To think that kids be left in the bath...

[Flashbangandgone]

... While I go to another room upstairs from the age of 4?

I left my dcs in the bath alone when I was 100% sure they knew how to react if they had their head under water, or I knew they wouldn't panic, I k ew they knew how to stand up again etc...
So that was after a LOT of swimming.
I'm sure though that they were under 4yo. A bit earlier with dc1 who loved water and was very comfortable, a bit later with dc2.

I put my DDs (3 and 5) into the bath together - I wash their hair and behind their ears, then either play for a bit or tidy up in the kitchen and other rooms. Our house is small and all on one level, so I'm never more than a few feet from them.

What usually happens is as soon as I turn my back half the bathwater ends up on the floor, though...

Gruntfuttock there is literally no room. I could have a go I guess but I can see them from the next room while I'm drying the baby so it's a mitigated risk.

Purple yes that would be my first instinct. I just wondered if I should be doing back slaps first etc? Especially if it looked like they were choking in that specific moment.

Tracy in that case you call 999.

And if possible you take a course on first aid fur children BEFORE anything like this happens (should be mandatory IMO)

If you call 999, they will tell you what to do (of course the first thing is to take them out if the bath and put them in recovery position)

tracy anyone who's not breathing needs cpr regardless of the cause.

No! Don't do that.

Check for a pulse first.

CPR is if the heart stops, you only do CPR on dead people to bring them back.

If they're simply not breathing and have a pulse, do rescue breaths. Tilt their head back and breath in their mouth every five seconds. Once they cough/vomit, flip them to their side.

If they have no pulse then do CPR, breath in then do chest compression right where their rib cage connects. You'll hear ribs breaking, if you don't, you're not pushing hard enough. The goal is to "squeeze" the heart and simulate pumping to get blood moving through it, to do that, you need to push hard enough to squeeze the heart (and be low enough so it's at a good angle to squeeze through the arteries instead of down in the cavities).

For a kid it's 30 quick compressions to one breath.

Please take a CPR course though so you know how to do it right. Otherwise it won't work.

Most areas run child first aid courses. Ask your health visitor.

senpai you're out of date. Unless you're trained to look for one, you don't check for a pulse after you've established the person is not breathing (after opening their airway). You also shouldn't be trying to hear ribs breaking.

It is a great idea for everyone to go on a first aid course so they know how to do cpr if they need to. The absolute most important thing is to phone for an ambulance.

Agree. You don't check the pulse just the breathing as even very experienced doctors can that wrong in that sort of circumstances.

Yes, and let's ban alcohol too because a few people die of alcohol poisoning.

Or you could stop with the hyperbole and look at the facts.

Maybe you could. Hmm?

The facts are that drowning is not common in children over 3 who are left in the bath, that a few seconds is more than likely to be enough time to reach them, and that they are very unlikely to soip under the Walter at that age (unless they delayed physical development).

It's important to know about delayed drowning so you can know what to watch for in the extremely unlikely event of a physically capable and independent child, well used to water, getting into difficulties in their own bathtub.

Just like you should know what to look for in case of a bang to the head leading to concussion, but not make your child wear a helmet all the time.

If baths were so dangerous that children who were at school could not be left unattended for a single second, then it would be foolish to bathe them at all.

They are not that dangerous. Pretending that they are is hyperbole.

No, that's current advice.

I'm in America, so it might be different. Right now the big change here is whether to do rescue breaths or not.

CPR is for cardiac arrest to keep blood flowing until paramedics arrive. If your heart is already beating it's doing that for you. You're not listening or trying to break ribs, but you should hear them as you press hard enough to actually squeeze the heart. Otherwise, again, you're not compressing hard enough. It's not a gentle procedure.

Drowning/overdose/anything not caused by cardiac arrest still says to check for breathing, if none do rescue breaths, check for a pulse, and do chest compressions if there is none.

If you're not trained to check for a pulse, then frankly you're not trained to do CPR either. You could quite easily stop a beating heart doing compressions like that on a healthy heart because you're messing up how it's pumping blood.

