AIBU to report this little fucker to the police?

[Londonista123]

Sorry - long but genuine dilemma.

My flat and car were egged on Halloween (in vast quantities, if it matters). I was miffed but put it down to not answering the door to T'or'T'ers - until I realised that my flat and car were the only ones targeted in my building of 20+ flats. Car and flat are not next to each other.

After some thought, I put it down to a particular kid in my building. We've had a few run-ins before this:

• A few months ago I accidentally photographed him while documenting something untoward that's happening around the building, that I photograph and send to the council to report (excuse the vagueness, but think fly tipping / antisocial behaviour or similar). His angry mum knocked on the door a few minutes later and, when I didn't answer, left me an illiterate note asking me to stop photographing her son / show her the photo. I was reluctant to talk to her because I don't know who was involved in the thing I was actually photographing, and didn't want to mention it to her.

She caught me in my car a few weeks later (son was with her), asked me why I was photographing her son, none too politely, and I explained that I was photographing something else. She may now think I'm a paedophile for all I know.

(I also wanted to scream that I am free to photograph whatever the hell I want in public, but never mind.)

• On another occasion recently the son was making a serious racket directly outside my door (rollerskating up and down, shouting loudly downstairs to his mate). I went out and asked him to stop, which he did. I think he's around 12/13 y.o.

I really don't know most other neighbours here, certainly none with kids, and don't know who else could match me with the car, and would particularly want to egg my house.

I put a posted, anonymous note through their flat door to the effect that I'd reported their kid to the police for his Halloween "joke", and he was welcome to come by and apologise if they wanted me to withdraw the complaint. I was hoping a) his mum would give him a bollocking, since I doubt she knew and b) to frighten the hell out of him.

Got home to another note through door: I think you sent me a note [...] you say my son did a Halloween JOKE [...] go ahead and report him to the police if you think it was him [...] but report yourself at the time time for photographing my son.

I'm now even more certain it was him, and angry because the response I expected was to have the son say sorry, not an aggressive note from his mum.

So... do I now actually go to the police about what is technically "criminal damage"? I feel that the local police (like police everywhere) have much, much bigger fish to fry, and frankly I'd be embarrassed to ring up. I also think he's unlikely to do this to me again since he's now been caught.

AIBU to report this, and have the police round to "chat" about not egging houses?

OTOH - I'm angry. If this was my son, he'd be cleaning up the mess and writing an apologetic letter, whereas his mum's note seems to think she believes his behaviour is justified.

Londonista that sounds dire what are you going to do you cant live in the middle of a feud you might need to go to her and apologise and explain about the photograph but there is a likelyhood of her telling you to stick it up your arse

Also, OP are you the only one complaining about the "Anti social behaviour", because if not, the EH shouldn't be asking to to play undercover cop.

multivac, you do realise that your childish attempt at humour is making you seem pretty rude and disagreeable.

If putting up with antisocial behaviour is your thing then knock yourself out, but there's no need to attempt to talk others into doing so, or mock someone who is offering genuine advice.

ghost - I understand that approach but don't agree with it at all. I'm a lawyer, fgs. I'm law-abiding, and I expect others to be law-abiding. Sorry if that sounds sanctimonious, but that's how I feel. I also believe in the Broken Windows theory: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory

MrsJayy - tbh I don't really cross paths with this woman/family day to day - I'm at work all day and out on the weekend. If there's anything further done against me, they are suspects numero uno - and car is literally worthless anyway. We're also slowly starting to look for a family home, so don't expect to be living here long term (but would keep this flat to rent out).

birds - no idea if anyone else is complaining, but it's a visible problem.

Birdsgottafly, it's disappointing to hear that that kind of vigilantism is still seen as normal, even acceptable.

For eg. A relative of mine has quite severe mental health issues. His only real joy in life is photography. He photographs railway track, woods, his local area, parks, churches etc etc.

