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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be utterly sick of this child.

124 replies

Singsongsungagain · 16/10/2015 20:07

Long long story...
Dd1 has known a girl since they were at nursery together. They're now in year 4. This girl has repeatedly been horrible to her (stealing her shoes and throwing them across a field when she was on a swing/hitting her/kicking her/saying utterly vile things about her unborn sibling- just awful).
There was a big show down a while ago when we had spoken to the school and ended up speaking to the parents who were friends of ours. As a result the parents stopped speaking to us- told us their child was "angelic" and blamed our daughter for not wanting to play with her (I wonder why?!) and therefore emotionally damaging her.
After this things settled down, my child was left alone with her lovely friends who are every bit as kind as she is and wouldn't harm a fly.
Today, this child decided my daughter "had" to play with her. She literally dragged her by the arm away from her friends. My daughter said she daren't say no as she's scared of what she would do to her.

Now what? I've spoken to school loads of times. The parents think she's wonderful- despite actually witnessing some of her nastiness towards my child.

Half the issue is my daughter is too nice to her and doesn't stick up for herself but I don't want to change that or tell her to hit back- she's lovely and should be allowed to stay that way!
Ahhhhhhh!!!!

OP posts:
Xenadog · 18/10/2015 09:32

OP there's a number of issues going on here. Firstly I would agree that your DD needs to become more assertive and confident as this does deter most bullies. However the real issue is that regardless of how your DD behaves (timidly, assertive, whatever) she has a right to go to school and be emotionally and physically safe.

I would have all incidents written down and be going to speak to the HT with a governor present to discuss how they are going to keep your daughter safe at school. This is their duty of care. I would also have someone else with you for the meeting so they can take notes as things do get forgotten and misinterpreted after the event.

I would be laying it on the line that the school HAS to stop this bully immediately. The assaults on your DD are under the HT's watch and if they are not competent in preventing them then I would be gunning for their job. They clearly aren't up to the job and I would be contacting the education authority, (if the school operates under one) OFSTED, putting in a declaration of no-confidence in the HT and also inform them I have no problem with going to the press. Oh and I'd consider legal action as well aimed at the HT. In fact I would throw everything at them. I say this as a teacher as well.

Schools can be utterly shite in facing up to bullying but they don't have to be. They are because no one calls them on it with persistent bullies and so the bully continues to get away with their behaviour because the school doesn't want to admit they have a problem or aren't up to dealing with it.

My approach might seem way OTT but from my own experience too many HTs simply placate parents until the next incident and then the next. It's not good enough and unless you get tough this problem will continue.

I wish you well with this one, OP.

Singsongsungagain · 25/10/2015 03:28

Bit of an update. Since I posted this I have both written to and spoken to both the head and deputy head. There has also been another incident in which my child was charged at by this girl and knocked off her feet causing her to bruise her hip.
I have made it clear that I'm done with tolerating this. I had an awful experience talking to the deputy with my child present (she came in part way through the meeting) and listening to her saying that she is worried this girl will hurt her and she has threatened and hurt her many times.

The upshot is that the school are not willing to accept my daughter is being bullied. They believe that the child is not maliciously hurting my dd but is playing exuberantly.

Now what?

OP posts:
AcrossthePond55 · 25/10/2015 03:45

Now you go up the chain of command. I'm in the US so not sure who that would be in the UK, for us it was the school district superintendent. And we went with a lawyer in tow. Amazing how much you can get done with a lawyer taking notes.

5BlueHydrangea · 25/10/2015 03:49

Write to/ask for a meeting with the governors. Clearly the school are blind to it so take it beyond. Part of the governors role is to make sure the head is doing their job properly and clearly in this instance they're not.

Singsongsungagain · 25/10/2015 03:53

I have clearly told them that's my next move. The governing body is very likely to back the head though and given that some of the governing body are friends with this child's mum I don't hold much hope.

