To think tha more than one carb for dinner is unnecessary (and will probably make you fat if done regularly)

[HackerFucker22]

Just back from a friends and had a very interesting debate over dinner.

We all had homemade pizza and garlic bread which was bloody lovely but I made a comment about having a "carb on carb" meal to be met with blank stares... I explained further and not one person seemed to think there was anything odd about eating so many carbs at once.

There were 6 of us and I am the only fat one.

Half of the group said they have more than one carb with dinner "quite often" examples were jacket spuds served with Lasagne, some type of bread with pasta dishes and curry with rice and Naan - one friend has very posh bread on the table with every evening meal

We're all in our 30's, mostly have kids and jobs so no time for excessive gym attendance.

AIBU to think they are all talking utter shite?

Interesting I also would naturally avoid carb on carb generally. I would do garlic bread and lasgagne occasionally but yes would generally only have one lot of carbs.

but what on earth is with the carbs makes you fat obsession?

because they are different type of sugar, and it goes straight to blood stream, gives you sugar highs and lows and all that jazz.

also eating carb heavy can leave you wanting more whereas more protein heavy diets fill you up and leave you feeling fuller for longer, as well as all other health benefits re sugar.

You can loose weight eating chocolate and crisps your right, if you watch the amount you will loose weight, but your health wont thank you for it.

YANBU i never have more than one type if carb in a meal, its unneccessary and a lot healthier to fill up on veg.

*because they are different type of sugar, and it goes straight to blood stream, gives you sugar highs and lows and all that jazz.

also eating carb heavy can leave you wanting more whereas more protein heavy diets fill you up and leave you feeling fuller for longer, as well as all other health benefits re sugar.*

Exactly, the more processed carbs are much higher in GI and its easy to eat far far too much of them.

There are essential fats, minerals, nutrients and protein. No such thing as essential carbs. Modern diets are far too high in them.

"its unneccessary"

Food is supposed to be enjoyable though. It's not all about 'necessity', otherwise we'd all be eating plain, basic rations.

I don't know, I've lost 25 pounds this year by eating less (I do 5:2 and have also improved food quality, and hardly ever snack). Back when I was overweight, I did often eat white carbs like pizza, baguettes and pasta.

Of course like anything else, it's about the amount you eat but it's a hell of a lot easier to eat too many calories in the form of pizza or pasta than broccoli or carrots! And when you're having double carbs, I think it's even easier - I know if I have pizza and chips for example, I will end up eating more in total than if I had just pizza. It's like when you feel full but have room for a pudding. Pizza and white bread also lack the nutrients that you get from eating quinoa or sweet potatoes instead - they are all carbs but not all carbs are the same. Some people also react to white carbs a lot more and crave more of them as a result of the insulin spikes.

Then again, one double carb meal on a Sunday evening is not going to make anyone fat if they eat well the rest of the time. So YANBU, really, with some caveats.

I agree your health certainly wont thank you for a diet that consist of crisps but complex carbohydrates do not damage your health. My nutritionist actually recommends 60% of a daily diet to consist of carbohydrates.

I have tried a low carbohydrate diet before and yes I was much less hungry but I personally couldn't sustain that type of diet myself and I think that is the important thing for anyone who wishes to lose weight. Chose something that you can be subsistent with whether that be low carb, high carb, intermittent fasting or whatever. It is just a case of calories in vs calories out for weight loss only. So in that sense no carbs do not make you fat overeating anything does.

I had carb on carb last night but I had about three spoons of rice and half a nan.

Its all about the amount, I also had half a cream cake as that is enough for me and Dh enjoyed 1.5 cream cakes.

Iamnot I'm just like your dsis, its not deliberate its just the way I am.

subsistent? Consistent even - can't think straight have a sudden craving or pizza because of this thread!

Agree, was just remebering the mozzerella I bought on Friday and thinking I'll put some pizza dough on when I get home.

because they are different type of sugar, and it goes straight to blood stream

No, they aren't, and no, it doesn't.

All foods are ultimately broken down to glucose. Protein, carb, whatever.

Complex carbs (long chains of sugars), and proteins take a little longer to break down and enter the blood sugar. Simple carbs- one or two sugars, break down and enter the blood stream relatively quickly. Look up Glycaemic index.

Same types of sugars. Like lego- you can take apart two blocks way quicker than you can break down an elaborate construction into single blocks. Same building blocks though.

Eating too much makes you fat. Eating shedloads of fat makes you fat unless you compensate by majorly cutting down on something else (i.e. carbs). Eating shedloads of carbs makes you fat unless you compensate by cutting out fat. Sitting on your bum all day makes you fat.

You can probably lose weight by cutting out fat, or carbs, or by reducing portions or by not snacking or by doing lots of exercise. Or by a combination of those things. Which ones work best for you depends on your lifestyle, willpower and eating habits.

I think it's also true to say that some foods can affect your weight because of the effect they have on your appetite. So even if you believe it's just all about portion or calories, sugary foods can make you want to eat more. So ultimately they might make you fatter even more than their own calorie count would suggest.

I'm do carbs affect the body in the exact same way as protein? I'm on a liver shrinkage diet to reduce the size of my liver, if carbs and protein act in the same way then why is the diet very low carb?

