AIBU to want dd to have traintrack braces but no teeth removed?

[Italiangreyhound]

AIBU to want dd to have traintrack braces but no teeth removed?

The orthodontist says my dd (11) needs train track braces to straighten her teeth.

The waiting list is about 18 months.

Since about 8 days old dd has sucked her thumb and nothing I have ever been able to do has helped her to stop (despite her saying she wants to stop!). So we have 18 months for her to stop so she can get her teeth straightened.

When she finally does stop thumb sucking and gets to the top of the list the orthodontist says she will need train track braces to straighten her teeth and in order to do this the orthodontist will take out two teeth.

I did not really think anything of it until a friend told me that they don't need to take out teeth nowadays with traintrack braces.

Can anyone tell me how it has worked for them or their child, please?

DD is terrified of having teeth removed and if it is not necessary I would rather avoid it.

I'm surprised our orthodontist didn't talk to us about the option not to remove teeth, especially as the NHS website seems to suggest it is not very common tp remove teeth now- " But, as a result of recent advances in orthodontic treatment, removing teeth has become much less common."

My dd has only had one baby tooth removed and that virtually fell out as it was stuck at an odd angle - think 'Nanny McFee'!

www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Orthodontics/Pages/Howitisperformed.aspx

"Removing teeth

In some cases, it may be necessary to remove a tooth to correct the position and appearance of nearby teeth. But, as a result of recent advances in orthodontic treatment, removing teeth has become much less common.

However, if baby teeth have been extracted, there is a greater likelihood that adult teeth will need to be extracted as part of orthodontic treatment."

Thanks.

Orthodontists who have undertaken speciality training are registered on the General Dental Council website www.gdc-uk.org/Dentalprofessionals/Specialistlist/Pages/default.aspx

Just to get an idea of how my dd's teeth look think Jodie Foster in Freaky Friday, maybe!

DS completed treatment,no problem, DD baled out early as treatment was more complex than she had expected.
Subsequently she was treated paid privately (at great cost) for adult treatment by non specialist orthodontist(!)

As it was explained to me, all teeth are different shape and size, they fit together differently and sit in different bone arrangements, so to me it stands to reason no one brace treatment fits all.
I would suggest the visit you have just had with your orthodontist was more an assessment visit. This was to check your child is dentally fit for treatment and to check that the tooth and bone arrangement fall into a catagory the NHS will fund treatment for. It would have been assessed where best to offer your child treatment, eg. routine treatment with a local orthodontist or complicated treatment in a consultant unit. Also at this visit would be to outline any possible treatment and check that you are interested in proceeding with brace treatment.
When your child's name reaches the top of the list, a specialist orthodontist should explain all reasonable treatment options in language both you and your child understand. Any extractions should be justified as part of the proposed treatment plan and you should both understand why this may be the best option for you both.
Remember the orthodontist is not privy to what is going on in your heads so if your concerns and questions are not addressed during the treatment planning and consenting process ..... Ask it's a never forget it's a two way process of equal power!

I know from experience if your child is not fully onboard with brace treatment from the start it can be a really hard slog and you may not end up finishing treatment. So I would use your waiting time to try and empower your daughter to ask her questions directly to the orthodontist or maybe start a list of both your questions take with you.
Good luck!

I had 4 teeth out (2 top, 2 bottom) before my braces were put on, and it was fine. My wonky teeth were pushed and pulled straight so they filled the holes left by the removed teeth.
My sister didn't have teeth removed because she refused and now her teeth look exactly the same as they did before braces.

Sorry my last post, posted before grammar check, in error!
Hit my limit in multi tasking!

My braces were for medical reasons : my front teeth were not moved at all

My orthodontist was the professor at a well known London dental school.
He never suggested wearing the retainer for more than a year after the tramlines came off.

That doesn't mean it is the case for everyone though does it? Not by a long way.

My DC won't need a retainer for more than a year or so after they have stopped growing but that is because they started treatment at 7.

I have 13 yr old DTSs. Both have train tracks. One did not need any teeth removed. One needed 4 taken out due to teeth being too 'crowded'. So I would imagine it depends on the reason for taking them out.

DD also needed 4 out when she had train tracks 4 years ago. Her teeth are now beautiful apart from a chip along the bottom of a front tooth from when she was swigging out of a bottle of wine in the street and slipped over after the braces were taken off .

DTS2 was not happy about having his teeth taken out (understatement as he has LDs), but he was absolutely fine. I offered my hands to squeeze which he didn't need! He also did not want braces (neither DSs did) but they have had them for 3 months now with no problems, totally used to them.

I would advise on a good electric toothbrush when they are fitted as they need to clean their teeth really well and use sticks to clean under the braces to remove food traces which the DSs don't do despite my nagging but last time they were checked, ortho said teeth were fine which I put down to them using electric toothbrushes.