OP posts:
Senpai · 25/10/2015 04:49

In the US it's a bit easier to have teeth in something like this because you can file a claim against the school's insurance if your child gets hurt.

Here's what I would do:

Write a letter to the higher up chain of command and CC those two along the lines of:

"Sorry to have bothered you about this, X, Y, and Z has happened and head and deputy have failed to act or protect my child. These are the steps I've taken to prevent this. These are the injuries my child has received. I am getting this in writing and would like a written response as to your plan of action so that if something serious does happen you cannot claim ignorance."

Only accept responses in writing. If they have a meeting, write an email summing it up (Again, CC'd to the higher ups) and say something along the lines of "Thank you for meeting, here's what we talked about, I'm disappointed no further action was taken again".

I might give my child permission to deck the little bugger, and use the emails as justification that nothing was being done to separate these children

Senpai · 25/10/2015 04:54

Is it possible to file charges against a school for neglectful care, like you could a nursery?

OkFuckityBye · 25/10/2015 04:57

OP I'm raging on your behalf.

Ok so now you have identified what the real issue is here. The bullies mum is friends with the governors and has more influence at the school than you previously thought. She's protecting her little darling and the school is afraid of being seen to have a bullying problem, that doesn't mean they don't still have a legal duty of care to your child.

If it were me, I'd write a lengthy incident report detailing all of the incidents of bullying towards your child and the potential implications of each incident.

E.g. DD/MM/YY My daughter was dragged by [child's name] across the playground by her hair, causing bruising, emotional distress and embarrassment.

List them all one by one to demonstrate there is a catalogue of incidents. Then at the end of the report inform them them that you believe their assessment of these incidents cannot be anything other than bullying and they have a duty of care to your daughter.

Then lawyer up (and I don't say this lightly) and inform the school that legal action will be taken if this issue is not tackled properly.

Start banging on doors Monday morning and take no bloody prisoners.

Good luck Flowers

mathanxiety · 25/10/2015 05:02

I would say 'so that when something is done to my child that requires medical attention you cannot claim ignorance.'

In the wake of the meeting you have already had, I would send the HT a memo with the minutes, and the conclusion, and ask them to verify in writing that this meeting took place and that your account is a full and fair one.

mathanxiety · 25/10/2015 05:03

And where would OFSTED come into all of this?

Scoobydoo8 · 25/10/2015 05:06

Get DD to practice shouting/ yelling/ screaming - loud enough to be heard across the playground.

It's not easy as shock makes you mute.

Singsongsungagain · 25/10/2015 06:52

We've practised the shouting and actually this was mentioned in meeting with the deputy. The outcome last time she shouted was that both children had to apologise to each other (!!!)- the bully for dragging and the victim for shouting stop!!! I mean my God how can they ever think that is acceptable!!!!
I have told them categorically that my child should never again be forced to apologise for doing, actually, precisely what they have told her to do in the past. It's outrageous really.

I really did get quite blatantly pissed off in the meeting, particularly after watching my daughter speak about it which nearly destroyed me. I asked her to go out again so I could speak alone and told them that the LEA and Ofsted would be my next move following chair of Govs.

One concession I've asked for is that she be allowed to go in for lunch with her friends so that she doesn't end up alone in the playground and vulnerable to this girl. The answer I got was that they can't agree to do that because then all the children would want the same treatment. Again, I lost the plot a bit and told them that not all of the children were being bullied and that I think that really is the smallest thing that the school could and should offer to safeguard my child.

I am really concerned that the head is refusing to accept that this is bullying and that actually it has come to light that there has never been any sanctions whatsoever placed on the bully because "it was only playing". Playing doesn't usually result in one person being hurt repeatedly in my experience.

OP posts:
VocationalGoat · 25/10/2015 06:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Singsongsungagain · 25/10/2015 07:04

I said that in the meeting too. The trouble is that aside from this girl my daughter loves it there and has lots of lovely friends. She would be heartbroken. The school just need to bloody well sort it out so that she is allowed to stay away from her.

