Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5

Original poster

Asking for my money back from cleaner?

121 replies

Gobbolinothewitchscat · 20/09/2015 21:09

We have had the same cleaner for 7 years and introduced her to various groups ends whom she cleans for too as originally she was very reliable

In the last year or so, she has become much Jess reliable. As I'm a bit of a soft touch, I've tended to just let things go and probably been the client most taken advantage of. For example, I have a 2 year old and a 1 year old and am 32 weeks pregnant so getting out of the house is a bit of a mission. However, I do go out when cleNer comes to let her have the run of the place and make it easier. On numerous ocassions, I've just been strapping everyone into the car to see her disappearing into the neighbour's that she cleans for. When I ask her what's happening, she'll say that she hadn't been able to clean for them that week so was just going to do that now and asks if she can come to us another day. I have always said yes but been a bit pissed off as I've had no notice what so ever and if I hadn't bumped into her then she just wouldn't have turned up.

Anyway......we went away on holiday for two weeks and got home yesterday to find that the cleaning money had been taken but no cleaning at all had been done. I texted to find out what had happened and cleaner said she was confused and thought I had wanted her to have a two week break between coming but had come in for 1 week. It just didn't make sense as my text was explicitly clear plus it was obvious that she hadn't done any cleaning at all. I have texted back to say I was struggling to see what cleaning had been done but was she coming this week? No response at all.

DH has said we need someone reliable and I agree so we've decided to look for a new cleaner. I just want the keys back but DH thinks I should also ask for one week of money back. We don't think cleaner has done any cleaning at all but by her own admission, she only came for one week.

I just feel a bit awkward about asking for the money and just want to draw a line under things as quickly as possible. I'm actually not liking forward to saying we don't need her anymore and feel like I need to do it face to face as a text would be a bit off. AIBU to ask for the money back? Also, do I need to end things face to face?

OP posts:

TheOddity · 21/09/2015 04:12

I agree with the head space comments. I would explain why you no longer want her services, change the locks and write of the cash because you have no proof, I.e. Before and after photos.
I'd be livid though.

Bulbasaur · 21/09/2015 04:25

On principle, I would want my money back. But depending on how much I paid her, I'm not sure it'd be worth the headache to get back.

Honestly, I'd just change the locks and ask for the key back as a formality so she knows its over. If she ignores you, no big deal.

TidyDancer · 21/09/2015 07:15

I wouldn't ask for the money back - there's very little you can prove as to what went on while you were on holiday and even if you could, you will come off looking petty. Ask for the keys back but tbh I would be changing the locks anyway so not sure how worth it that is, other than to make a point.

Not saying you're in the wrong btw, because clearly you're not, but sometimes it's just better to let things go and get another cleaner.

Original poster

Gobbolinothewitchscat · 21/09/2015 07:42

We only intended to ask her for one week of money back as, by her own admission, via text, she only came in for one week. Re: proving whether she had cleaned the other week, I'm fairly sure we could in that there were mouldy dishes in the dishwasher etc and DH and I could each corroborate each other's view. But, we don't want to go down that route so we'll just leave the money in its total and not ask for anything back bar the key but change the locks anyway.

DH has woken up deciding life is too short but he pointed out that if she were a carer coming into someone's house, we'd probably be advised to call the police (which we won't do!) as it's basically taking advantage of a position of trust. He's back to work today and wondering whether anyone at his work declared it a two week holiday for the rest of his employees too as he was away and whether anyone has actually been in

The money is a 3 figure sum so not insignificant but I'd rather just move on.

OP posts:

BrendaandEddie · 21/09/2015 07:44

Sack her. You won't get the money

May09Bump · 21/09/2015 07:57

Its not worth the stress and effort to pursue her. Draw a line under it.

Change the locks and send her a text saying she is no longer required.

Focus on the important stuff, pregnancy, LO's and building work.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 21/09/2015 08:59

As you say-life's too short to chase the money - sounds as if you've had a reasonable relationship with her, which has now gone wrong for whatever reason.

Ask for key return...do This... To show her finally that this is the end of your agreement.

Change the locks- it's relatively cheap, and much less than invalidated insurance

We've always changed locks when we've moved into a new place, even rented....

