Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Flip

1 2 ··· 5 6 7 ··· 10 11

Original poster

Organ donation should be opt out.

274 replies

m1nniedriver · 17/11/2015 15:12

Just that really. If people have strong feelings on the matter then they are free to opt out, I really fail to see the issue with it.

OP posts:

wasonthelist · 17/11/2015 21:47

Op asked if I'd still take an organ?
Let's just be clear.
I am in favour of organ donation. I got off my arse and signed up. All my NOK know this. My paternal grandad donated his body to medical students - his choice.

I would opt out in the case of presumed consent, because I fundamentally disagree with it.

Would I accept an organ if I needed one after presumed consent? Yes.

Kacie123 · 17/11/2015 21:52

It's a funny one. Of course I'm "in favour" of helping people to survive with transplants. It's entirely logical, same as blood transfusions.

But then I think of my own body or DHs being cut up like that and it freaks me right out - it also makes me feel deeply uncomfortable on some weird primitive level that says (entirely irrationally, I know) that I want to be buried whole and DH too. I also worry that we might not really be dead when someone slices us up.

... So I'd like to pay lip service to organ donation as a rational person, but I don't really know what I'd really tick if I'm being honest, and I hate the thought of being pressured at what is already presumably a horrible moment.

Tricky one.

JohnCusacksWife · 17/11/2015 22:17

Was, have I read that correctly? You fundamentally oppose an opt out system but would accept an organ coming from such a system? How do you square that circle?

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 17/11/2015 22:24

I would opt out in the case of pressumed consent because I fundamentally disagree with it but you would take a donated organ in the same situation

OP posts:

Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost · 17/11/2015 22:37

I thought you could opt out.

Illyillyilly · 17/11/2015 22:40

I agree after the age of 18. I am a donor, my OH is a donor. My DCs.... I know it's awful, but I don't know if I could let them be donors. Once they are grown up they can make their own decisions, but for now, I do not wish for them to have an 'opt out' system.

Illyillyilly · 17/11/2015 22:42

I'd like to add, I would accept a donation for either of my children. And because of this I am aware that I'm a hypocrite. I would like to say that given the choice I would donate their organs, but I pray to whoever that I will never have to make that decision, because at this moment in time I cannot fathom it.

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 17/11/2015 23:09

It's different for children. They can not make thst choice for themselves only their parents or NOK should decide for them. I don't think children should be part of an opt out system.

OP posts:

JohnCusacksWife · 17/11/2015 23:19

I can't truly imagine how I would feel if I had to make that decision about my children but I can only hope that it would give me some comfort to think that they had given the chance of life to others. In some strange way it might make me feel that they were living on somehow. Who knows? I sincerely hope I never have to find out.

shutupanddance · 17/11/2015 23:22

Agree

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 17/11/2015 23:25

I guess it's not something anyone can comment on with 100% certainty unless they've been in that situation

OP posts:

Pseudonym99 · 18/11/2015 09:48

It happens every day. Relatives in shock, grieving and angry should not be the ones making the decision. They should be counselled and given all the support and time they need/possible but they should not be the ones to make the choice. Obviously in cases if learning difficulties etc there should be exceptions.

But this is exactly the reason why they should be the ones making the decision. At a time when they are not in control of what's going on, let's take away even more autonomy and control.

I'm also a nurse

If you were a nurse, you would understand the issues surrounding consent. Therefore I believe you are lying. No nurse or doctor would take a relative's organs without the agreement of the family. If they did, they are not fit to be a doctor or a nurse.

Nanny0gg · 18/11/2015 09:54

Why you wouldn't give others the chance of extra precious years is utterly beyond me. Maybe if you lived the life of someone listed for a week you'd think differently.

^^This.

I do agree though that anything involving children should be the decision of the parents.

Kacie123 · 18/11/2015 10:13

I admit to being a bit worried at seeing the op was a nurse, as I'd also hate to feel extra-judged at that moment - but then I guess we can't expect people at the frontline watching others die to not have emotions of their own about it - that's not realistic either.