BathtimeFunkster Fine. You can be careless with your child, it's no skin off my back what another parent does. I will be vigilant with mine and remain in the room until she's around 6-7 and expresses a need for privacy, because if something as simple and easy as sitting down and spending a little time with your kid can easily prevent an accident, I'll do it. You may not. I choose to prioritize my child over laundry.

*rescue breaths during CPR or not.

senpai the uk advice is not to check for a pulse before starting cpr. I assumed you were in the uk because the vast majority of mumsnetters are.

If you go on a uk first aid course you will be taught to shout for help and get an ambulance, check for a response, open the airway, check for breathing and start CPR if there isn't any. The St. John's ambulance website is good for videos, and they run first aid course nationwide.

*forgot five rescue breaths after establishing they're not breathing

I'd be more worried about my kid growing up to be a nasty passive aggressive cunt than drowning if that was the example she was getting every day.

In the meantime I'll continue teaching my children to be independent and not need their mommy around all the time until an age when they are more than able to sit in a few inches of water and wash themselves without me hovering over them like the Angel of doom teaching them that they are constantly in mortal danger and just never be out of my sight.

It's like those parents who thinks you should hold a child's hand crossing the road until they are in secondary school and like to get little bitchy digs in about people who value things other than paranoid hovering.

I assumed medical advice was just global.

Yes, here step number one is still call 911.

Hmm.. I looked it up, current guidelines for untrained people is to simply start chest compression, no rescue breathing.

But if you've take a class here they train you to check for breathing, do breaths, then check for a pulse before beginning the compressions, then when you do breaths again check for a pulse again before another round of compressions.

If it's you're unsure yes do compressions, a good pulse will be pretty obvious.

I'll swing by the local fire department and ask. My last class was only a couple years ago, so it could very well have changed. :)

BathtimeFunkster I already said what you do with your child is of no consequence to me.

I just choose to prioritize my child over housework. That's all.

No one is making you do the same.

I just choose to prioritize my child over housework. That's all.

What a cunty thing to say.

I'm going to take it as a compliment that anybody thinks I prioritise housework above anything.

But really, coming on here to scaremonger and talk hyperbolic shit about risks you clearly don't understand is a bit dickish.

Just because you want to raise fearful, dependent children who can't use the bathroom alone because it fulfils some deep void inside you to stop them from growing up is no reason to make other people fearful of their bathtubs.

You know, I also make DD wear a seat belt and use a proper car seat. I suppose I must be paranoid about cars too, and scaremongering when I tell people to buckle their kids in properly. :)

Ah, well. What's a girl to do?

I suppose I must tend to the deep void within my heart that can apparently only be filled by following simple safety guidelines.

Oh dear this got a bit wanky didn't it.

Lol . . . and yes, yes it did ;)

Delayed drowning is rare, but it happens. That's why it's important to watch your child and know they inhaled water so you know what signs to watch out for. It's important to be near by, because if you're more than a second away, you're enough seconds away to make it fatal. If those children you saw slip under didn't come right back up, you'd bet that an adult would be quickly whipping them up. That's the entire point.

I'll have a look at delayed drowning...not something that was I previously aware of so thank you.

As for the 'more than a second
Is dangerous', at my daughter's (4) swimming lessons, they take place in the 'baby pool' which is about 2 foot deep. There is a teacher and a lifeguard at the side of the pool, with 4 to 6children... If one went 'under' it would be identified and dealt with pretty quickly, but unless the teacher was directly helping that child at that moment, the delay could be 10-15 seconds, perhaps a bit longer... Especially as the first instinct would be that the child is playing (children are always bobbing under for a couple of seconds). Only after a few more seconds would someone (who wasn't focussing on the child the moment they went under) be aware there was an issue, with another few seconds to wade across and pull them out.

Swimming lessons like this are common (at least in the UK) once a child has reached their 3rd birthday. It would seem as though you are implying that the entire swimming lesson 'industry' in the UK is operating unsafely, which may be the case, but it's quite a big thing to imply!

Good post OP

I get where you're coming from, unlucky
I had a friend who drowned. She went swimming and had an epileptic fit.

As has been pointed out on this thread, accidents can happen anywhere, anytime.
I'm interested to know if the slippages occur with or without bathmats. We always use one - a full length one.