OP posts:
defineme · 25/10/2015 07:14

The smart girls guide books are great BUT this has gone a lot further and I would definitely be looking at other schools. Changing schools maybe the only way of protecting her and that's got to be your top priority.
I would photograph any bruises btw.
My friend iand her dh are teachers, so know how education works, similar happened to their dd and they really tried: registered letters to head and governors quoting school bullying policy, insisting on interviews with head (who in fairness responded and intervened) but the bully kept on in quieter more subtle ways snd her dd's self esteem was in tatters. Moving schools shouldn't have been necessary but she now has her dd back to her old self.

honkinghaddock · 25/10/2015 07:22

Even if the other child is not being malicious, your daughter has a right to be and feel safe in school. My son has severe sn and can be aggressive but doesn't do it to hurt others. I expect his school to do all they can to prevent this behaviour (as I do). You need to leave a paper trail. You need to go up the chain concentrating on the facts and that the school have a duty of care to your daughter. Sometimes hitting etc isn't bullying but that doesn't matter. What matters is your daughter is and feels safe.

StrictlyMumDancing · 25/10/2015 07:25

I'm so angry for you and your DD. I was bullied at school for years, all schools denying this was happening. It was rarely physical which is some respects was better but others worse. My DM was in school a lot in the end having similar arguments and changing schools was not an option - we lived too remotely. I remember she did tell the last school that as their wasn't any bullying happening that they surely wouldn't mind the police getting involved if any of the bullies went physical. Two weeks later I got hit. The school suddenly acknowledged the problem.

As your DD is being physically attacked I definitely suggest photographing it, writing a log. Maybe think about threatening police involvement, it may get them to move on it.

Can you also have a word with the Ju Jitsu instructor. Most martial arts instructors are very serious about how they should not be used out of lessons for attacking purposes.

Singsongsungagain · 25/10/2015 07:25

Honking- I totally agree with that and that's what I said to them. It's half term now but I'll be ringing the head first thing Monday to discuss what thoughts she's had during the holidays and what her plan is for safeguarding my daughter.

OP posts:
StrictlyMumDancing · 25/10/2015 07:25

*there

Singsongsungagain · 25/10/2015 07:27

Re the ju jitsu- those incidents were some months ago now and yes that's exactly what we did. She was told that if it happened again she wouldn't be allowed to go back to the club. To be fair, that aspect of the behaviour did stop but there was never any consequence for the 3 times it happened before they said that to her.

OP posts:
JJFinnegan · 25/10/2015 07:31

Your daughter should't be inside at playtimes, the bully should!

You need to do this quickly and properly so you now need to forward your detailed email on to the chair of governors and given them a week (specify a date) in which to respond and propose a plan of action.
I would try assume the governors have a degree of professionalism before you write them off as 'team bully'.

If nothing happens then you need to contact your LEA and escalate the situation to them.

If the school can't or won't sort this out then I would move your daughter to a different school. I know that seems completely wrong as your daughter is being 'punished' for someone else's behaviour BUT the effects of bullying can be devastating and far reaching for a child and she sounds like a lovely girl who will make great new friends at any school.

Good Luck!

honkinghaddock · 25/10/2015 08:01

Just to add I would leave consequences for the other child out of it. What matters is that it stops which may mean close supervision for the other child rather than punishment.

CantAffordtoLive · 25/10/2015 08:03

How awful. :(

Can you go to the press? I am sure the school would quickly change their attitude if you did that.

Fidelia · 25/10/2015 08:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Thelastthneed44 · 25/10/2015 08:08

I feel for you and your daughter Singsong. I really hope you manage to get this sorted. The school have handled the situation really badly. My DD sounds like she has a similar personality to your DD and is also suffering at the hands of a bully.

It was sorted last year, but we seem to be at square 1 again with new teacher. Sad

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