Sounds OTT, I've done this... ever since my pal lost most of her expensive possessions but her insurance claim wasn't paid, as the burglar had used a key/ wandered thru an insecure door/window.

Many people don't realise that your insurance is invalid without forced entry...

A pal who worked in a rental agency confirmed that they often had no idea how many keys were' out there' for any individual property, even when tenancies ended. Often they were fairly cavalier too - they would give keys out to anyone who was giving quotes for maintenance /building work. No one has any in depth knowledge of workmen or their backgrounds. Many ex offenders I knew worked giving quotes for double glazing... .

I know vast majority of people are honest.. But it takes just one...

Also there are no guarantees that ALL keys are returned when a house is sold/tenancy ended. Évry tenancy I've had I've had spare keys cut...(for visiting parents etc..). Thèse rarely have been returned.... Esp With nazi ex landlords...

ohtheholidays · 21/09/2015 09:00

YANBU,it sounds like your cleaner has been treated very well by your family,it's awful that she's decided to take advantage of you all.

I would want the money back and the keys,even before you said it was a 3 figure sum.

I think texting her would be fine,she hasn't bothered to even inform you before that she wouldn't be turning up and has taken money from you without doing her job so I honestly don't think you owe her anything.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 21/09/2015 09:06

PS my ex-con contacts I hasten to add, I knew professionally through forensic work.!! I wasn't giving them my spare keys to vacated properties... (thèse were dispensed of, elsewhere!)

DanglyEarrings · 21/09/2015 09:19

We are a cleaning company and this is what we have against the 'cash in hand' brigade, they are cheap and they lower the standards of the industry.

The trouble is there is far more demand for cleaning services than there is supply and in these types who are not operating professionally this can create a mentality of 'easy come, easy go' about their clients!

It's appalling really but also not uncommon, when I go to quote at a potential client's home they often tell me about the service they had before and if it was a 'cash in hand' 'cleaning lady' type service it tends to end up this way.

Although the professional cleaning services will value clients and offer great customer service, these 'other' cleaning people will do whatever they can get away with for as long as they can.

Yes it makes us a little mad but that's the way it seems to be, just vote with your feet and hire a great service who are customer service orientated,with a good reputation and great reviews, if you can, try to get a word-of-mouth referral before choosing a service. Ask them if they have a complaints procedure in place and if you can have a copy and ask who handles the complaints. Ask how keys are held, where they are held and how they are logged in and out of the key safe. The service should hold a log of who has your key at any given time.

A cleaning service is not just about providing actual cleaning, there is a whole level of responsibility towards the clients' satisfaction and security of their home to consider. Hire someone who realises this and has effective procedures in place to cover these.

Toooldtobearsed · 21/09/2015 09:40

I have one of the 'cash in hand' brigade who is far more professional, has higher standards and more integrity than any agency staff I used in the past.

I really find your comments about self employed cleaners disgraceful dangly. There are good, bad and indifferent employees in every profession and personally, I would rather pay the person that does all the hard graft a decent wage, rather than see a large percentage go into the hands of a company.

And what the fuck is all the 'other' cleaning people about? Are they some sort of sub species???

I was feeling quite mellow this morning til I read this.

OP - you have gone above and beyond - get rid, change locks and move on. Good luck!

Marynary · 21/09/2015 09:44

The agency I used certainly did not have higher standards than any of the self employed cleaners I have used. They just charged twice as much.

Rachel0Greep · 21/09/2015 09:55

I agree with what you have decided to do, OP. I wouldn't want her back, and would prefer to draw a line under the whole thing. It's very deceitful what she has done, and once trust is gone, that is the end really, IMO. She isn't even bothered to answer your texts. I'd go ahead and change the locks, and start searching for a new cleaner. All the best with the rest of your pregnancy.

Nanny0gg · 21/09/2015 10:03

I don't understand why, when you are employing someone to work in your home, you treat them differently to any other employee (and yes I know, they are self-employed)

Why let their slack attitude to work go un-commented on? Why don't you pull them up sooner?

Yes, they shouldn't need it, but lots of people take advantage. It's just that if they were 'normal' employees they'd get a warning and a chance to improve. If they don't, then steps are taken.

