Mum. So do many of us (me included). But my Mum is still my Mum and I would not go out of my way to make her feel uncomfortable on a day when you should be trying to make people feel happy and welcome.

I notice OP has not returned to the thread for some time. Hopefully, she is revising her Skandifakian menu a little and possibly adding a couple of alternatives. Lorraine Pascale made a lovely-looking veggie dish on Saturday Kitchen this morning. It would make a lovely starter and had Christmassy cranberry and apple flavours.

merely if it is a compulsory vegetarian day, then the vegetable dishes on offer have to appeal to everyone who is about to eat them.

Firstly, the OP has talked only in terms of Christmas dinner - nothing to suggest a 'compulsory vegetarian day'. Secondly, the OP has offered nothing to suggest that any of her guests have objected to the menu. Some people are assuming that because the mother wants to bring chicken, she is objecting to the menu. No evidence so far that that is the case.

MrsKoala, I don't think there were any peperamis around in the Palaeolithic era! Really not good for you to eat that much processed meat, you know. You'd do much better to carry around some unsalted nuts or a bit of fruit.

The vegetarian Christmas thread I remember from last year was the woman who was going to stay with her very posh inlaws and the previous year hadn't been given anything to eat at all other than a few vegetables. I forget whether she was pregnant or breastfeeding, but her husband didn't appear to notice, never mind care, that she was eating almost nothing and nor did anybody else. Sounded utterly grim. Was that the same one, Ceic? I don't think the OP on that one ever came back to update on how last Christmas turned out. The consensus MN advice was that she should take her own food with her and heat it up for herself, or failing that keep a food parcel in their room.

Being mixed race and having friends from different cultures, I've always been used to the idea that different homes have different rules.

When we're out in the wider world, all cultures may coexist, but each home may have its own religious / ethnic customs and language.
It would be rude & arrogant when I visit, to expect them to all adopt my secular humanist omnivore default, at Christmas or any other time.

e.g. 15 of us from work enjoyed Christmas dinner at a restaurant recently.
. My Muslim chum who sat next to me chose alcohol-free beer and a vegetarian meal
. The Jain mate opposite me also had vegetarian, but with real ale
. My Hindu neighbour and I had salmon; he drank alcohol, I didn't.
. Other colleagues had gammon or beef, plus booze.
. We're all non-smokers.

We had a marvellous evening together; noone was offended by the different choices of others.

However, if I visit any of their homes, I respect their individual culture and follow the house rules.
I've never been asked to join prayers to Allah, but I wouldn't chant "Dawkins is Great" and then chump a bacon buttie.

Nero Wolfe: "A guest is a jewel resting on the cushion of hospitality"

I have no idea of the 'science' Gasp. I just use that term as it's seems to be roughly what i eat and most people know it. I certainly don't do it because i think i should be eating what our paleo forefathers ate. As i said i don't go to peoples houses much but do keep peperamis in my bag for emergency hunger pangs. So i probably eat about 2-3 mini ones a week. I also carry mini cheeses, nuts and often a boiled egg if i know i'll be out a while. (i don't eat fruit really either)

Firstly, the OP has talked only in terms of Christmas dinner - nothing to suggest a 'compulsory vegetarian day'. Secondly, the OP has offered nothing to suggest that any of her guests have objected to the menu. Some people are assuming that because the mother wants to bring chicken, she is objecting to the menu No evidence so far that that is the case

And no evidence to the contrary, either. From the OP's opening post, she has categorically stated she does not want chicken at her table. This suggests to me that the vegetarian meal is compulsory, unless it is only chicken that is the objectionable item. I wonder if the Mum could take along a slice of beef/lamb/turkey. I'm guessing the reaction would be the same if the Mum suggested this. It seems we'll never know for certain, as the OP has scarpered.

We often have get-togethers with friends. We all take pre-prepared dishes to each others' homes, especially if someone may have a dietary requirement (no, I know meat is not a dietary requirement, but in this particular case it is a preference for a family member for a special-occasion lunch). It also eases the burden of the host having to do all of the work. Taking along a contribution to an occasion is perfectly normal (in my circle of friends, anyway). Cultural differences and allergies notwithstanding (I also wouldn't take a bacon sandwich to the house of a Jewish friend, nor a beef casserole to the house of a Hindu friend, for instance, that's a bit of an infantile comparison), but in this particular case the vegetarianism appears to be a personal choice, neither cultural nor one associated with allergies (from what I can glean).

There is another thread going at the moment (haven't joined in and have lost it now, as MN website has been playing up a bit today), where a meat-eating Christmas host is wondering whether the vegetable options will be adequate or suitable for her vegetarian guest(s). Her suggestions sound delicious, and I'd personally be happy with all the vegetable dishes for that lunch, even without any meat.

It is all about making an invited guest feel welcome, as many others have said before.

Dear me, that menu would make my heart sink (sorry, OP, but like a lot of people I loathe beetroot, and there is nothing tasty or filling about the other items either). That said, I still would not bring a chicken to a vegetarian's house. I would just dive into the chip shop for a nice F&C on the way home!

You might want to run that menu by your many guests and see what they think, otherwise you could end up with a lot of fixed smiles and polite picking/pushing-of-food-round-plates.