Several of his photographs will no doubt have local children in the background. If any of their parents were to come angrily banging on his door, demanding to see/delete his photos, he would be terrified. He would most definitely not answer the door and would turn and leg it if he saw them in the street. His mh just would not be up to interrogation. Do you think it would be right or acceptable that he was 'moved on' by ignorant vigilantes who just saw a male with a camera and immediately thought "PEEEEDO". Would he deserve to have his windows broken and egged when he hadn't harmed a soul?

Sorry for the essay, but I've seen this all too often and it never gets less upsetting.

Well, I really don't mean to be rude, but as a lawyer I don't think you've handled yourself very well. It's not just a question of who is legally or morally in the right (and I don't think sending anonymous letters IS morally right, but maybe that's too much Mallory Towers talking). It's also the fact that you have to rub along with these people on a daily basis. OF COURSE you should not put up with shitty behaviour but you must recognise that setting yourself apart as superior to these people - and that's what your tone and your actions convey to me - is really not a very effective way of doing that?

I reported a boy for harassing us it started when i asked him nicely to stop sitting and kicking my fence i was told to fuck off it soon escalated to egging then scratching the car he then broke into our garage I reported him and he was sent to childrens panel (scotland so underage to be arrested) . If they do continue to hassle you then report them but i wouldnt be putting anymore notes through the door. The boy i am on about mother was not that reasonable either.

plant - fair enough. I do see myself as superior to some of my neighbours, but I do my damnedest not to convey that in RL, and seem to manage to, most of the time.

I don't think you've given this child's mothers point of view much understanding.
It seems like the first thing she knew of you, was that you were taking photos of her teenage son,
Then you wouldn't explain the situation- you've been given two opportunities,
As a side note, if you had taken photos of my child, I would have snatched it off you and deleted every photo my child was in on your phone... It might be unhinged but I know a fair few people who would act in the same unhinged manner when met with the situation where a grown up is taking photos that my child knows they have been in, but will not let us see... And let's be honest while she's not aware of how many photos you've taken, or where he sits in the photos, it probably sounds like you went out to take photos of her son.

Concerning the egging, she probably didn't know, but judging by the fact that you (in her eyes) went out to take photos of her son, and she hasn't been able to disprove you are a paedophiles/ nutcase she's not going to send him in your direction to apologise or clean it up is she?
It sounds like he's a bit upset with you. And she's reacting as a mother who's certainly not sending her son to apologise to you because you do read like a nut.
You seem quite paranoid about your pictures, if she is a mother of a family why would she not be supportive of the same things you are seemingly unhappy with around the flats?

This would just be a lot easier to deal with if you levelled with her, and explained what had happened, showed her that her child is on the very edge of the photo, and you were embarrassed by the situation so didn't answer the door, and now it's all gotten out of hand.
You might even end up with your first friend in the building.

if you had taken photos of my child, I would have snatched it off you and deleted every photo my child was in on your phone.

Probably best you never ever take your child out in public then.

I think you should probably just let it go now - the reply was almost an acknowledgment and a condoning of the child's actions, while reminding you of the motive.

I would suggest you are probably even now in their minds, he is unlikely to do anything worse as you have made your willingness to report known, and they are unlikely to apologise out of pride and crossness at your perceived targetting of him with your camera (which was only perceived)

I'd let it go
Don't report it
Keep the standoff as it is unless further incidents occur.

btw I wouldn't care if a 28yo woman took photos of my child - presuming he was doing nothing wrong - I'm not defensive though, my child behaves well, and this parent sounds defensive.

I bet he got a bollocking from the parent about the eggs anyway.

I would probably advise moving house as well tbh, when you can!

the world has gone mad when taking photos that may include children in a public place is seen as worse than vandalism.

but there's no proof of the vandalism. (Which is what egg-throwing is, not a cute ickle joke).

BTW love the person who lives somewhere where they all conform to the playground 'no sneaking' code, and live in filth from week to week until the council comes to clear up. At extra cost to everyone. You could of course tell the council who the filthy litterers are...but no, that is 'grassing' and 'we' don't do that because we think we live in sodding eastenders.

and so the filth continues. Nice.