When else would you eat garlic bread if not with pizza or pasta? If you never eat double carbs you would therefore never eat garlic bread, what a waste!

Loads of traditional meal combos have double carbs. Roast potatoes plus yorkshire pudding, curry and rice plus poppadoms or naan bread to name but two.

Yes, if you're actively trying to lose weight then you might avoid such combinations but otherwise stop worrying. People are obsessed with healthy eating these days. Unless you actually have a health problem then I say eat what you like and get on with your life.

worraliberty, I totally agree. "Necessary food" would be much less and much less varied than what most people eat. I eat because I enjoy it. I like vegetables but I refuse to obsess about carbs etc.

Why on earth would you only be able to eat garlic bread with pizza or pasta?! You can eat garlic bread with anything you like - meat, fish, salad, whatever!

The issue with double carbs as far as I can see is a) people still eating as much of each carb as if that was the only carb served (so if I'd normally eat 4 slices of pizza, if I was also having garlic bread, I'd only have a couple of slices pizza and a couple of garlic bread - many overweight people I have noticed will serve the same amount of the main parts of a meal, regardless of the numbers of side dishes being eaten as well) and b) I tend to stay feeling full for longer on protein heavy meals than carb heavy, so while I'll not get fatter eating 500 cals of carbs than 500 cals of protein, I'm more likely to eat more over a whole day if I'm taking my main calories from carbs, because I'll snack/eat more before feeling full.

Tootsietoo - re feeding my children, with the two who have naturally good appetite control obviously I leave them well alone, with the other I make sure I don't deny him anything outright. He has a naturally sweet tooth and I try not to deny that but will offer a couple of squares of dark chocolate or something, that's been surprisingly effective but I am encouraging delayed gratification so no seconds for 15 minutes after the first portion to make sure its really needed, talk about food as energy, try to be conscious of what we're eating so we've developed a bit of a joke of making sure we're hungry so we can really savour the first mouthful of dinner (that might seem a bit odd!). Also I try to make sure his food has a good rich taste, its a lot easier to eat pile after pile of bland food than it is something spicy or rich.

As he gets older he is developing greater control. It helps that he's into sport and he has started to recognise feeling sluggish based on what he's eaten. He's not overweight as his sport keeps him fit but I am cautious because he can't rely on exercise only as he gets older.

Sorry not that relevant to the double carb debate!!

Those of you interested and who have the time, read Gary Taubes' book 'The Diet Delusion', been out for a while now. He's a scientific journalist, not a nutritionist, and closely examined the major studies on diet that influenced the diet and nutrition information of the last couple of decades.

There is much in there about the inadequacy of different studies on nutrition which demonised fat and promoted refined carbohydrates, and the narrow mindedness of many scientists and nutritionists who wanted to defend their research.

In short, the introduction of sugar and refined flour carbohydrates, plus fructose syrup, has had a detrimental effect on many many people and cultures. However, not everyone is adversely affected by refined carbohydrates in the same way.

For those who are,it seems that many more calories are needed from high carb intakes to provide their nutritional requirements, so they will be prompted to eat more to get the same benefits as other people get from lower calorie intake. There are obviously other factors at play, but 'eating too much and not moving enough' is simplistic and not correct for everyone.

As for anecdotes, I have life long friends who can eat over three thousand calories a day and not put on weight (sedentary, office based lifestyles) and I certainly know one person who gains weight easily on less than 1500 calories daily.

I think metabolism does make a difference...you see people metabolize alcohol much faster than others, why would food not be the same? And metabolism slows down as we age and it's harder to lose weight than it was when we were young.

And I do have a friend who eats a lot and doesn't gain weight. I'm far, far fatter than she is. And yes, she does eat less than I do and exercise more, but not that much less/more. I lived with her for a time when we were younger and she ate constantly as well as drinking for the entire weekend and she was very thin. Her whole family is.

When else would you eat garlic bread if not with pizza or pasta?

With soup. Specifically Heinz tomato.

I think that sugar (and I mean the processed, refined, crystallised stuff in packets or bottles of syrup, not unprocessed fruit and veg) should probably be reclassified as a drug or flavour-enhancing chemical rather than a foodstuff, 'carb' or otherwise. There are an awful lot of people around whose main problem is probably sugar addiction. This does affect the appetite and muck about with insulin production.

And just to correct a PP who said sugar and fat are not found together in nature - they are. They are found in milk. Those who enjoy sweet and creamy tastes are likely to be emotionally harking back to babyhood, when high calorie combinations of nutrients make sense.

Why 500 kcals of protein is likely better than 500 kcals of carbs for weight loss:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15466943

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16469977

Though I don't personally see this as a reason to do low or no carb. You need both, obviously. I just tend to avoid toast and butter/other high cal food for breakfast if I can replace it with yoghurt and fruit and a sprinkling of porridge oats.

I was doing cold roast beef today with salad but bugger it im doing roasties and yorkshires bring on the double carbs might even have mash

Everyone saying 'food is meant to be enjoyed'

No it's not. It's ( nutrition)required to keep us alive. Since when has garlic bread been able to do that? I wouldn't class it as food, it's a stomach filler full of salt and sugar which stops your stomach gurgling. It doesn't offer what your body needs

And if I ate garlic bread and went for a run after I'd be out of energy before I'd warmed up!