To wonder if teacher was unreasonable

[Parrotparties]

A good friend is upset and annoyed after a phone call with a teacher, basically her DD and others were standing round the door at the end of lesson and teacher told them to go and sit down, when they didn't the teacher put her hand on friends DD, friends DD shouted don't touch me.

If my teenage daughter came home pulling a stunt like that i would say you shouldn't have been a little shit and done as you were told
Your friend is BVU and obviously her precious kid can do no wrong. I wouldn't teach secondary these days for all the tea in China - the concept of respect is mostly lost!

Read the thread mummy-the op is thereafter in this scenario.

The op is the teacher not thereafter.

It was a reverse as some people just like to be horrible and I couldn't face it.

Not read all the thread, so apologies and all that if it's moved on. So child doesn't do as she's told, then shouts at the teacher not to touch her when she's only put a hand on her shoulder (according to your OP.)
Sounds like she should have done as she was told in the first bloody place, and if it was my child I'd have no sympathy and be on the teacher's side and be telling said child to do as she was told next time.
No wonder some kids are so entitled and bratty if parents don't back up school and let them get away with all sorts.

OK - just seen some updates. WTF is a reverse? I've been on here ages under different guises but can never get my head around reverses!

It's a tough job, of course, and I've had awful days and incidents that have really affected me too, so I am not at all unsympathetic, please don't get me wrong. But I think pretending to be a parent on mumsnet is a weird way to seek professional support for an incident. It all seems unnecessarily elaborate to do a big reveal, and I'm really not a fan when people have been posting genuine responses.

If the OP is that unsure about triggering abuse memories from a shoulder touch a refresher in her CP training can clarify things for her. She should be using the school systems to seek support or at least her union, or even TES as I mentioned. We are meant to be professionals, there are strategies and concrete measures that can be learned to help with this sort of thing. We don't just make it up as we go along.

OP - There's also the teacher support line www.educationsupportpartnership.org.uk/telephone-support?gclid=Cj0KEQiAm-CyBRDx65nBhcmVtbIBEiQA7zm8lfNNHmVAACCHZVfOF-cV_PzWiVnPYKgfYaUTImoDHoEaAu2G8P8HAQ

Last time this happened to me (in secondary), very similar situation, I was pulled out of my next class, relieved of duties and told a complaint had been made against me. I was not told the nature of it, just that I had to attend a meeting later that day. I was terrified. At the meeting, my line manager, the girl and the DHT were there. The DHT handled it very well, it was all very formal and as he asked the girl to say what had happened, she was constantly changing her story, which he duly queried. I had to give me version. The librarian had also witnessed it, along with other pupils. By the end, she admitted she'd lied because she was getting her phone confiscated (bloody phones).

It's days like that, when your whole career is flashing before your eyes, that you wonder why the hell you are a teacher. I cried buckets afterwards, it was so traumatic. I could have been suspended/lost my job because a wee daft wanted to get me in trouble. That is the only time in my career that I have point blank refused to ever be alone in a room with a pupil ever again. I still had to teach her, but I had a TA present at all times.

I agree with you parrot sometimes whatever you say some people just want to be contrary. I don't blame you for doing a reverse. Hope you feel better now.

As the mother of two 15 year olds, no way could I work with 30 of the fuckers. In fact you've probably got hundreds to manage if you're teaching in secondary. No. Way.

The issue is that, quite rightly, for their own protection, we have been drumming into our children what their rights are that they own their own bodies etc. however, I think that there is a point where they now believe that any contact is against the law. The wily ones will use it to their advantage.

If that had been my child, they will still be standing up nursing the metaphoric boot up the arse they'd just had.

I'm not sure what the solution is tbh - maybe we need to be far more specific when speaking to children about unwanted touches? Maybe we've been too generic?

And this is why I'm leaving the profession. Jumped up, cheeky children who think they can threaten and intimidate. Seriously OP, you haven't done anything wrong apart from assume that the child in question was a decent human being. You put your hand on her shoulder, in front of other people, in order to try and establish some sort of connection so she'd do as you asked. That is very different to the implication she is making by reacting with "don't touch me". A cry for attention and to make you look like you're in the wrong.

It's sad that children have to feel like they're against the very people who dedicate their lives to helping them. I've taught for 15 years and I just can't fathom out why they act like this. They do respond well some of the time but it's after a hell of a lot of ground work, it makes me sad to think teachers have to work so hard to prove to children that they really are on their side. I could understand this attitude back when teachers used to hit students and when punishments were the center of the classroom but it's no longer the case. Most 'punishments' are linked to improving work (and so they should be).