If I HAD to do a vegge Xmas meal, I would be thinking about perhaps a tasty baked dish involving grilled cheese like halloumi... or some nice roast potatoes and Yorkshire puddings with vegetarian gravy... or perhaps a spicy cashew nut casserole with lots of delicious flavors in there, and fragrant rice to go with it. And have something creamy and rich for dessert with cream and strawberries and stuff, so people feel like they've had a real treat. Rice pudding sounds like school dinners, sorry.

That's the thread I was thinking about, Gasp. I think you are right that the OP never did come back. It did sound grim.

Evans
I also wouldn't take a bacon sandwich to the house of a Jewish friend, nor a beef casserole to the house of a Hindu friend, for instance, that's a bit of an infantile comparison

Not sure why you think it's an 'infantile comparison' - vegetarianism is on a par with religious beliefs.

It is all about making an invited guest feel welcome

It's about whether a vegetarian of 25 years should be obliged to accept meat in her meat free house, against her wishes.

Why should an adult making an i formed decision on ethical grounds have less respect than someone brought up by parents to believe in a certain religion ?

informed < smacks iPad>

My Indian colleague who is of the Jain religion is a lovely young man, but why should his vegetarianism be respected and not those of my 2 equally intelligent and lovely colleagues who decided as adults to become vegetarian on ethical grounds ?

So if I visit him, I don't take emergency meat supplies, but my 2 colleagues just have to lump it if they want the pleasure of my company ?

I love Christmas dinner with turkey and all the trimmings. If my grown up daughter decided to be veggie, I'd make a choice to either go and eat the vegetarian meal or to have my full on meat feast at home and go for vegetarian tea. Or to do my turkey dinner on Christmas Eve or Boxing Day. I would not take my own food to someone else's house unless I had a medical need to.

I don't like the way my SIL cooks her roasties (too hard, not soft inside, not crunchy enough) but I wouldn't dream of taking my own plateful round there!!

The OP has disappeared and I don't blame her. but I just wanted to say - remember a year or two ago when everyone on mn was raving about Hugh FW's vegetarian book? It's full of hearty stuff with protein in it. It's not the only good veggie cook book in the world, but given that it exists, and given that you have to have been living in a hole not to know about it, there is no excuse for that watery flab-fucken thing

I suppose my point is that in the mother's position I would consider it arguably less offensive to say "Can I bring a chicken, as you would never cook that?" rather than "can I bring a vegetarian main course which might taste of something and make me feel like I've had a decent dinner, because although that is what you may think you are making, frankly my dear, you are not"

OP, would you prefer it if your mother said the latter?

that watery flab-fucken thing

That's really sad. It sounds like she wants to assert her authority, as other people have said. She needs to be in control, and have control over you.

Anyone with any heart would not suggest bringing a dead animal to a vegetarian dinner.

I for one hated Christmas dinner. A big dead turkey on the table in front of me and everyone in my 'family' would make comments, laugh, try to put it on my plate etc. And the smell, it turns my stomach even now to remember it. I hated every second and couldn't wait to get out. Just an example of their narcissism and horribleness.

Be strong, stand your ground. In your house, it's your rules, right? Didn't she ever say that to you when you were growing up 'under my roof you obey my rules'? Well if she doesn't like your rules she shouldn't be allowed to come.

My SIL is a vegetarian. My mother isn't always great at catering to her needs (sometimes she puts in a lot of effort, other times she almost completely forgets). I suspect this is because fundamentally she thinks that vegetarians are fussy (fussiness is a big sin in my mother's book, she went through rationing as a child and it seems to have led to 'if you don't eat everything you are given you are a bit of a bad person' thinking). She also doesn't agree with either the ethical position or the 'can't eat cuddly animals' that some vegetarians follow (especially teenage faddy ones). We grew up with a lot of exposure to farms and the understanding that the lambs in the fields should have a happy life but were fundamentally there to feed people.

My brother and SIL entertained my mum last Christmas and made sure that she had a nice traditional meal while they ate (no doubt equally nice) vegetarian food. I don't think that Christmas is quite the same as other meals. We would never leave my mother on her own, however annoying she may be from time to time. That means for us atheists finding her a lovely service and dropping her off and picking her up, and for us laze about in our PJ families getting dressed and eating at a time when she expects to be fed.

The OP is long gone but I do hope she changes her mind about her menu unless she is really very sure that all her guests will enjoy it. If I was told in advance I'd be having a Ukrainian meal I might expect Borsht, but lots of people don't like beetroot very much so wouldn't like the soup and a main with so much stuff in it is surely very risky? My dh hates mint for example, and mushrooms and cheese is a bit of an odd combination surely? I'd do stuffed squash as a nice side for a Christmas meal, but not expect everyone to eat it.

I actually rather fancy the flab-fucken and may give it a go this week. But, that's it's problem for me - it's not fancy enough. It's Saturday night dinner when I've got a bit more time to try something out. And yes, it's be a side dish. Surely, as a main, you'd need to make about 3 of the things.

It's packed with nuts and cheese. I think it's probably a lot more filling than most posters on this thread have realised. I also plan to make it this week and will report back!

I like vegetarian food and often eat meals without meat. But not for a xmas meal. I like a traditional meal, otherwise it is just like any meal with family.

And why does everything have to be seen as someone exerting control? Maybe people just want to have a meal they will enjoy?

I would be quite happy to eat that food, but not on Christmas Day. There is nothing traditional there at all.

I got as far as reading the first page and got so pissed off at the replies - yes she should be able to bring a chicken if you're not willing to provide food that she likes. I assume that a vegetarian attending an omnivore's meal would expect a vegetarian option to be provided for them.