Well, there we have it: Jeremy Corbyn has just been announced the next Labour Leader

[InTheBox]

With 59% of the vote (first round).

I've just been following the live BBC broadcast and just wanted them to get on with it.

No doubt people on both sides of the political spectrum will be overjoyed with the result.

I'm not suggesting you or others posting at present are necessarily of that view, Squoosh, but we both know that there are those who are?

I think the tax concession is an interesting one. For one thing, fees for independent schools are paid by the parents out of gross income. So they are already paying the tax to pay for state education. The way I see it, they are paying without also being a cost to the system. As they will tend to be the higher earners and therefore higher tax payers, you might argue that they are already making a pretty hefty contribution?

Taking the charitable status away would not - on that basis - appear a particularly reasonable thing to do and if the increase in the cost of private schools fees pushed substantially more kids into the state sector, that would most certainly make things worse.

People tend to forget that increasing tax thresholds etc does not always have the intended consequence.

I went to a direct-grant, selective grammar. But thanks for ignoring my point that parents are always choosing public school to reflect their beliefs.

thanks for ignoring my point that parents are always choosing public school to reflect their beliefs

Well, this is one parent who chose the Independent sector because it offered a better standard of education (borne out by examination statistics) than any sense of social entitlement or political belief.

I on the other hand, Garrick attended a non-selective Comprehensive and paid for my degree as a mature student out of my post tax income earned from my full time job.

I prefer my children to form their own political views based on objective, rational and considerate understanding of the wider society in which they live. That may or may not accord with where I happen to cast my vote.

I campaigned and voted to join the then EEC in 1975 and I am now more confident we'll win the next referendum, to stay in the EU. Good for business, good for workers.
Not much of an opposition: Racists, climate-change deniers and those proud to be ignorant of the facts.

If JC wants to leave the EU, he would be handing British workers over to the mercy of the "elite". However, I've read his attitude towards the EU is now becoming more positive.

Net income not Gross.

It's late and I'm tired.

'Not much of an opposition: Racists, climate-change deniers and those proud to be ignorant of the facts.'

That is your patronising view of 4 million UKIP voters, but UKIP was such an opposition to the Establishment that UKIP won the European elections against all the media and Establishment parties, the first time in 100 years that an election was won by a party that wasn't one of the big two.

Not rtft but

"labours been unelectable for years BECAUSE it was indistinguishable from the tories, in fact all three main parties were indistinguishable from each other.

Whether they get in power or not, is not a reason to betray principles and sell out"

"I don't understand why people keep saying Corbyn will make Labour unelectable. They weren't electable previously - hence the last election result." Yes this viewpoint is odd. Especially given the 'keep doing the same you'll keep getting the same result" logic.

Also while a labour victory in the next GE would be great imho, a genuine party of opposition is needed. Britain imho again, sorry, is at its best when parliament is fired up, engaged in debate about what really matters, and the leaders know they're not guaranteed wins in elections so actually have to consider what voters want.

"Hopefully John Smith can finally stop turning in his grave..." Oh yes.

"What we need to do is stop the huge money drains from the public sector into private pockets. Privatization has for years meant nothing more than private profit and public debts - stop that and much of the needed reform pays for itself"

"The whip and divisions - I've always hated the principle of whips. How can you have any kind of meaningful debate when different points of view are discouraged! We need solutions now in the face of the broken economy and climate change, that means different points of view from different backgrounds and different ideas. There should be no need for whips" yes I've never got this. Smacks of feudal politics.

"You do have to wonder if a man stuck in a time warp is electable in the UK" er...didn't stop Cameron.

"especially with Scotland now basically out of the picture." Really?

"I think it's really exciting. We in Scotland need a decent Labour Party so desperately. All the nationalism has gone crazy largely due to hate for the Tories. We need an energised Labour."

"I also wouldn't be surprised if he takes back seats in Scotland from the Nats (? what do Scots think?)" See below, but I'm only one. Although dd will be old enough to vote next time and if she voted tory I'd think she'd been drugged!

