To be annoyed with all the people on FB thanking God for 'miracle' recoveries

[bumbleymummy]

Another one tonight where a boy's church are thanking God for him being found cancer free and thanking everyone for their prayers to make this possible. Lots of comments thanking God and Jesus and praise for how wonderful and gracious He is. Not a single mention of the doctors, surgeons, nurses etc who played a much more obvious role in his recovery!

And you have taken my comment wrong about children having an operation is the same as them passing away. You must think I'm a monster to speak like that. My post isn't about you or for you. It was for me and for GruntledOne who specifically asked.

Thank you Manic , it is always so hard to post and stand up for God. There is so much hurt and confusion and I know I will cop it from speaking but I think it's important to do so.

Lougle Nowhere in the Bible does it say that the Earth is round. I'm not convinced that it says it's flat either - but certainly not round. And seriously...running water? It took the creator of the universe to point this out? They didn't notice that dirt ran off with running water but didn't with mere dipping? Straw clutching if ever I saw it.

BumbleyMummy Of course you're right. But the "respect" police will try and shout you down.

Bottom line, it's rude and ignorant for people to publically thank their imaginary friend for something that doctors, nurses and science achieved for them.

The more devout they are the stupider their excuses....."But it was God that gave the doctors their knowledge". So highly trained people aren't even allowed to take credit for their own achievements? It's all about god. Always.

If people PUBLICALLY choose to air their views about how our universe works then they unfortunately have to cope with the fact that other people might take issue with them.

MermaidHair Please KNOW that god wants people in Heaven with him? KNOW?? How arrogant to assert something like this without feeling the least need to provide the merest hint of evidence? Who precisely are you that we should all just take your word for it.

To misquote someone else....if you can assert something without evidence, I can dismiss it without evidence.

So....please KNOW that your god does not exist.

Thank you Apricot , again that post was for someone who was genuinely interested and wanted to know what God had to say for me. What the fuck do you want me to say? Oh yeah God doesn't fucking exist, yes my husbands in the ground somewhere, lights out over. He never fucking existed!! All of our pain heartbreak is for God damn nothing. Sorry kids there is no god he doesn't exist when we die that's it? Oh yes life is fucking shit isn't kids. Or do you think for one God dann fucking second I am doing what the hell I need to do to survive? I am hanging on by a thread, but some person on the internet half way across the world feels the need to be a completely cruel and trying to humiliate me. Are you happy now?

"I don't much like posts such as these either but I do firmly believe in respecting the beliefs of others. I suspect you wouldn't be making points like this if the God being thanked was Allah hmm."

I really don't understand why people always say this. I most certainly would!

None of those people gave the pilot credit for doing an incredible job

Or Airbus Industries aerodynamicists and software designers for providing a whole stack of mechanisms on the aircraft, starting with Alpha Protection, which meant that Sullenberger could get on with flying the plane to a safe-ish piece of space while a vast amount of software stopped it from dropping out of the sky.

Langewiesche's book is well worth reading, but there's a good summary in the original magazine article:

www.vanityfair.com/culture/2009/06/us_airways200906

MermaidHair

Sadly for you I am one of the very few MNers who does not respond to attempts to emotionally manipulate me into shutting up.

You are not alone in having lost someone. Most of us have. I have...several times.

If you are comforted by your beliefs, good for you. But they are YOURS.

You are not simply putting forward an opinion in your posts...you are asserting as fact. And who gave you that right?

And I repeat...if you take upon yourself the responsibility to tell people what they should KNOW, then why can't I?

My family are Christian. All through my fathers cancer they have shown great appreciation of the wonderful treatment they have received. They have thanked god for every small successful step too. It's possible to do both.

Apricot, respect works both ways. I can have no respect for people who are so rude and dismissive of other people's beliefs. Yes we've all lost loved ones (some of us more than others), but who are you to dismiss the comfort and support that a faith gives someone at such an awful time. And how does it affect you, exactly?
I'm about to lose my brother, the fact that people are praying for him/us is very comforting. We know it won't affect the outcome, but it makes no damn difference to the lives of any non believers.

ApricotSorbet - 'please know that' is a turn of phrase for goodness sake. Mermaid is not trying to force her beliefs on anyone. She was specifically asked to share something very personal about what helped her through the hardest time in her life and it is cruel and insensitive to give her shit about it, especially when she has come back to say how much it has upset her. There's no need to keep on.

ApricotSorbet99 As an atheist, let me tell you: You are being a massive dick. Cordially...

YANBU. I find it massively offensive and ungrateful to the REAL PEOPLE involved in someone's care, when relatives start banging on about what a friend they have in bloody Jesus because all their praying has cured their Nan.

Here's an idea - next time she takes poorly don't bother taking her to hospital. I'm sure if god wants to cure her he'll find her. Cut out the middle men (those largely unnecessary Drs and Nurses) and let them heal all the poor souls who don't have anyone to pray all over them.