Betty - thanks. I'm aware that she thinks I'm a nut/paedophile - fair enough, I can see how she got there. As said above, the pictures/activity are something she/her mates down the block may be involved in, and I don't think she'd necessarily be supportive of the same things I am.

"I got told to put my camera away by a lifeguard at a swimming pool as I wasn't allowed to take a photo of my son during a swimming session. So you can only photograph children in some public places it seems."
Swimmi g pools are rarely 'public' and are owned by a business / not for profit organisation for public access. But you pay to enter. They are private spaces. Taking a camera into a swimming pool has been a 'no' since i had swimming lessons in the 80's.

if you had taken photos of my child, I would have snatched it off you and deleted every photo my child was in on your phone.

And the owner of the phone would be in a very strong legal position if they punched you in the face and/or had you prosecuted for assault. There is no legal problem whatsoever with photographing children in public. There is every legal problem with mugging, and people are perfectly entitled to defend themselves, if necessary with substantial violence.

You're also talking hard from a keyboard, because were the photograph being taken by a large man in a Hells Angel jacket I suspect your online bravery would desert you.

Thanks Doctor - I'm leaning towards that course of action.

My experience of reporting anti - social behaviour of a neighbour to the police was that it was a 'huge' waste of my time. In my case the neighbour was a man that shouted at me, threatened to kill us, constantly called us 'hetrosexual fuckers', impersonated me and my children. We'd already lived in the property for 3 years before they moved in. After one particularly bad night his partner wrote us a letter apologising so we even had written evidence and a confession of sorts but the police weren't interested. One night he came home from a bender and started putting his hand through our letter box, swearing and threatening us. DH isn't one to tolerate this stuff but he didn't want a physical altercation as he is a professional Architect and a police record for being in a fight is not something you want hanging over you as you can be stuck off the RIBA register and never work as an Architect again! This night the police took 4 hrs to come around to see what was going on. This neighbour racially assaulted another neighbour, there were witnesses to the anti- social behaviour as he was so load in his attack of us that other neighbours came out to see what the commotion was.

IME the only thing that worked was nothing to do with the police. My brother who is a lawyer in a casual conversation told me to get them out using the 'breaking the lease' powers. We own, they were renting so in the end the landlord evicted them as he was facing legal costs otherwise!

This is why I don't think the police would be of much help as you don't have any evidence and IME even when you do they're really reluctant to take things further. Sorry but I'd say the reports need to go on for years and that's with evidence.

The thing I was photographing is fairly serious and if this family is involved I'd rather they not know I was reporting it

My concern now would be they probably will.

I had to move house to get away from an anti-social family, the main problem being the child. In my experience things can escalate quickly, and I hope they dont for you OP. I know how nasty and vicious some children can be and how unsupportive it can be trying to deal with the parents.

if you had taken photos of my child, I would have snatched it off you and deleted every photo my child was in on your phone

Taking pictures of a child is not a crime, if someone did to me what you have just said you would do I would be contacting the Police.

What a little shit. If that was my son, I'd be sorely ashamed. He's going to cost the tax payer a lot of money for his delinquency.

You should not have photographed him, however. That does not stand in your favour at all.

Londonista- It's kind of hard to judge whether it's something that they would be interested in or not, without knowing her or what it is, but I just can't imagine any parent partaking in something that makes their children's surroundings an antisocial place to live... Of course it's your perogative to keep it to yourself, I just can't see a way for it to go away without the point of it all being explained And her realising its a misunderstanding. Though you don't see her very often do you? If it took her a few weeks to catch up with you about the pictures.. Then maybe it'll just be an uncomfortable silence if you happen to run into eachother..
I hope this gets sorted out soon,

Soupdragon- no we go out in public, never had an issue with anyone taking photos of my daughter to my knowledge, however I can see that if it were going to happen it would most likely be her out without me (which won't happen for a Few years yet)

betty exactly. And frankly I don't care if she/her kid/the block think I'm a nutcase, though I appreciate that if they think I'm a paedophile and tell their mates, their could be some vigilanteism (sp.). We are very unlikely to run into each other.