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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To expect that grandparents should be included in Christmas?

163 replies

Mishaps · 10/11/2015 15:59

If you take yourself on to Gransnet you will find a thread that will illustrate to everyone here how deeply hurt some grandparents are at not being included in the family Christmas. There are women there who have been the lynchpin in creating wonderful family Christmases for their children over decades and who will be on their own on the day.

I know that some families have rifts in them and not all parents make a good job of their role, but might this not be a time to heal some wounds and act out of kindness?

Lots of grandparents say they do not mind being left out, but please bear in mind that sometimes they just do not want to admit out loud how hurt and lonely they feel.

There will be many grandparents for whom a lonely Christmas day will bring tears.

OP posts:
Imustgodowntotheseaagain · 10/11/2015 17:30

I shall be alone on christmas day. I plan to embrace the freedom to choose my own day. Family isn't everything.

trian · 10/11/2015 17:33

Stevenhydesafro1 absolutely fair enough.

I think instead of thinking about grandparents that are on their own over xmas, we should be thinking about people who don't deserve to be on their own over xmas, this includes people of all ages. I am really sick of the unfair bias towards old people. I feel a hell of a lot more sorry for young people that have recently left the care system being on their own at xmas, or the offspring of abusive parents who haven't yet got a family or friends close enough to include them in xmas etc etc.
And as another poster said, the end of year season is a block of time, xmas eve, xmas day, boxing day, new years day, new years eve and all the days in between, plenty of time to please everyone (unless you have to work in the middle and/or people live miles and miles apart) as long as people don't get precious about one day vs another.

ghostyslovesheep · 10/11/2015 17:36

Again by grandparents I am guessing you mean OUR parents (as my grandparents are dead :( )

I think people need to stop assuming all people are the same - my mu wouldn't want to come on Christmas Day and Ex PIL are with my Ex husband and his partner

Christmas is a SEASON not just a day - this year I will be staying with my children and my Mum and stepdad from the 28th to the 1st

Not all 'grandparents' feel the need to descend for the day

ghostyslovesheep · 10/11/2015 17:37

also I have had Christmas on my own a few times - bloody LOVED it - not everyone feel the need to be around people to enjoy themselves

MrsItsNoworNotatAll · 10/11/2015 17:39

I'd rather not have fil here for Christmas day because he's gets hammered and spoils it. If he doesn't drink he just sits there not talking and behaving like he'd rather not be here anyway. He doesn't like Christmas so I wonder why he bothers coming to a houseful of people who do.

I put a lot of time and effort into making the day special and it pisses me off when he gets steamed and spoils it by chatting shit and behaving like a Twat.

Lillipuddlian · 10/11/2015 17:41

I struggle with this. My parents are completely unsupportive of me. I see neither of them at Christmas and my mother ignores my birthdays and those of my children. Almost all of my parenting revolves around me wanting to be on speaking terms with my children when they are adults. I think you reap what you sow.

Mishaps · 10/11/2015 17:41

Agree about the children leaving the care system - the support for them is woeful and Christmas could be a problem for many.

I guess the OP was about those (grand)parents who feel sad to be on their own, rather than those who relish it.

OP posts:
KERALA1 · 10/11/2015 17:47

We invited the ILs and they said no. Something of a relief as the last Christmas spent with them an unmitigated disaster. MIL arrived spoiling for a fight with DH, silence over Christmas dinner unless DH and I spoke, then ILs had an argument and FIL sat in a room alone and wouldn't come out. Then, this was the best bit, they "wouldn't speak" to DH or I for months for reasons we have never been able to understand or get out of them. They even put the phone down on our then 3 year old when we rang up so she could chat to them.

They are weirdy weirdos, OP you are welcome to spend Christmas with them if you want!

gladisgood · 10/11/2015 17:47

I don't actually know of a single person in real life who has a good relationship with their parents who who would deliberately leave them alone at Christmas.

I know plenty whose PIL's or parents are toxic, nasty, controlling, abusive, PA etc. etc. who don't invite them.

OP, if those wonderful matriarchs were actually so amazing, then why don't they have a better relationship with their DC?

My truly wonderful Granny - (who was always invited by ALL of her 5 children - so had a choice of households every Christmas!) used to say "you reap what you sow"

DinosaursRoar · 10/11/2015 17:55

OP - we alternate with my parents and PIL. we will be hosting PIL this year, and my parents will spend Christmas day with my DB and his DP - who's family are overseas so DB never has to do the alternating thing himself (the years we have my parents over, my DB& his DP join us).