Exactly minimal. Having a faith and being eternally grateful for good medical care are not mutually exclusive.
And Ofa, I salute you.

I wasn't going to post again. I don't know what to say about me manipulating you. You have jumped on my post that was meant for someone else. I have never said that I am the only one that has lost someone. I lost my husband last year and the grief is still very raw for me, when you are putting in caps that my God doesn't exist, you are telling me all of those things I wrote. Your post genuinely upset me. I didn't know how grief is considered emotional manipulation. I'm sad if it seen as such. I am still a new Christian but I still am happy to answer people who are genuinely interested. I didn't just come on here lecturing to everyone. Nobody's grief trumps anyone else. We in our family believe our husband, father, son, grandson is in heaven. I don't understand why anyone would try to take that away. I don't know who you have had pass away but if you believe something else in not going to tell you otherwise. We have had a hard time and God is the only thing keeping our little family going. You are confusing some phrases I used as something else. I'm sorry you are angry but there is no need to be hurtful to another person.

I'm a palliative care nurse. I see at first hand the comfort that having a faith and prayer can bring to some people. And as I've said before, this affects the non believers how, exactly?
Sometimes, when emotions are running high, relatives don't always thank us at the time. Often they'll come back later and thank us or write to us. If they posted on fb about how their faith had helped hem through such a hard time but didn't mention us, do you know what? We wouldn't give a shiny shit, in fact it wouldn't even register on our radar.

Punkrocker

And where precisely have I demanded "respect"? I am nowhere near arrogant enough to insist that anything I say requires "respect" just because I say it. Unlike you lot.

And, frankly, if "respect" is doled out regardless in the way you seem to think it should be, then it's worth shit to me, so keep it.

And these "personal beliefs" are not actually that personal. They are truth claims about how our universe works made on a public website. Are you suggesting that we should bring in a backdoor blasphemy law where ONLY agreeable, polite remarks are allowed?

But let's look at where these "personal beliefs" can lead. To use one example, I lost my mother at a very young age. i spent about 2 years terrified that she was burning in hell thanks to the "deeply held personal beliefs" of others. I was also scared witless of her ghost paying a visit because of some cretious comments about "the dead always being with us" from people who should have known better.

MermaidHair and others are free to believe what they like. That's a pretty big and valuable freedom when you consider that it's still non-existent in many parts of the world. But they MUST balance that freedom by acknowledging the absolute right of others to contradict and criticise. Sneaking in gagging orders with "how RUDE" bollocks, as you've just predictably attempted should not be tolerated.

Anyone - ANYONE - who dresses up an opinion as a statement of FACT on a public thread like this should expect to ne faced with differing points of view. Don't like that? Ignore it then. Not exactly difficult.

And I would draw your attention to the thrust of this thread...it is not a Christian love-in like the types found in the Religion section.

minimalist, you're right. It is possible to do both so that's why it bothers me when people don't.

I am glad that people have found comfort and peace from their faith at difficult times. I have seen how important it is to people first hand so I'm trying to make it very clear that I'm not criticising people for having a belief in God. I just think if you are going to make a point of publicly thanking and praising someone for a loved ones' recovery then a bit of acknowledgement for the medical staff wouldn't go amiss. Particular when they get such a hard time when anything goes wrong!

Particularly.

aprilanne that's wonderful your child pulled through, but I wish you could see how potentially hurtful that viewpoint is.
I know a lovely family who are also devout Christians. Their little boy got cancer as a baby. He died, aged 3, of complications from pneumonia. They prayed as hard as anyone that ever lived for that little boy's life, but they lost him anyway.
What a cruel, fickle god.

No fr the op. If anyone of my dc were ill the first place I would go would be to hospital and then I would start praying. I know (there's that word again) that Drs and nurses are there to help and God would want us to use them. If one of them were terminally ill and then miraculously survived, I would truthfully thank God first, and then I know(naughty me) he would remind me to thank the medical team. There was a story somebod told me. There was a man who became shipwrecked on an island in the middle of nowhere. He prayed to God to save him and believed he would. I little later a ba came along to help hm, he refused as he was waiting on God, then a helicopter again he refused as he believed God wild save him. Eventually he died and went to heaven. First thing he said to God was why didn't you save me? God said I tried, I sent a boat and then a helicopter and you refused. So this is how I see it.

Apricot we have the same childhood. This isn't a Christian live in, this is just how some people are. Some people don't see why there is a need to be rude and cruel. I wouldn't speak to someone like that in real life or over the Internet. Even if I know know body knows who I am I don't have it in me. We don't have to be unkind to each other just because it is words on a screen. There is always someone behind those words. Good night everyone, I'm in the Southern Hemisphere. And thank you to those who have come to my defence it is very kind. And to anyone I may have upset. That was never ever my intention, I'm not like that.

Is there really a religious section? I'm sure I would love it there!

And I'm sorry for swearing at you Apricot. I will repent later.