Well, there we have it: Jeremy Corbyn has just been announced the next Labour Leader - Part 2

[Donotknowhownottomind]

Just opening the continuation of the last thread...

And unless the economy is sucessful and regenerates there's no bloody money for any wonderful policies is there.

And noone sensible would trust Corbyn with the economic recovery.

God forbid.

mistigri the difference is Cameron is electable and was elected by the UK. Corbyn isn't. a union organiser, hmm that's a real world job then isn't it.

perhaps the parties need to look at this for themselves and make sure potential candidates get some real world experience.

wasonthelist - if you were there then you didn't live in my town. I remember the power cuts really well and the beer and sandwiches for the union leaders who had their hands up the labour leaders back.

I don't remember anyone having to rely on food banks in the 70s

You wouldn't because there were none.

I just remember being always short of money. The 3 day week meant you were only paid for 3 days. A 25% pay rise from one union meant other unions wanted a 25% pay rise too which meant the cost of everything rose by 25%. Harold Wilson was rubbing his hands with glee about how much he was going to tax the rich only for them to disappear overseas. Would you stay in a country where they only allow you to keep 2p in every pound you earned?
This left the middle and working classes to pick up the bill. The unemployed who couldn't strike for more money had their fixed income but this didn't cover the price rises.

Giving me a bit of a problem there mummymeister. I am told as a woman I need women in political life to represent me. However by your definition if they are actively pursuing a career they have no idea how to address the challenges of being a SAHM.

I tend to think someone who has spent the majority of their working life consulting and representing people from all walks of life has a better chance of understanding everyone else than someone who speaks from their own narrow experience.

The issue I have with lifetime politicians, who've never done a normal job for any length of time, is that they are usually blind & ignorant when it comes to how the world works for most of us. We are just numbers on a spreadsheet, poll results and petitions.

Say what you like about Corbyn's career history and Islington, he spends as much time as possible with normal people. Joining in demos is a great way to talk to worried people on their level, as are going to fundraisers and talking to people out & about.

Very few of our high-profile MPs do this but all the great ones have iirc.

no food banks just a sense of community and neighbours who made sure you didn't go short. and this isn't some rose tinted glasses thing. it really happened. extra pies sent next door or going to Aunties up the road for a bit of cake and the shopkeeper selling end of the jar sweets that were all stuck together for half price.

no one in their right mind is going to work for 2p in the £. as for renationalising the railways, your pension is more than likely invested in the shares of the company. cant see many people wanting this when the truth dawns.

I am not a tory apologist. answers which say "yeah that's true but the tories do it as well" isn't my point. two wrongs don't make a right.

of course its wrong for the tories as well but this is a thread about corbyn and labour.

Can anybody explain what was so bad about the 70s?

I was born 81.

My dad once sort of tried to tell me but he RAMBLED so, I could never keep up!

'That journalist with Dennis Skinner was not making a joke and I'm glad he put her in her place about it.'

Yes Annie it clearly was not a joke! It was intentional spin. Glad Dennis didn't let her get away with it. It's ethics. The media need to be careful if they continue to intentionally deceive and piss off the public and in effect no longer becoming their spokesperson.

He didn't sing the National Anthem because it is about the Queen. The media is having a field day about it.

Black

Bodies left unburied, rubbish piled high, no idea if you would have electricity when you got home, no hot bath water, washing your hair in cold water over the bath, no hair dryers because there was no electricity, not being able to get to work because the bus drivers had decided to call a strike. Remember this was before mobiles, internet etc so you would be stood in the freezing cold with wet hair at a bus stop for some time before you realised you had to find alternative transport.

To realise just how bad things were in November come home, don't switch on any lights or heating or any form of electronic communication, sit around a table eating cold food then go to bed in the freezing cold and there you have the 70s.
Oh and give 2/5ths of your salary away as you are only working 3 days per week.

blackcloud the Labour Party entered into an agreement with the trade unions in respect of pubic sector wages.

They went back on it in part (and yes, before anyone starts howling, I know it's a simplification, but ya know the poster isn't asking for a thesis) to try to curb inflation.

