To wonder how all the people wearing the French flag on FB feel now they've bombed Syria?

[TheHouseOnTheLane]

So..."everyone" popped a French flag on their FB profile in sympathy with Paris.

Now France has shot over there and dropped 20 bombs on ISIS HQ and training centre.

So...people are happily condoning war really.

Why not all change profile pics to a peace sign?

I know ISIS are bad...but as we all say, violence solves nothing. Nothing.

Depends how you define ISIS? It is unljkey that there is somewhere a group of ISIS leaders who planned the Paris attacks. The people carried them out may have identified with ISIS, and ISIS certainly took credit, but the people on the ground in Paris may not have had "orders" etc

Still ISIS to me.

Itsallgoingtobefine

Isis is the wealthiest terror organisation of all time and that is dangerous as if they do have funding that makes them powerful, it is cuttingvthier funding that is the problem because it involves that all time sought after commodity oil

If we started embargos on the countries helping money going to Isis then the price of oil will increase - that's not something that western countries leaders want to do....as it would cost them votes due to living in democracies where voting counts

I'm not sure bombing is the answer. Both Afghanistan and Iraq were bombed to pieces after a few thousand Americans died and now we have daesh instead of alquaeda (sp)
There are many issues here. I believe most of the terrorists were actually French.
French racism and islamophobia will only compound the issue.

ISIS may be pretty weak in some ways but they are cunning in their use of any weapons available to make themselves heard regarding their vile agenda.

No, they'll never dominate the world. They get a thrill out of having the world in general scared of them, but how many innocent civilians will they get to have the thrill of killing before we find an effective way of stopping them.

ISIS leaders are the ultimate dishonourable cowards. They use religious ideologically brainwashed, less intelligent, young foot soldiers to massacre innocent men, women and children around the world. This is, in anyone's book a cowardly way to wage "war".

Merkel was a fool in her rush to look good and get cheap labour.

Cameron's considered and more well advised approach led to knee-jerk condemnation of the UK at the time but I suspect we'll find that plenty of ISIS supporters were sent by their leaders to join the migrant trail into the heart of Europe. Who knows when they will act, only when they are told to do, no doubt and in the meantime Europe plays host to them. This is what worries me. More state surveillance, stricter ID checking methods and tighter control of movement of people across borders can't come too soon IMHO at this point in time.

Oh and good old "call me Tony"........don't get me started on his "legacy".

What ItsAll is getting at, is that ISIS aren't a centrally organised group, but more of a franchise, with clusters of groups operating under the same banner. The France attacks probably weren't organised, funded, or equipped from Iraq or Syria, but from ISIS groups in Europe.

That's why attacking ISIS in Syria does little to make anyone in Europe safer.

There is also the issue of atrocities like France being carried out in order to provoke a reaction, it's the cycle of terror: anti-state action, provoking state reaction.

The more merciless the Western response, particularly if it creates a significant civilian "collateral damage", the more ISIS will be able to paint the West as the enemy to those living under ISIS rule and shoring up their support.

In short, bombing ISIS out of existence won't work, but will instead aid their recruitment.

That doesn't mean I think ISIS should not be fought, they should, but I think it needs a more nuanced approach then carpet-bombing vast areas.

Also, France's response mirrors that of Jordan, when the Jordian pilot was executed, Jordan immediately launched air-strikes and executed ISIS prisoners. Did that do much to counter ISIS, no, not really.

BBC saying the order came from Syria

Attacks apparently 'masterminded' by Abdelhamid Abaaoud link here

Reading the whole thread with interest.

I'm sorry if this sounds like a stupid question but why would Saudi back ISIS? What's in it for them?

Absolutely delighted, they've been doing it for ages anyway. I wish our gutless wonders would stand up and do the same.

Firstditect the simple answer religion and what the believe,

Saudi behead, kill, torture and treat woman in barbaric manner

The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it

^ this.

apparently Assad released a whole load of Islamic terrorists from jail, knowing that this would happen and that the West's attention would be diverted to fighting IS rather than the government

Things have gone v quiet on that front we had a lot of stories about him and his wife ( a brit?).

