To love the idea of scrapping all benefits and just giving everyone £500 a month

[DyslexicScientist]

Like Finland are going to do.

Would get rid of all the east that goes on with means testing and would cost about the same.

Would be much fairer as the current system does discriminate against certain demographics.

Good idea op I like it.

Mouldy. Is that you Dave

What about those who can never work? The most vulnerable adults in society. They will always be the worst off.

In theory I really like the idea.

To work in this country it would have to be more money and you would need 2 tiers to cover those that have a disability or that have disabled children.

If it was set at a level that people could afford to live but only at a basic standard then you would do away with all the moaning about benefits because everyone would be getting it, you cut the cost of administering benefits because everyone would get it.

There are lots of people at the moment that are on benefits and simply can't afford to move off them in to work - with a system like this the safety net is there - you can take a part time job and improve your lifestyle without the risk of starving.

I think it could revolutionize the way people live and work - for example if we had an extra x amount per week one of us would probably work part time - thus freeing up a part time position for someone else to do.

Companies would have to be more flexible with things like job shares but it really could work.

The down side to all of this is that Finland has about 5 million people living there while we have almost 65 million - that's a lot of money to find!

The subject gets bun fighty because people are imagining op sitting there getting off thinking about the poor getting poorer whilst rubbing her hands with glee. Pretty fucking sick if you ask me.!!

What? Why?

She doesn't sound gloaty, she's starting a conversation.

You couldn't have £500 to replace all benefits in the UK. Maybe £500 would work if DLA, HB, CTB AND Child B were kept outside of it, but it would be dicey.

Discussing the level of CI and what to include/exclude (in those imaginary Cameron-free utopia) is part of the conversation, isn't it?

Lots of Guardian articles about this idea. Right-wing benefit-bashing rag that it is

Something has to be done. I had a tax statement last week and couldn't believe that about a third is spent on welfare. Not including education or NHS. Where the fuck is it all going? Most people shouldn't rely on any type of welfare surely?

It's how I feel strawberry.

Quite a few people rely on pensions angelos which makes up the biggest proportion of welfare.

What about those who can never work? The most vulnerable adults in society. They will always be the worst off.

Yes, that's why I think health, disability (and housing) benefits would have to be paid in addition. Precisely because of the 'extra costs' issue for working or non-working disabled people and to recognise that working isn't a path up available to everyone.

It would be so much simpler like that.

No one's really answered the question though about the people who can't work for whom £500 wouldn't cover their living - what are Finland doing about those people?

George Osborne has done a sneaky thing labelling all those different payments 'welfare' and sending out those pie charts angelos. You're reacting exactly how he wanted you to,

hedgehog - £500 a month would barely cover your heating bill? wow.

Something has to be done. I had a tax statement last week and couldn't believe that about a third is spent on welfare. Not including education or NHS. Where the fuck is it all going? Most people shouldn't rely on any type of welfare surely?

Half of it goes on pensions.

I would prefer money to targeted at people who really need it rather than being given to people like me who can manage perfectly well without it.

We could adjust for that via income tax.

The next largest chunk being housing benefit which is mainly paid to working people.

hedgehog - we cross posted - really curious to know if that heating bill thing was right!

I thought 1/3 of welfare goes on pensions, I think a lot of people don't include pensions in welfare in their head though IYSWIM.

The next largest chunk being housing benefit which is mainly paid to working people.

And the BTL investors would scream if that was cut.

So true Strawberry...

And the BTL investors would scream if that was cut.

Yes stl! I agree totally with what your saying on this thread.

Especially with income tax being adjusted. I'm genuinely shocked by some of the ill thought out replys on here.

I can see the theory behind it. I can see how it would take away the benefits bashing attitude & be much simpler to organise. I can also see how it would mean that nobody will be better off on benefits than in a low paying job. As any wages earnt in any job would be 'extra'.

However, I can't get my head around the idea of a couple earning £100k + per year being given £1000 per month for no reason and a single parent, or someone who is disabled & unable to work, having to pay for absolutely everything with £500 per month. How can that ever work?

hedgehog - £500 a month would barely cover your heating bill? wow.

Yep. It's approximately £400 per month depending how cold it is. Normal winter temp is between -10 and -20, and I've experienced 1 winter where it dropped to -28 for a week.

Hedgehog £100 per week for heating. Thats absurd. Never again will I moan about paying £20 per week.