The unions began striking and James Callaghan, the Labour Prime Minister was unable to contain it. This culminated in waste pile ups in cities and power cuts (during a very cold winter 1979). It was dubbed The Winter of Discontent.

Margaret Thatcher pretty much ran her successful bid for power based on wanting to curb the power of the unions.

I suspect a fair few of this and many previous cabinet members have never had a proper job. Or getting a job without parental help. Yes there will be examples who have lived in the real world, certainly as children. And others who pretend to have achieved office by themselves, forgetting their rich spouse insulating them from the stresses of ordinary life.

I have heard of the winter of discontent before but didn't really know what it was - thanks for explaining that to me SheGot; I really appreciate it.

So - do people feel Corbyn represents a return to that?

I don't understand why everyone keeps on about the 70s. No one is going back to the 70s ffs
Who do you think you are? Emmett Brown?

I agree with claig, so it's pointless putting my own view. The media pantomime is so daft it's untrue. I for one won't be patronised by it

Oh God now I imagine there might be a mail article of poor Jeremy dressed as doc

Might be worth also saying blackcloud that following Thatcher's election win, the Labour Party fell in to a period of terrible unrest.

The in fighting was appalling and the party were not able to offer any sort of credible opposition to Thatcher and her policies.

Micheal Foot became leader of the party. A man much like JC. Honourable, left wing, a pacifist, disinclined to deal with the media.

Some MPs left the party altogether and set up a new party. Labour were spanked soundly in the next general election.

Neil Kinnock took over as leader in 1983 and began the process of reforming the party, expelling some far left members and putting some distance between the party and the unions.

He didn't win either, but his successor was Blair...

owl

We keep banging on about the 70s/80s as those of us who were there remember the wilderness years for labour and that's where we are heading again!

And yes no food banks but poverty aplenty helped by family and friends and charities.

You are kidding yourself that this is some brave new dawn! Bollocks. It's going to be the Tories into the next decade thanks to twats in the Labour Party who voted for Corbyn.

I am interested in it all but know VERY little about it. I voted conservative this time round - to be honest Labour don't stand a chance where I live and our local MP is pretty good and there was a chance of UKIP, so ... wasn't sure what to think.

I still don't know what to think for that matter!

I think it's inevitable and quite right that we look to the past.

I've never met a socialist that didn't bang on about Thatcher.

So it's inevitable that Tories will see JC and think back to 1979.

But actually for many Labour supporters it's not 1979 they're worried about but the Wilderness Years that followed. JC was and remains firmly rooted in the politics of that time. We can't simply ignore that!

Meister I have already answered that I was there for the 60s and 70s. Your judgement about "real world experience" could equally well apply to zillions of politicians of all colours and whilst it has some merit, it's unlikely to change any time soon. Quite a few old Labour politicians like Dennis Skinner were ex miners and the like but since we abolished almost all of those kinds of jobs that's been less prevalent.

Meister - who did the Union leaders have their hands up the back of when we had a Conservative government and power cuts?

PMQs is a pantomime anyway.

Your experience of the 1970s probably depends a lot on where you lived - I grew up in London and was a teenager in the 70s, and my memories aren't of hardship. My mother was a single parent, living on a single salary as a primary school teacher with no money from my dad, and we were able to afford our own home and a decent if not extravagant life without any state support.

I moved into work in the early 1980s, and have vivid memories of the two Thatcher recessions, and the riots, and the house price boom and bust (we were in negative equity for most of the time I owned a house in London).

A return to the 1970s is not on the cards whoever is in government - the trade union movement has changed. I was anti Union in the 1980 despite being a labour voter at the time (worked in an industry that was still closed shop) but they are different animals now.

Going back to the question of how 'democratic' it is for Labour MPs to distance themselves from Corbyn, I do think it's a bit more complicated than 'he won the election, get over it.' Having recently rejoined, I'm struck by the fact that my CLP did not nominate him. So our local MP has been told that local activists do not endorse him or his vision. And presumably part of the MP's role is to listen to local party members? (I haven't cross matched CLP nominations and front-bench resignations by the way!)

Re Emily and co I am so disgusted with the disingenuous hand wringing on the bbc I have resorted to watching Skynews because at least you know where they are coming from and they do at least have the decency to spout nonsense with a sense of humour sometimes.