Wicked wicked wicked evil man.

firstdirect Its uber rich elements of Quatar and Saudi.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/31/combat-terror-end-support-saudi-arabia-dictatorships-fundamentalism

What I want to know is, Border were supposed to be closed shortly after the attack so why was anyone let through?

I find it very difficult to get worked up about France bombing terrorists, particularly as they have been engaged in action for months. That said, I don't think bombing is an effective means of stopping ISIS whose beliefs are an ideology that a large network of people subscribe to all over the world. Their training HQ may well be in Syria, but their violence, planning and coordination transcend borders and we wouldn't dream of bombing Brussels, Toulouse or Birmingham.

I changed my profile to the Tricolour because I am human and had a gut reaction for the pain and suffering of those poor innocent people, most just teenagers and young people socialising. I also holiday there every year and can't help but feel closer to it because it's right on our doorstep and could just as easily been me and my family involved. It doesn't mean I don't feel weighed down by sorrow for the rest of the world's atrocities. But the UK and France are often portrayed as having an uneasy relationship since the dawn of time and I wanted to illustrate in some way that humans stand alongside humans. Just as ISIS is borderless, so too is humanity.

It's a common error to compare AlQaeda, which was a distributed franchise, to Isis.

Isis considers itself to be a state, with borders, a foreign policy, a civil service and a military. They have a defined geographical territory. AlQaeda wanted to avoid this for the reasons previous posters have already given; a decentralised network is harder to attack.

Indeed, AlQaeda opposes Isis for announcing a caliphate, which under religious law requires all observant Muslims to relocate themselves to the controlled territory. Osama Bin Laden tried specifically to avoid this, as he hoped to have insurgents distributed in populations throughout the world rather than easily located in one place.

Yes Mephistopheles, but as ISIS's stated aim is a worldwide Islamic caliphate, doesn't that somewhat negate that obligation? Because wherever you are, you are in the caliphate in their eyes.

Thank you IvyKaty and LimboNovember. I knew that Saudi was pretty dreadful but surely even they would balk at IS as they are?

Will read the article shortly, thank you again .

I'm quite happy with them bombing Syria. And the flag thing? Many of us have been to Paris and have friends in France. It is a symbol of solidarity and unity. It's not going to defeat ISIS. Quite apart from that, France are our neighbours and allies. An attack on them is an attack on all in that alliance. Its an alliance that has kept peace in Europe for the longest continuous period in its history. How do suppose we stop Shia Muslims and Christians being killed in Syria, Beirut and Nigeria, if its not by eradicating ISIS and Boko Haram? Or do you propose we wring our hands about how terrible it is while we put flags on our Facebook pages for every atrocity that happens? We can't as people do anything in those countries. We can show empathy for the French people when something terrible happens. People who put the flags up are showing that they are united, when the terrorists want to divide and spread fear and division in Europe, as they have in the ME.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/15/terrorists-isis

interesting article

There's a brilliant piece today by Edward Lucas in The Times that I can't link to about how we all have to man up in the face of Isis and also accept that we may be a bit poorer because we no longer will do business with vile countries like Saudi. It says it all.

first direct Im sure someone who knows specifics will explain better, but there are different factions within Islam that hate each other. Saudi Arabia are very fundamentalist, as are ISIS. They basically have a common enemy that are the other branches of Islam, who they see as not real muslims, and to them, are infidels just as much as Christians and other groups are. Other countries fund them because they kill Kurds, which is why 99% of ISIS' victims are Muslim. It's because they are the wrong sort.

Sorry x post someone has already done it better than me!!!

That's why attacking ISIS in Syria does little to make anyone in Europe safer

of course it does, its one huge training camp where these people can learn and experience real war, become trained and also de sensitised. we should have gone in much earlier.

they are all trained up now.

OP, please let us know how you would deal with the situation that wouldn't get any more innocent people killed? Chamberlain had the same naive belief in "peace for our time" and then Hitler went on to butcher millions of people. Jaw jaw is all very well but not very realistic when dealing with people who don't want to jaw but just want to (holy) war.

Thank you regeneration.