Francie re I know from experience if your child is not fully onboard with brace treatment from the start it can be a really hard slog and you may not end up finishing treatment. So I would use your waiting time to try and empower your daughter to ask her questions directly to the orthodontist or maybe start a list of both your questions take with you.

Excellent advice.

WhatTheHellDoIDoNoww thanks. She uses an electric toothbrush now.

Feeling a bit worried now, the idea she could go through all this and end up wit the same teeth!

My dd will be 16 when her braces come off. The orthodontist has said she should wear retainers for two years after that. He said if she'd been referred earlier her treatment would have been quicker as her jaws were growing faster, but that treatment too early often means two sets of braces are needed as growth at puberty can bring about too much change. I suspect it totally depends on both the issue and the treatment option. My dd has done really well with her springs and expander - the other option for her would have been to wait until she'd stopped growing and then have her lower jaw broken and reset.

Oh and her teeth looked a bit like the ones in this link

It really really depends on the position of the teeth before treatment as to how quick and bad relapse will be if retainers aren't worn. Some changes retain themselves WG if there's one tooth out of place (say a top tooth sitting behind the bottom teeth) and its moved, the rest of the teeth will keep it where it is.

Do remember that almost everyone's teeth move as they age. It's called medial drift and has nothing to do with orthodontics or wisdom teeth. The lower incisors can start to crowd because of this and retainers will prevent this as well.

The teeth are genetically programmed to live where nature put them, like your hair is programmed to be a certain colour. Moving them (or dying your hair) doesn't change the genetics.

Unless you are a qualified Orthodontist OP, then yes you are being unreasonable. All three of my DCs had orthodontic treatment, two starting when they were 12, the other starting when he was 17 (he has Asperger syndrome and didn't feel able to cope with the treatment until then). All three had some teeth removed. A lot depends on the complexity of the problem. Mine all had big teeth and small jawbones, which was causing overcrowding.
Every case is different, so some children will need teeth removed, others won't.
If your daughter is reluctant it might be better to delay treatment anyway. DS2 had been referred to the orthodontist earlier, but when we explained the situation he was happy to keep DS' name on file until DS was ready to begin treatment.

I guess the question about teeth being removed depends loads on the teeth/jaw/issue your DD has and therefore what other options are available to her. I would suggest your DD talks with the orthodontist as she'll be the one undertaking the treatment. You state in your OP that it's less common for teeth to be removed but clearly it's still done and I would imagine totally depends on the situation. Plus the orthodontist will probably want a really great outcome which teeth removal might be the thing needed, but maybe a good outcome could be obtained without it. It's all about a conversation with your orthodontist and a discussion about expectations.

I had 14 teeth removed (mostly baby teeth but several adult teeth too) all through primary school and early secondary. I then had fixed braces top and bottom ending with little elastic bands between them (which I didn't like, nor wore). Finishing off with a removable brace. It wasn't awful having teeth removed, once you've had one done, you know what to expect and I had to do it for the treatment to work. I have good alignment although they've moved slightly over the years (now nearly 40yo), but nothing major. I'm very lucky I had free treatment over many years to have a good outcome.

Thanks so much everyone.

I always wonder about retainers. I had train track braces for 18-24 months as a teen (around age 13-15y), having had 6 or 7 teeth removed beforehand. Noone had retainers when I was younger - well, no one I knew of. I finished my treatment around 1988 time. My teeth have not moved and are still perfectly straight.

However DD currently has braces and will have for similar length of time; similar ages too. She had teeth removed. She does have far more issues than I had - teeth in swapped places, etc. However, she has been told she will need retainers after her braces - initially nightly, then reducing down gradually to 1-2 times a week, but for ever.

Are retainers new, and do they really make a difference?

Noone had retainers when I was younger - well, no one I knew of.
I am 53 and most teenagers just had retainers rather than train tracks back in the 70s. I had retainer for about 2 years, had 4 teeth out and no problems since. My problem was overcrowding and dracula eye teeth.
DD 18 just finished her treatment and now on retainer had similar overcrowding but both top and bottom and her eye teeth were not as high as mine. She also had an impacted tooth that never broke through the gum, so that was removed with 3 others.

bruffin - I meant the "after train tracks" type retainer rather than the instead of type ones. The ones you have for ever for night time wear.

Might be something to do with the fact that dentists in the UK are more likely than any other dentist in the world to be sued.
A friend of mine is being sued because of orthodontic relapse. It probably won't succeed but an out of court settlement is highly likely as well as all of the stress involved. She's in bits.

So saying "wear a retainer for ever" puts the responsibility on the patient and not the orthodontist.
Dentistry is in a pretty poor state in this country; is be surprised if NHS provision is around in 10 years time. [rant rant rant]