To dislike "Radical Feminism"

[InternetPerson]

I've got nothing against feminists that fight for womens rights and genuinely want the best the best for everyone and don't hate anyone, but "RadFems" tend to be full of bitterness and hatred. And I'm not just talking about kids, these are high profile, intelligent women with power and influence. Do you think it's unreasonable to dislike something where most people think men are inherantly evil and to be feared? Or do you think their hatred is fair and we should respect them for their good work in trying to make humans hate eath other even more?

Like, I said, I have nothing against Feminism, it's done a lot of great work down the years and still does, but "Rad Fem" and "Feminism" are too completly different things in my opinion. Is this a wrong conclusion?

AIBU?

Trans women can have a lived experience that is more similar to women than it is to a man.

I don't agree with this at all. You've just ignored the very well articulated aspects of how women's lives are shaped by their biology and ignored it. The only similarity is in the superficial perception of some people towards some MTTs and then only the passing ones.

Ego there are actual infertile women reading this who were not able to father children. It's pretty insensitive for you to complain about not being able to get pregnant.

What do you want me to say in response to that? Serious question.

One more thought - body type and shape is another issue I think women and transwomen are both judged on.

It's not enough to have a female body, it has to be a) fertile and b) the right type of body shape, and that varies from year to year and society to society. There are some women and transwomen who fulfil the latter category, but most won't. Most of us will be the wrong shape, height, weight, age, etc. and will be judged negatively because of that.

You brought it up. As you did with your comments about your body not doing things most women could. Buffy's post clearly explained why radfems believe female bodies are at the core of women's oppression. Then you talk about your body and conplain that you don't experience the things that are at the root of women's oppression. any further comment brings out the emotional blackmail. Talk about ducking gas lighting.

None of us are insensitive. Some people are born in the wrong body as it were and it must be awful. Similarly some women hate their bodies usually because of pressure put on them by men to look a certain way.

However women are free to talk about menstruation and childbirth - some of the principal aspects of mumsnet and something that binds most of us together who are as most women are. We will not be censored in talking about those topics because that might upset some people.

Just try to understand what it must be like to have your brain tell you one thing and your body being another.

Are you not coming very close to outright asking radfems to buy into your ideas about innate gender, here? I can believe you feel you fit the female gender concept better than the male (or neither). I can't agree that it's your brain telling you you're female in the way you seem to want, though. No offence intended, at all.

I think you are confusing body and gender.

Well I don't...

Free speech is very important. If women simpered quietly and never spoke out we'd never get anywhere.

We have to upset some people some of the time. Some people are upset if we simply say men and women are equal.

In that case, I'm not sure I can answer your question.

Because I think my body is wrong.

And does that not come from a belief that your identification as female gender is prompted by something biological (besides anatomy) - something innate? Otherwise you could just as well be claiming to identify as male gender yet still feel your sex should be female, no?

I don't know. I am what I am - and it is what it is. It's a very complex question - and I'm sure it's different for many people.

Thanks for the straight answer. I guess I assumed you felt it was innate, because coming out as trans seems quite... I don't know, drastic? to me, if you aren't sure that what you're feeling is down to innate gender not matching with body, rather than the inability to recognise oneself in the gender 'expected' by society.

But from what you say it sounds like your starting point was feeling like you had the wrong body to start with, irrespective of thoughts on gender? I'm not sure that's something I had considered could be the case for some trans people. I'll have to let that one digest, I think.

Sorry if the questions came off as prying. Obviously you don't owe anyone any answers.