Why don't people do this with cleaners? They seem to get away with small liberties, which get bigger until it's blatant and then they're sacked. As she was so good in the beginning it seems a shame it's got this far.

TestingTestingWonTooFree · 21/09/2015 10:06

Are you satisfied she's not in a coma somewhere? If so, I'd definitely ask for keys and money back. If you were kind, I might say "you must have forgotten/changed plans but you took the cash for the second week, so I'd like it back please". Give her an out from being a thief.

GhoulWithADragonTattoo · 21/09/2015 10:26

Ask her to come and clean when she arrives get keys back and tell her services no longer required. Write off the money.

CloakAndJagger · 21/09/2015 10:27

just say you don't want her services any more and ask for the keys back.

Write off the money. You're dealing with that by not employing her any more. If she asks why you're cancelling her, tell her why.

Changing the locks seems like a pointless expense when you only need to ask for them back.

Topaz25 · 21/09/2015 12:14

I think the reason that people find it difficult to treat a cleaner like any other employee is that when you know them for years and trust them to come into your home you build a bond. I was in a similar situation, when I hired someone to clean my house we got talking, I found out that we had mutual friends and common interests and we became friends. When the quality of her work declined, I found it difficult to address, especially since she had confided in me that she was having financial and other personal problems and I felt sorry for her. Things came to a head and we eventually had to let her go because she was so unreliable. Unfortunately she took it badly and made up some awful rumors about us, it was unprofessional and upsetting. If I had a cleaner in future I would definitely keep professional boundaries in place to avoid issues. I do think the OP should change her locks as the cleaner could have made a copy and she has shown form for being untrustworthy by taking money without providing the service. I don't buy that it was a misunderstanding, she had clear written instructions and wouldn't she have wondered why she was getting two weeks money if she was only working one?

Original poster

Gobbolinothewitchscat · 22/09/2015 15:53

Well I've still not done anything as I'm a big scardy cat

Cleaner coming later this week. I'm wondering about saying that I think there's no point coming into clean due to builders and I'll be in touch once things have settled down but understand that she may very well have found a new job. Then that avoids bad feeling

But then another bit of me thinks I should be honest and say this isn't working out for us.

Uuurggh why is is this so hard.

I am setting myself a deadline to text by 12 tomorrow

OP posts:

Bogeyface · 22/09/2015 16:03

"This is to inform you that your services as a cleaner are no longer required from [X Date]. Please return the keys by this date. I wish you well in the future. From Gobbo"

Job done.

Bottlecap · 22/09/2015 16:23

You're just going to have to grow up and learn how to speak directly with your cleaner. That's not intended as a criticism, by the way, I've had to give myself the same instructions many times. She is taking the piss in several different ways.

FWIW, I think packing up a 1 and 2 year old (while pregnant!) to leave her to clean on her own is thoughtful. You understand how unpleasant it might be for her to work with you around, so you leave at pretty great inconvenience to yourself. Unless your house is extremely small, she can work around you with zero reduction in efficiency.

Autumn seems to have some kind of axe to grind with you.

DaemonPantalaemon · 22/09/2015 16:23

Well I've still not done anything as I'm a big scardy cat

I am genuinely interested because I am not from the UK. Is she of a different race to you, and you are going through some white middle class woman guilt thing? Thinking you can change the world by letting someone shit all over you? It is an attitude I have seen before here, I find it strange.

You want to avoid bad feeling? But you do already feel bad because of the way she treated you? So you are going to let someone walk all over you to avoid bad feelings??

You paid her to do a job. She was not doing it. You terminate the contract. And tell her. Why this kerfuffle over such a simple matter? How does fear enter into it? I genuinely don't get it, so please do educate me.

DaemonPantalaemon · 22/09/2015 16:25

Uuurggh why is is this so hard

Maybe because you are making a huge deal out of a very simple issue?

Bottlecap · 22/09/2015 16:25

That sounds about right for me anyway.

lucidlady · 22/09/2015 16:31

In these situations I find it helps me to pretend this is a work scenario. So as the shit hot employment lawyer that you are, if one of your team pissed about like this, you'd not think twice about having them disciplined. Think of it like a performance management scenario - she's been rated under performing so next step is p45. Imagine your boss is watching you - get it done!

Flip

1 2 3 4 5

Swipe left for the next trending thread