PIL on the otherhand, don't always see DH's DB on the years we don't have them - SIL's family are out of rotation as there's more than 2 siblings. I believe last year PIL spent Christmas day 'alone' (although they are a couple so spent it together!), then came to us Boxing day.

I can't fit more people in on Christmas day if I've already got my parents and DB&BIL, and my parents and PIL don't really get on, I get the impression PIL (who are lovely BTW!) would rather spend Christmas day alone then do a big boxing day with us than join my family quite frankly I'd rather spend christmas day alone than with my mother .

I hope when DCs are grown up, they fit me in at some point over the festive season, but I'm not fussed about the day, and will be prepared to do the travelling if I can.

DramaAlpaca · 10/11/2015 17:55

I'd love to have my parents for Christmas, and did so a few times when the DC were small. Unfortunately, my parents have been so badly behaved and caused so much tension all the times we've had them that eventually I decided enough was enough & told them well in advance that we would be spending Christmas on our own in future. So we do, and it's lovely.

It's sad for my parents, but I have had to put my DC first. They have not been used to living in a stressful environment, & I particularly don't want upset and tension on Christmas Day.

My brother won't have them either for the very same reasons, so our parents go away for Christmas, somewhere they can only annoy each other.

DinosaursRoar · 10/11/2015 17:57

oh and I agree, if my children don't want to see me at all over Christmas, that's a sign of a bigger problem than one day!

JugglingFromHereToThere · 10/11/2015 18:03

I think families can be complicated
People want to make a nice Christmas for their DC too
Also different parts of a big family may be quite happy not all getting together for the big day
It can put a lot of pressure on the day if they do
We have had some lovely family Christmases though over the years and agree it's good to be generous and hospitable - but only within reason
It generally only works if everyone is prepared to put in a good measure of good-will and effort and damson vodka
You can't play happy families on Christmas day without doing so through the rest of the year?
We generally have our own wee Christmas here - maybe see some good friends in the afternoon or go for a walk. Then go and see other close family including DGP's a few days afterwards for a short stay

Trickydecision · 10/11/2015 18:03

RhodaBull, Grin but as well as being incontinent and demanding, I shall also turn into a typical evil Mumsnet Grandma who keeps them all under the thumb by continually threatening to cut anyone who is not nice to me out of the will.

TheFairyCaravan · 10/11/2015 18:22

I couldn't give a fuck what anyone says, but PILs nor my parents are coming here this Christmas or any Christmas until they apologise to me.

My parents, well my mother but my dad went along with it, have never treated me the same as my siblings and they extended that to my children. My sister's children, and even my DN's son, have had some lovely holidays abroad, weekends away, days out, present etc. My kids have never had as much as a packet of sweets when it wasn't their birthdays. DN's have all had cars for their 18th birthdays, my kids got £20. On DS1's 18th birthday I phoned my mum and told her to contact me when she could treat my children the same as the rest. DS1 is 21 in a few weeks, we've not heard from her in those 3 years.

I was minding my own business own afternoon when DH was away with the RAF and he phoned asking why I had phoned MIL to abuse her and call her a "fucking selfish bitch"! I had done no such thing, for some unknown reason his dad had decided to email DH and tell him that. He, also, told him he'd given me a large cheque to pay off a credit card bill. I didn't have a credit card. It was all lies. He won't to this day show DH the evidence of the cheque. DH knows I didn't ring because all our bills are itemised and he said our number came up on caller display, which it wouldn't as its withheld.

The things they said about me in the email were disgusting and for 20 years I had thought they liked me. It was all a bloody act. The upset of that made me ill and they can get fucked if they think they're coming here.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 10/11/2015 18:32

I'm sorry to hear about your crap afternoon FairyCaravan Sad

hedgehog01 · 10/11/2015 18:42

DH's parents left him on his own at Xmas for a few years before I met him. They'd always go away, so now we're in a routine of going to my parents. Which is easy, fun and relaxing in that they really help out with DTs and we get a proper break. Now they're older, DH's parents don't want to go away at Xmas - plus there's the appeal of young children to enjoy it with. I don't feel especially inclined to change our plans now though, TBH. They're not too bad, MIL makes barbed comments on occasion... but... they make very minimal effort to spend time with us the rest of the year... And, you know what, I wouldn't mid spinning Xmas on my own. I genuinely don't see what the problem is.