There's a large number of Scots voters who quite possibly voted SNP because labour at that time were not being socialists, not representing the people and not giving the Tories a genuine opposition! Hence the SNP landslide in Scotland despite most of us voting no in the referendum.

I used to vote labour until '97 never trusted Blair, Smith's passing was a tragedy. After that I voted lib dem conned into thinking they were left of centre. They showed their true colours at/during the 2010 GE. Voted SNP this year as Miliband seemed like a wet blanket too easily swayed by others and labour policies as many pp have said were 'tory-lite' and still far too close to Blair policies.

I'm not convinced he's unelectable. He would certainly seem to be seen as a genuine old style socialist here (Scotland until this year mainly voted labour), add Scots votes to possibly welsh votes as (correct me if I'm wrong) I think a lot of Plaid voters had the same feelings as those who voted SNP who would traditionally have voted labour, then add English voters who only voted tory through disillusionment with labour/fear of the SNP taking over (can we have an eye roll emoticon please mn?) Plus English non voters who didn't vote because there wasn't a genuine socialist party to vote for... There might be a chance of a hung parliament in labour's favour?

There might be a chance of a hung parliament in labour's favour?

Surely not. Please, it really is unthinkable.

I'm not trolling for an argument Bacon but do you sincerely believe JC will even last as Labour leader until the next election, let alone fight it?

History doesn't paint a very encouraging picture...

I don't think he should be ruled out just yet, put it that way. If nothing else 70 is no age these days and he seems to be relatively fit and healthy. As to the rest, a week is a long time in politics as they say. I don't think Cameron/tories are doing themselves any favours at the moment on the political landscape.

As to trolling for an argument don't worry, I enjoy healthy political debate.

"surely the reason that the Greens haven't been more popular isn't due to the lack of left wing voters, but because our first past the post system means that for the vast majority of people it's a wasted vote?"

Nonsense--the same consideration did not stop people voting for UKIP in large numbers (I know UKIP only got 1 MP but they were second in loads of seats).

I suppose I will have to vote Lib Dem in the next election. I'm not exactly craving Lib Demitude, but it seems to be the only option for anyone who is not Tory and not nuts either.

Agree with bacon. I think he is electable & that's why the right wing press has reacted in the way it has. Scroll down the Daily Fail headlines this morning - they're hilariously OTT. For someone unelectable he's getting a hugely outraged response. Why are the right wing press so rattled if someone unelectable has got in?

Will be intetesting if he's up against Gideon (who is unelectable imo).

People might move back to the Lib Dems. We're beginning to see how much Tory policy was moderated by their presence in govt (not by enough imo - but the Tories are busy overturning the changes they did make as well as putting through policies they couldn't have put through while sharing a platform with the Lib Dems - that will be noticed evebtually).

As someone said a few pages up, the left and right activists tend to operate in a bubble. They often assume most people agree with them which is why it is good to have threads like this. I think Cameron is very wet and not doing right by the poor and middle classes because they would benefit more by an economy which was less controlled and by a smaller state and lower taxes. More tax would be generated and those less fortunate would benefit. Plenty of us supported Thatcher in our day. She transformed the UK and was a force for good. However if your friends are only on the left you don't tend even to realise that people with those views are out there and remember most people who vote are middle aged or old and people tend to change their political views as they get older to more about stability, sensible money management ie Tory policies.

The election proved all this. Corbyn may well not survive as leader until the election. if he does that is good news as he won't get in. If he doesn't then all those who just resigned probably resigned from the shadow cabinet because they want to be disassociated from him so they are poised to move in when there is the next leadership challenge.

We now have a choice between crony capitalism or punishing hard working people to enrich trade union leaders and labour acolytes; what a joy.

UKIP at least seem to have a clue about what the populace need but, scratch the surface, and there are s lot of bigoted racists riding in their coat tails, so they are too high risk.

