DD won't let Grandpa attend baby group

[HurtGranny]

My DD attends a wonderful mother and baby music class with 1 year old DGD. DD took me to one class a few weeks ago and it was magical - unlike anything available to me when I was a new parent.

I wanted to go again and take my husband as he would so enjoy watching our DGD. But DD is suddenly excluding us. Apparently "the other mums would feel uncomfortable having a strange old man glaring at them from the sidelines and not participating in the singing".

We are ever so sad that DH is missing out on such a wonderful part of DGD's childhood and that DD is being so unkind.I suggested that it sounded like she was embarrassed of her father but, surprise surprise, she didn't reply.

It's not the first time DD's excluded us. We do most of the driving to visit DGD as according to DD the baby gets travel sick. We've never even babysat DGD as DD thinks we are too old (DH is nearly 80 but I’m not!). Coming to watch the baby group would have meant the world to us. I tried everything I could to come up with a solution but DD is now refusing to discuss the matter.

I am so angry and hurt. AIBU to want to make DD understand how hurtful her behaviour is? Any other grannies out there being excluded from their grandchildren’s lives?

[Youandmemillerscow]

pranmas has hit the nail on the head.

[SSargassoSea]

Many people are self-conscious about singing in public. Me, a DGM, for one, though I do sing to my DGD in private.

I wonder what age your DD is - mine is mid 30s and is very confident and the other DMs she mixes with are that age too.

Could DD be embarrassed about the large age gap between you and DGF - you don't say how old you are. That would be unfortunate but nothing much you can do about it.

By the way my DH works so doesn't attend any of these things, but probably woudln't want to as he isn't very hands on (until DCs are older).

[regenerationfez]

My DM got ridiculously overexcited at coming to baby groups. She did go in my place sometimes as I was working, but in reality, they are just something to do instead of sitting in the house. They are no more a wonderful part of childhood not to be missed by the whole family! Your DD was rude though. My dad is nearly 80 and would fall asleep snoring in 10 minutes but I'd never call him a strange old man!

[muddymary]

Not sure if someone has already mentioned this but a lot of people breast feed at baby group and maybe she's just worried that they'd feel uncomfortable with a male there.

[monkeymamma]

Bloody hell, people are horribly sexist and ageist towards older men! There are always loads of gps at the baby groups I go to, because they are largely propping up the UK economy by making up the shortfall in childcare. Why shouldn't a grandad go to a baby group. I got very, very pissed off at the CHRISTMAS CONCERT of a music group we go to because two of the mums were sneering about 'I don't know what THAT MAN is doing here'. That man was my dad, enjoying the carols with his grandsons and being an invaluable help to me as I had just given birth to my youngest dc and very much appreciated the extra pair of hands. Horrible snidey way to treat someone IMO. God help any man over 50 if he is automatically treated like some kind of weirdo whenever he's around children.

[BrendaandEddie]

i hated those classes FWIW

I think she probably needs some space to have her own mates, not parents appearing all the time

[CultureSucksDownWords]

The gran went once, and she asked if the grandad could go once. That's not exactly all the time.

[BeanGirls]

I've a lot of experience in this area and I bet you anything the music class is not titled 'mother and baby'. That excludes a lot of people who care for children including foster parents.

It will be for mums/dads/childminders/any carer of a child including grandparents.

It's more likely that she'll be uncomfortable, rather than the group. It's my experience that people embrace men when they come to things like this as they're a rarity.

[Footle]

Euripidesralph, sorry , I don't know your mum !

[mummyagainin2016]

Birds I can assure you that topics like BFing problems and postnatal sex lives weren't discussed during the baby music classes I took my DS to, and occasionally his GPs came to as well. They also had no clear 'targeted demographic' to serve. As I said way upthread, the class we're discussing isn't a sure start class for vulnerable parents, a BFing support group or anything of that ilk. Re-starting sex life is something you may discuss with one or two closer 'mum' friends, not 10 women you've seen for an hour of music class once a week...!
The perspective of some on this thread is totally lost!

[mummyagainin2016]

Bean hear hear! I made similar points upthread too.