LimboNovember · 10/11/2015 18:46

mrs we have one of those too. Sad

Very bright, amusing person, always hits a certain point and becomes morose, a big baby, we all have to tip toe round him, he has to be the only voice heard, he has to be the funniest...we have to sit while he quotes long excerpts of what ever he fancies, he gets upset if we have to break off to attend very small dc....he gets upset if we dont all sit and just listen to the great master Hmm.

He has taken thoughtful gifts and thrown them aside and they got thrown away ( expensive theatre tickets), he has ruined whole xmass's over stupid things...

Im0gen · 10/11/2015 18:48

I think that any parents who are estranged from their children and know it's because they have done a bad job, they are the ones who should seek to build bridges and heal wounds .

They should do this now, and not wait for Christmas .

Im0gen · 10/11/2015 18:56

OP - some people are just horrid and treat others very badly . They don't suddenly get a personality transplant because their own children procreate .

Or because the calendar has hit 25 December .

HoneysuckleAndJasmine · 10/11/2015 19:00

Its so hard isn't it. I totally agree that no-one should be left alone at Christmas and I've done the whole inviting pils when no-one else ever does.

But they have behaved so badly over the years towards me that my own parents would not be able to cope with being in the same house with them.

We would ALL be on edge and after alcohol a fight would ensue and I'm not prepared to expose the dc to that. (Or the alcoholism)

So there we are, despite my guilt (dh, their son, has none!) I cannot see a way to have pils on Xmas day without ruining it for everyone. We will see them on another day over Christmas, period

Hamishandthefoxes · 10/11/2015 19:09

We normally spend Christmas with my parents or pils. This year were going away for 3 weeks to visit other family in NZ. It is the only time DH and j can take that chunk of holiday and we've wanted to go for ages.

But if my (otherwise lovely) gmil sniffs sadly at me again about how she's spending Christmas on her own (with fil and despite my dps inviting them over) we'll make this trip annual!

stitchglitched · 10/11/2015 19:10

My MIL won't be with any of her children or grandchildren for Christmas. She has cultivated an identity for herself amongst new friends as a caring mother who has been abandoned by her family when the reality is that she was abusive and neglectful and all her children ended up in care.

I feel far more sympathy for her kids who have all been badly damaged by their upbringing and DP who spent many Christmases alone from being dumped in a bedsit at 16 after leaving the children's home, until he had his own family. We have a lovely cosy day with our little family and she will never be welcome in our home.

Hygge · 10/11/2015 19:14

It's a difficult situation really.

Not everyone has the space to invite relatives to stay, the budget to feed everyone, or the money to travel to stay with them. Some people want to stay in their own homes for various reasons, they don't want to make their children travel, they have to work through Christmas and can't travel or invite people, and if you have parents and in-laws wanting different things pleasing everybody can be difficult.

I do think that if you can visit at other times and have a generally good relationship through the rest of the year, perhaps Christmas Day isn't the be all and end all.

We only have one DS. At some point in his future, he's going to spend Christmas day elsewhere if only for fairness to his future partner's family. We are going to have to accept that and understand that's how life is sometimes. As long as he's happy.

And sadly not every family member deserves to be with others at Christmas.

We used to travel 250 miles to stay with family over Christmas. Both my parents and PILs lived in the same town, but we stayed with my parents as PILs used to make us sleep on the floor in the living room even though they had two empty bedrooms. They used to make us get up at 6am so MIL could tidy up, and they spent most of their time sighing about the mess our things made in the suitcase. We had to keep the case in the car.

Their garden was also open to the street, and we had our dog with us, so it wasn't safe, practical, or comfortable to stay with them.

PILs took this as a personal insult, and kept note of how long we spent with my parents so we would spend the same with them. It meant that every day we were driving 40 minutes from one side of town to the other, to spend a minimum of four hours with PILs. And then the forty minutes back again when we were allowed to leave. Anything less was seen as us favouring my parents (who run a business which is open right through Christmas, it's their busiest time, so we weren't exactly spending every other moment with them. They were at work.)

I've lost count of the Christmas's and New Years ruined by PIL because they felt they were getting a raw deal on our time.

And nothing was ever good enough for them. They hated their presents, even if we'd bought them exactly what they asked for.