Had a conversation with DH last night about this and he definitely wants to donate, so in the horrible worst case scenario I can only hope I'd overcome that ridiculous clinging form of protectiveness for something that wasn't him anymore and go along with his real wishes.

I can't judge people for not wanting that though, it's not as simple as "yes, he's dead, take what you need". (Although I agree in principle that it should be).

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 18/11/2015 10:41

pseud have a word im not a nurse because I believe in an opt out system.

I'm not judging anyone i find it hard to comprehend why a person would not donate their organs but I fully respect their right to make that choice and would never treat any relatives or patients differently because of it.

I'm a little surprised that you're shocked I'm a nurse? Do you think nurses, that see these things day in day out can not firm opinions on them? I'm not judging anyone, im saying it's wrong that people, at their most devestated, can over ride the deceased wishes and make life changing decisions on behalf of others.

Imagine, a nurse with an opinion what's the world coming to!

OP posts:

Pseudonym99 · 18/11/2015 10:51

m1nniedriver You said you are a nurse. Nothing wrong with having an opinion, but that opinion should not be forming any part of your profession. Your patients are autonomous person, and relatives should have the say over what happens after death - not the state, not nurses and not doctors.

Freezingwinter · 18/11/2015 10:55

I'm a nurse.. That's why I said it isn't going to happen. Part of being a nurse is taking care of not just the patient but their family too. Imagine going ahead with organ donation when you have parents/a wife/husband who are already unable to stand up with their grief.. Then imagine going against their wishes.

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 18/11/2015 10:57

How does my opinion form any part of my profession your basically saying that as a nurse we are human beings with families who use the Nhs also I should have no opinion on this. Nurses and doctors have opinions on a whole range if issues imagine! They don't let that cloud their practice ir they shouldn't but they have opinions and views based not necessarily on things they have witnessed at work but their lives out of work I take it you are aware we are not robots

OP posts:

Freezingwinter · 18/11/2015 10:58

Of course you are allowed your opinion? But really as a nurse would you go against the wishes of the relatives of a dead patient??

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 18/11/2015 11:03

freezing this hapoens all the time, patients going against the wishes of their relatives. We can only support them, help them to come to terms with it etc. it should not be up to grieving relatives to override the wishes if the donor.

As a nurse you must have seen DNACPRs put in place by patients request? Imagine if we lifted them when relatives got angry upset. We don't, we help them to understand and give them all the support we can. This is no different.

OP posts:

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 18/11/2015 11:08

I wouldn't discount or belittle their feelings, I would do everything I could to ease the proscess But if the patient was a donor then, yes. These situations hapoen all the time in other areas of healthcare, of course you are there for the relatives but your ultimate responsibility is to your patient surely. It's a worrying world where relatives can override the wishes of a patient

OP posts:

CFSsucks · 18/11/2015 11:17

I don't think it should be opt out. It does imply that the NHS can help themselves to the deceaseds organs if they haven't actually opted out. They are my organs and I will choose what I want to do with them.

I am on the donor register but I don't actually know if they could be used due to my health problems, I can't give blood so the organs are a bit of a grey area. DH doesn't want to be a donor and I will respect that. It is entirely down to the individual, not the state.

Freezingwinter · 18/11/2015 11:17

But they are completely different. A dnr is put in place because it is what is best for the patient. Ultimately this is what we would go with, because it would be more harmful than helpful.

KondosSecretJunkRoom · 18/11/2015 11:25

No. It should be an opt-in system. My body, my organs, my consent, my gift. I don't want the default position to be that the state has a right to an individual's body.

Original poster

m1nniedriver · 18/11/2015 11:26

I'm speaking about it in relation to relatives though not comparing it with organ donation as such, just the views of the relatives. Have you ever seen a relative screaming and shouting at staff to help a loved one where a DNR is in place at the patients request? we should respect snd advocate for patients even after they have died, relatives should not be allowed to overrule their wishes, especially given their state of mind at the time!

OP posts:

Flip

1 2 ··· 5 6 7 ··· 10 11