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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think we shouldn't have small plane 'airshows'

182 replies

JeffsanArsehole · 22/08/2015 17:55

It seems every year in a small plane at an airshow there's some terrible and tragic accident. 7 people dead so far today. Sad

It's not the same as large commercial craft where out of the thousands of planes every year one or two crashes.

I don't remember a year where one hasn't crashed.

OP posts:
Spartans · 23/08/2015 10:21

Stephanie yes you are correct I missed that.

I was responding to a poster who is ok with commercial flight because it is used for business and holiday purposes. I was trying to articulate that air shows are used for the same purposes. But completely forgot that many are for fundraising too Grin

Binkybix · 23/08/2015 10:43

I think the point the poster was making about commercial flight was that it is safer per flight taken as well as being more necessary.

NoArmaniNoPunani · 23/08/2015 10:57

The names of those who died are starting to come out now. The Daimler driver was on his way to pick up a bride :( 2 footballers and a personal trainer all in their twenties too.

StephanieBeacham · 23/08/2015 10:58

Spartans it's fine, I was trying to add to your point rather than correct it Smile

passmethewineplease · 23/08/2015 11:27

noarmarni - just catching up now, the personal trainers sister was sharing a post last night asking for him to contact them, she's just shared another to confirm he was one of the fatalities. Just awful and so unthinkable. Can't imagine some of the scenes there yesterday.

NoArmaniNoPunani · 23/08/2015 11:31

Yeah I saw her post on my FB feed last night, then the update this morning. It's just awful. I really can't believe anyone would want the airshow to continue after this.

StephanieBeacham · 23/08/2015 11:46

It's pretty bad - the Mirror has a photo of the initial impact and in it is a car which fits the description they give on another page of that poor girl's brother's car.

So unnecessary. I hope the family ask for that image to be removed.

On another point, even airshows that take place largely over the sea, still involve planes flying at relatively low alt over heavily populated places.

Ours the other week had the Typhoon and the Vulcan doing circuits over the town as part of their display - as well as the reds, they all went inland as part of it.

So being a sea display doesn't negate the risk IMO.

alibubbles · 23/08/2015 11:47

My DH regularly flies in and out of North Weald and his colleague commented that the pilot was fuelling up for the air show yesterday morning when he flew in himself.

My DH was very shocked when he got home last night, it took 7 hours to get off the airport site. He couldn't sleep, imagining all the families and friends that have been affected. The pilot's wife, also a pilot was in the crowd too. Sad for everyone, especially those involved in aviation.

Runtoyou · 23/08/2015 12:03

I think air shows should be able to continue but more money needs to be invested in safety measures.

I was talking about the crash with my DH who has flown both privately and commercially. He is fairly certain that the pilot involved passed out and then came round too late to regain any control.

Two safety measures could have prevented this accident but are not implemented due to cost. Firstly the pilot should have been able to wear a G suit ( currently only available in military aircraft such as the RAF Red Arrows), which would have lessened his chances of passing out and secondly if an ejection seat was available he would then have an escape option.

Unfortunately both are deemed unnecessary for use at air shows with the latter being far too costly to maintain.

NoArmaniNoPunani · 23/08/2015 12:16

sad for everyone, especially those involved in aviation.

Why especially sad for those involved in aviation? All of the seven dead were nothing to do with the airshow.

londonrach · 23/08/2015 12:26

Soup. I think we have to disagree about seeing them on the ground. You should have seen my dad (big kid) and my nephew at a recent museum climbing in and out of the planes and getting close up.

However its the poor families who have lost loved ones we should be thinking of. The sister of one has been very active last night on fb asking for news. I was really hoping he would be ok and very sad this morning to learn the news wasnt positive. I cant imagine what they going through. thoughts with all these affected by the terrible accident. X

coffeeisnectar · 23/08/2015 12:38

There were air shows on at dawlish and Bournemouth yesterday, we were at the latter. The news filtered through the crowds and the reaction was obviously horror and sadness.

I don't think they should be banned. They are brilliant to watch. We saw the Vulcan and typhoon yesterday as well as the hawks. I met the pilots of the hawks on Thursday, Sat next to them on a boat and had a great chat about what they do and the obvious love of flying was very apparent in these young men.

Yesterday was an absolute tragedy and I feel incredibly sorry for the families of those killed and all affected. However banning air shows would be like banning coaches every time there's a crash or banning rally driving when there's an incident involving loss of life or shutting all theme parks after the Alton towers crash.

SoupDragon · 23/08/2015 12:53

You should have seen my dad (big kid) and my nephew at a recent museum climbing in and out of the planes and getting close up.

And I am sure that people enjoy looking at stuffed animals in a museum. However, it is no substitute for seeing them do what they are meant to do. They are two completely different experiences.

Hairballs · 23/08/2015 13:01

runtoyou Uninformed speculation about the cause of the crash at this time is utterly inappropriate.

Cocolepew · 23/08/2015 13:42

Two planes have crashed at a Swiss airshow this afternoon.