[murmuration]

Did you join in when you went? I can clearly see a non-participant just watching everyone being not welcome. It would make everyone feel odd and on display, and my experience from being at just one of these is I felt completely weird and hated it, and the only saving grace was that everyone else there was being werid and silly too. If someone was just sitting and watching . I can't even begin to express the revulsion I have at such a thought. It would definitely put me off doing any advertised parent-baby thing again, for fear someone would be there just observing us. Yick.

[cleaty]

It is a mother and baby group, not a parent and baby group. So some mums attending may not be happy to have men there they don't know. Maybe that is what she means by, a strange old man.

[summertimeover]

hurtgranny. You are right to feel sad. I have included all 4 grandparents in all things to do with my boys. They can pick and choose what activity they can come and watch from music, to swimming, football and rugby. Watching your grandchild is lovely. I don't understand your daughters reaction, except she may not be comfortable in her own skin. If you are not comfortable in your own skin, doing something outside the box, or perceived norms can worry you. Hence she doesn't want to be the odd one out, having her dad there.

[Birdsgottafly]

""Birds I can assure you that topics like BFing problems and postnatal sex lives weren't discussed during the baby music classes I took my DS to, ""

No, not during, but dending on location, people stay for a coffee and chat, which would be awkward with a 80 year old man there, if they do want it to be just Mums.

There could be lots of reasons why the Mum might not want her Dad there.

The OP hasn't said that there were other family members there, so that doesn't seem to be the norm.

Even private paid for, which some of my DDs classes were (and my DN) have a demographic and ethos.

This doesn't sound like a open door class and I don't understand why you've reacted so strongly to me explaining to the OP (whose age group I'm in), why her DH isn't welcome.

The Sure Start classes that I put together (as a SW) wasn't for vulnerable families, they were for New parents/Carers but especially Mums.

I was at an art class the other week and it was the upper MC 30+ who wanted to have 'personal' conversations.

My DD isn't vulnerable, she's anxious because my GDG has had Health issues. There aren't any other issues.

[mummyagainin2016]

Birds on the one-off occasion I took my son's GPs to a class like this, we didn't stay for coffee afterwards, if one was happening, which it didn't always anyway. No big hardship for me that, as a one-off. Plenty of other weeks to stay and chat, discussing intimate topics. Still didn't really happen though. Weaning, dribbling, explosive poos, sleeping, yes. Continence and sexual issues, no. Surely someone who is embarrassed to have a stranger present when they are interacting with their child at a class like this would be unlikely to be discussing topics like this with new class acquaintances anyway? And if they are more actual 'friends' than acquaintances with others in the class then surely the others would understand the GP attending as a one-off and welcome them...?

[mummyagainin2016]

In the same way, if a SAHD or a dad with a day off took the child to the class, whether regularly or as a one-off, should he be excluded or made to feel he couldn't go cos he might cramp the style of mums wanting to discuss personal stuff over coffee afterwards?!

[cleaty]

IME men are more welcomed at coffee mornings than women. But if the OP is right and it really is a mother and toddlers, then no he wouldn't be welcome to attend.

[Birdsgottafly]

A Dad would join in though and he's at the same life stage as the group.

Having elderly relatives sit and watch, does change the dynamics.

But that's irrelevant the Mum wants to take her baby to a class by herself and that's fine.

[GabiSolis]

OP I'm sorry you've had a hard time on this thread. Try to remember there are lots of reasons why people post the way they do and sometimes it's nothing to do with your situation.

In reference to the issues with your DD, you do pretty much have to accept her reasoning on this, however daft you think it is. There may possibly be other reasons for her refusal than you think. You shouldn't really have pushed the issue but I do understand why you were upset. You will build a meaningful relationship with your dgd, and baby classes won't be at the basis of it, trust me!

[mummyagainin2016]

Birds I'm not questioning the daughter's right to take her baby to the class by herself. I'm taking issue with the frankly ridiculous arguments made by some throughout this thread that the grandparents shouldn't have asked to or want to attend the class, shouldn't be allowed to (because they're not mums, are too old, are male, might be creepy) etcetera.