Don't worry OP, the girl reacted like that to humiliate you and won't even be thinking of the incident now.

Who'd be a teacher, eh? Honestly, it's not worth stewing over. You did nothing wrong and stressing about these incidents will drive you stir crazy.

Enjoy your weekend.

It's a reflection on some of the posters on MN that the OP chose to do a reverse thread. People are too bloody scared to post because of the vile keyboard warriors.
Don't even give it a second thought, teenager drama lama.
The pupil in question won't be giving it a second thought this weekend, don't let it spoil yours

OP touching people on the shoulder who have been victims of abuse generally is not a trigger.

Triggers for reminders of abuse are very individual ... From the wallpaper on the wall, to a random comment someone has made which has triggered memories.

Touching somebody on the shoulder is generally considered non invasive. ( I'm a mental health nurse).

I take my hat off to you teachers. I wouldn't go into teacher for £1,000,000 per week. well maybe for thast price I could be oersuaded. Mind. .
All jokes aside it's small wonder so many teachers are leaving the profession. YANBU.
Have a good weekend
and seeing it is the weekend more .

YANBU. She sounds a nightmare.

Out of curiosity, is this behaviour (kids getting up and going to the door 10 minutes before a lesson ends) normal in secondary schools these days? DS1 starts secondary next year, and I'm worrying about everything. My school was very strict, and no one would dare move until the teacher said they could, but that was 30 years ago.

The pupil may well not give it another thought, or think it was a laugh, but I know that when it happened to me, quite a few of the pupils who were there were quite disgusted by her behaviour. The majority of your pupils are not like this.

Jolly, not in my experience. It sounds like they were 'just' being chancers/cheeky.

Jolly - i'm 49 and we had some teachers that you just didn't take any liberties with and others that you just took the piss all the time. Gender and size had nothing to do with it either. I went to quite a rough school though.

One poor teacher (he taught us Russian) whom we called sponge as he talked like he was speaking through a wet sponge had no control at all. I can remember being in the class - which sat up on a hill and saying (about half way through the lesson) "hey sir, that's my bus coming up the road, i'd better go" and I just walked out and went home - now, but that was in the days of the belt etc and he didn't have a chance even then. Little delicate looking history teacher - very hippy dippy in the floaty dresses and patchouli - ruled the class without any bother, a look in your direction was enough.

I work is a SEN school where, sadly, an abnormally high number of our students have suffered abuse (physcial, emotional, sexual and neglect). We try very very hard not to bring these issues to the forefront but there are still times (every day) where we need to touch our students; be it to show them (very slowly and appropriately) that positive touch does exist or to prevent harm.

Dontstopbelievin - a reverse is when the post is written from another person's point of view. So in this situation the OP is a teacher but wrote it from the point of view of the parent.

There is a misconception amongst some parents and students that teachers are not allowed to touch students. At one place I worked, if a male teacher touched a student for any reason, some students would yell out "PAEDO!" Horrific. The reality is that there is no law against teachers touching kids, and in fact Michael Gove, in one of his attempts to "give teachers more powers" enshrined in law that teachers could physically remove a disruptive student from class. I cannot ever imagine doing that. Can you? Can you imagine trying to physically remove a 15 year old from a room when he didn't want to go? It would be horrific. The teacher would look like an utter idiot as well, even if he/she was successful. It is so far from an "effective power" as to be utterly ridiculous.

Although it's allowed, experience tells you that you should never touch a child when you are cross or disciplining them, even if it is a very light touch, because it is very often construed as "an attack" and kids love to take revenge by claiming they were physically hurt. "You touched me" will always cause a teacher to panic because there are so many horror stories of kids then making false allegations against the teacher.

OP - did you actually talk to the parent and the parent demanded you apologise to their child for touching him? If so, what did you say? You need to report this to your line manager.

It wasn't clear from the first post if the students were meant to be coming into the room and sitting down or leaving the room? If they were meant to be coming in and were refusing, on another occasion tell them they have 30 seconds to be in their seats before you ask for a member of senior staff to remove them. Then walk away and let them choose. If they are meant to be leaving and won't get out the way of the door, do the same.

You have done nothing wrong by touching this child's shoulder - don't be harassed by them or their bullying parents if it is indeed an apology they are demanding.

Let me guess. Year 9?