Runtoyou · 23/08/2015 14:36

Hairballs Flying has played a big part in both mine and DHs lives and yesterday was hugely shocking and upsetting for everyone involved. We have been to the airshow many times and have close friends heavily involved with the event.

My comments were not meant to cause offence. I was merely responding to OPs question about whether air shows should continue. Of course no one knows for sure what happened.

SaucyJack · 23/08/2015 14:45

There may well be many places where air displays can take place without any risk to innocents in the area. Shoreham isn't one of those places tho. The airport is about 5/10 minutes walk from the town centre.

These vintage planes aren't getting any younger, and so the risk will only get worse as time goes by.

It's absolutely dreadful. It's near to where I live and we are all devastated. All of my friends and family drive up that road frequently. It was a preventable tragedy.

Hulababy · 23/08/2015 14:46

We saw a Vulcan flying yesterday evening, returning to Robin Hood Doncaster airport. It wasn't doing anything fancy - it was just flying nearby, circling a couple of times. It was probably DH's favourite aspect of our trip to the wildlife park to be honest.

Maybe ensuring air shows don't fly over densely populated areas and roads would be preferable, especially when doing more extreme displays. But not sure about banning them entirely tbh - the pilots have a choice over whether they fly them, and they know the risks. But more care to ensure the risks are limited may be needed.

BoffinMum · 23/08/2015 14:47

It reminded me of Kegworth.

mrspuddleduckie · 23/08/2015 17:06

I agree with Hairballs:

runtoyou Uninformed speculation about the cause of the crash at this time is utterly inappropriate.

BishopBrennansArse · 23/08/2015 17:18

Ok then. Eventing, horse racing, motor racing etc ban all those too. After all they're not necessary. Rock climbing that too, it's all only hobbies.

I'm not dismissing yesterday's horrors. But the last time there was a public fatality at an air show was the sixties.

SaucyJack · 23/08/2015 17:19

When did rock climbing last kill 11 people minding their own business on their way to/from work?

trufflesnout · 23/08/2015 17:42

I don't think it is okay to say that the pilots/show organisers are willing to take the risks tbh, nor do I think it's comparable to commercial flights or driving a car.. The (now suspected to be upwards of) 11 people who died today didn't knowingly take the risks that the pilot did, did they?

It feels a bit gross to air opinions along the lines of of "it's a small risk and it's all a bit of fun and people enjoy it" so close to the aftermath of Shoreham tbh.

StephanieBeacham · 23/08/2015 17:42

That's true, rock climbing accidents do not often carry collateral damage.

I can completely understand the wishes of people to have air shows stopped after this tragic accident.

I'm an aviation geek; I have a huge fascination for aircraft of most types, though the loud and fast ones aren't my favourites.

I have very mixed feelings about air shows. I think I get more joy out of watching normal planes go overhead than seeing something do impressive stunts - we watched, as I said, a show recently which took place about 3-400 yards from our house, right at the end of our street.

I had been dreading it and anticipating it in almost equal measure. I checked the times; I wanted to see bits of it, perhaps, but not the bombers.

As it happened I watched one of them, but when it was time for the typhoon, which we'd seen last year, I got the children in the car and took them for a drive - not to anywhere in particular, just 'away' from what feels every single time like a very threatening aircraft.

I almost felt like a 'practise run' if you like. We were out within a couple of minutes, stopped what we were doing, and just drove.

We could hear and see the event from about 3 miles away where we stopped and got out of the car.

I sort of wished we had stayed afterwards but no, I didn't want to be underneath that thing, however awesome and powerful it is.

Part of me thinks 'would these boys and their giant noisy toys please take them away from my house and children?' (there were female pilots too, btw, but not for the noise machines) and is slightly resentful; the other part of me is proud to live here and have the honour of seeing them.

I don't know; I just really don't know. People died who perhaps weren't even aware of the display, apart from the fact of a few road signs. That doesn't seem fair - but if you look at for example a Red Arrows transit map during display season, you can see just how many populated areas they pass over, and I don't think there is any getting around that.

We would have to stop most, or all, of the air shows, if we were going to try to guarantee no risk to the public.

alibubbles · 23/08/2015 17:46

Flying has been a big part of my life as my father flew Vulcans, amongst many others in the RAF and I have been to air shows for over 55 years. My father is 82 and though he has Alzheimers, remembers very clearly when he was at Farnborough when there was an air accident, they cordoned it off and carried on with the air display, that wouldn't happen today.

The Vulcan is a magnificent aircraft and it is recognised that it cannot fly any longer as: 1) no other such aircraft has been flying so long, 2) they cannot source the parts needed anymore 3) the expertise to work on such aircraft is no longer around either.

Every Monday I open the Telegraph and inside on the first page is nearly always a report of a light aircraft crash landing or similar, my DH flies these for fun and I often go with him. When I am up in the sky I often think of my family below and what if.....

My DH is still in shock from yesterday, many what if scenarios, his pilot friend he flies with, has text him many times today, they both feel very deeply for all of those who lost their lives yesterday, and may be more to come.