FIL once rang DH to say the presents we gave them were pathetic and insulting, and we were users who were taking them for mugs by giving them such awful gifts. That same year BIL and SIL gave them a very expensive radio and MIL complained that they already had a radio, had nowhere to put this new one, and they wouldn't use it anyway.

That same year, they disowned DH because we'd spent two hours at his sisters house and they thought that if we had time to spare it should have been spent with them first.

They were furious the year I was ill, accused me of faking the norovirus to spite them, and spent days ringing us every half an hour to make sure we were actually at home and not sneakily spending time with my parents and not telling them. I couldn't sleep because the phone was constantly ringing, and FIL accused DH of ruining his mother's life.

They've turned up at my parents house while we were there at Christmas and shouted at DH in the street, accusing him of lying about where we were and what time we said we would visit them. This is because on Sundays my parents make lunch for 4pm, when they finish work. PILs know this, it's been this way since I met DH and we'd been married a couple of years by then, but they insisted we should have been there at 1pm because lunchtime is 12 noon.

They were ringing DH almost constantly from 12:30pm, demanding to know where we were, then told us not to bother visiting after all as they had made plans to go out at 6pm so us leaving my parents house at 5pm when dinner was finished to drive the forty minutes to their house was a waste of time. Then they turned up at ten past four, knowing the whole family would be sitting down to eat, to cause trouble and shout. They banged on the front door and then went back to the car to wait for DH to go out. FIL actually drove over DH's foot on purpose while he was trying to talk to them, after telling DH he as a liar and not their son.

Every Christmas and New Year, without fail, they have done their best to cause trouble and ruin things for everybody.

The year our daughter died, right before Christmas, they were especially awful to us.

And when we finally reduced our contact with them they chose Christmas as the time to tell DH his sibling was in hospital with a hereditary and potentially fatal disease.

They refused to tell him what that hereditary disease was, so we were left worrying about BIL, worried that DH and his other siblings were also carriers of the disease, and believing that our two babies who died (unexplained stillbirth and neonatal death, both dying in the same year as each other) may have died because of this disease. And our less than two year old DS might also have this hereditary disease and might die as well.

They kept this lie up for two weeks, refusing to tell us what the disease was as "it's a long name we can't say" and we were terrified.

We had DS booked in to the doctor for blood tests to try and find out if anything was wrong with him before SIL slipped up and we overheard her talking on the phone, telling her friend that BIL had accidentally overdosed on amphetamines and alcohol while 'celebrating' with his friends.

That was it for me.

They let us think our children died because of this disease, and worry that DH and DS might also have it.

The cruelty is unimaginable unless you live with it day in and day out for years, as we have done. And Christmas makes them worse for some reason.

Although they did chose the anniversary of my grandmother's death to ring DH and tell him they thought he should divorce me because they had made up a pack of lies about my behaviour. They waited for our stillborn son's first birthday anniversary to tell me they didn't consider him to be their real grandchild. And waited for our wedding anniversary to tell me they'd thrown our daughter's photograph in the bin.

I don't care if they spend every Christmas from now on sitting on their own in the dark, freezing cold, with nothing to eat and nobody to talk to. They can spend every day for the rest of their lives in that state for all I care. They will never set foot in my house or me set foot in theirs, not for Christmas or any other reason.

I realise that might make me sound just as bad as they are. I don't care. They've done too much to deserve any kindness from me.

I'm kind to people who are kind to us. We invite our elderly neighbour to us for coffee and cake, we make sure he has a gift to open on Christmas day, we take him some "leftovers" to make sure he has a hot meal on the days he's not spending elsewhere, if he can't travel to his family for Christmas we invite him to spend the day with us.

He's a kind man. He's good company. He's never asked me if it hurts to give birth to a dead baby (which MIL has done). He's the sort of person who deserves company, not just at Christmas but through the year. I promise I'm not all bad, but PILs aren't fit to be around normal people and they will be alone for a long, long time before they ever have my company again.

Jux · 10/11/2015 19:15

Both my parents are dead.

FIL lives 150miles away, hasn't seen dh for years and has met me once and dd once. When his 2nd wife died we invited him, not just for Xmas, but for holidays etc, sometimes he'd say yes, we'd get excited, make preparations and then he'd changehis mind to much disappointment from both dd and dh. Mostly he'll just refuse.

MIL lives 150 miles away in a different direction. She is not who she was, having been ravaged by dementia. She doesn't recognise anyone and has no idea what's going on. sFIL hates us.

No possibility of gps having Xmas here, much as I'd like it. Sad