I suspect we have the Tories for a good long time now but will they address the banks, directors' ludicrous pay awards etc. I doubt it...

The less fortunate don't tend to benefit under Tory policies JanetBlyton. I have a severely disabled son - he's certainly not a winner under the Tories.

I think Corbyn's unelectable - not because of what he says or thinks but because we're going to be told he is, day after day after day. DC has already made vague, nebulous threats that our personal security will be at risk because of JC without any evidence or even a hint of what kind of risk. I mean, come on, Shiney Dave - what danger? Are we all going to be murdered in our beds????? by rampaging peaceniks with creased trousers?

It was the same with Labour's economic record. I mean, just google the Tory debacles such as the ERM and contrast their record in the 80s and 90s and now with Labour from 97 and the prevailing narrative doesn't add up.

Not that it matters; we all become the stories we tell or are told and the truth is obviously irrelevant. So, yeah, Corbyn won't win and we'll be stuck with this bunch of self-serving, incompetent dimwits.

JC is unelectable because he doesn't intend to stand for an election!

I think that's a risk seahorses - but the headlines about Corbyn are so outrageously OTT that I would hope the electorate would have the brains to realise it's scaremongering from a rattled right wing press.

I won't be voting Labour next time round (am Lib Dem) but even I can see the hysterical headlines and accusations are laughable & lacking in evidence.

Mind you my MIL treats the Daily Mail as fact rather than fiction so maybe I have too much trust in people to think for themselves.

I will vote Labour again.

Although Cameron will enlist Rebecca Brooks no doubt to tell me that I shouldn't.

I watched yesterday with great interest and whooped with delight when Gove light resigned. But reading and watching some views has been very enlightening. For instance someone who was being interviewed on BBC news this morning stated that "JC doesn't hold the same views as the electorate and he will find it difficult to change". To me this is astounding; surely this result shows that these so called political experts don't understand the majority's views

I voted Labour at the last election because their economic policies are actually better for the country, even if the Tories are better for my pocket.

I will have a real problem at the next election because I cannot vote for those happy to kill off or starve the less fortunate or make the last months of the dying worse www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/over-4000-people-have-died-soon-after-being-found-fit-to-work-by-the-dwps-benefit-tests-10474474.html The LibDems can not be trusted and the Labour Party seem inclined to leave the country with no defence. Might have to be a spoilt ballot paper.

Corbyn's election may save the Lib Dems for annihilation. The Tories, rightly, fear for the effect of that on their electoral chances.

claig

That you think Farage would be an end to the status quo just shows that there are some people who will believe absolutely anything.

I'd love to know why, if Corbyn is so unelectable, he has got the mainstream press and the Tories in such a froth.

He's only a threat to national security if people vote for him ...

It makes it look as if the Tories are genuinely concerned, and I think they may be right to be worried- though not because I necessarily think that he is electable (the jury's out; stranger things have happened, like him becoming labour leader against all the odds).

Gosh, I'm not rattled at all. It's wonderful news. He's not going to get elected so what is not to like? Not in a froth at all. Laughing as I type.

So 5 of 6 shadow cabinet members who have resigned are female. Let us see his first test for women - does he appoint 5 women or not or is he the man with the much younger foreign wife who is the usual 60 something sexist male?

'how do you reconcile your view with the result of the May 2015 general election which rejected a far more moderate version of what Corbyn offers?'

It didn't. It offered an incompetent and defensive version of what the conservatives were offering.

Whilst the right wing press sells us scare stories about Corbyn talking to Hamas and Hezbollah, the Foreign Office continues to approve sales of arms to the Democratic Republic of Congo, Pakistan, Somalia, Saudi Arabia, Angola, Thailand and Columbia. The world's terrorists may be armed mostly by Russian weapons, but that's not down to a lack of trying to muscle in on the market on the part of the UK.
Unfortunately, the Tories get away with slinging mud about Corbyn's dodgy contacts, but there is no equivalent press voice to hold up a mirror on their own bad behaviour.