Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that the Calais migrants are economic migrants and should not be given asylum?

558 replies

cabbagesouppirate · 30/07/2015 08:57

All of the Calais migrants are young men. If they were true asylum seekers seeking safety from persecution they could have claimed asylum in a number of safe countries Western countries already, including France which is hardly a dangerous place. Instead they camp out in Calais, causing a nuisance, a mess, costing the UK and France a lot of money, making the lives of lorry drivers and tourists hell and the situation is becoming increasingly dangerous. I sincerely hope these people are not given asylum in the UK and any that have managed to reach the UK should be fast tracked out of the country and given economic assistance whilst they are here.

OP posts:
Coffeemarkone · 30/07/2015 11:50

Coffee ", I don't need to send you details, it's a very simple numbers game. If our infrastructure is exploited by uncontrolled illegal economic immigration then we won't be able to live as well as we do now.

I would just like to know exactly how your quality of life has been reduced ' as you claim, by 'asylum seekers' or 'economic migrants'. If you are going to make wild claims like that, you need to back it up.

The truth is that these people do not affect our lives other than to have heated discussions about them.

It reminds me of one of my neighbours, face like a slapped arse, always going on about 'the fucking Kosovans' in her old town. LIke they had ever stopped her from doing anything!

Pantone363 · 30/07/2015 11:51

Yes that's why I put (sp?) after it. But clearly that's what's important here.

Coffeemarkone · 30/07/2015 11:54

no Pantone it was not the spelling per se, but the obvious ignorance of the country's name. That is why I sent you a wiki link, so that you can see where it is, and a little of its recent history.

NewFlipFlops · 30/07/2015 11:57

I don't need to back it up Coffee, it needs to be prevented - this can't be a situation you allow to happen and then just wait until the consequences roll out! What's the incentive for intending legal migrants to abide by the law if you turn a blind eye to illegal migrants?

Jassy, yes, the cake is finite. The annual tax take is finite, each year. The tax take is what bakes the cake.

bearleftmonkeyright · 30/07/2015 11:59

*I often wonder at some of the posters on here who seem to believe that the answer is to allow anybody that wishes to enter, any country, they want?

I wonder...are they:

a) so wealthy that they can afford to rearrange their lives once the UK is dragged down to the same standard as these countries these illegal immigrants are 'fleeing' from,

or

b) actually from one of these countries or similar, and so having now entered the UK and found they don't like it here (as it's not like 'home') they wish to bring more of their own over in order to implement the change they wish for?*

I am neither of these things, (but I am probably better off than many people)..I am just a normal person with a differing view to the OP. I have a roof over my head and a feeling of "safety" for myself and my family.

Coffeemarkone · 30/07/2015 12:00

well if you are claiming that your quality of life has been reduced, or will be reduced, then yes you need to back it up with examples.
What, you couldnt afford a bottle of spirits or a Brazilian bikini wax? What?

middlings · 30/07/2015 12:04

But WHY does it need to be prevented?! And what needs to be prevented?

We need a whole different approach, but that doesn't mean simply battening down the hatches.

NewFlipFlops · 30/07/2015 12:06

I only drink wine and I have a natural minge, thanks for asking Coffee Smile

I haven't claimed my current quality of life has been reduced. I am foreseeing that it would be reduced in the future. Actually I am thinking beyond my own time on earth, or in London or Brighton for that matter. But you already know population growth will probably screw us all, I'm guessing.

GardenDragon · 30/07/2015 12:07

Figment - those numbers are useless unless you compare them to the landmass and density of population already in those countries - we are much smaller than France and Germany.

But we are much bigger than others. For example- 2014 UK had 32,000 asylum applications, it is approx. 94,000 square miles. Hungary had 42,000 applications and is just 36,000 square miles. Austria had 28,000 applications at 32,000 square miles. It must be feeling pretty cramped there, almost as many asylum seekers but with less than half our land mass. Lots of it being mountainous too, before anyone bangs on about 'usable' land.

WhetherOrNot · 30/07/2015 12:08

Well if every MNer made room in their home for 3 migrants we'd solve the problem just like that, wouldn't we? Well, for this week anyway.

Coffeemarkone · 30/07/2015 12:09

only drink wine and I have a natural minge, thanks for asking Coffee

Grin well we might disagree but you are funny....

Samcro · 30/07/2015 12:10

yes cos every one has massive houses

Viviennemary · 30/07/2015 12:13

We haven't even got housing, schools and sufficient healthcare for the people already in this country. They think they can roll up here after storming the tunnel creating havoc and then be rewarded with everything provided for on a plate. Why can't France take care of these people. No wonder they are coming in swarms.

WhetherOrNot · 30/07/2015 12:17

yes cos every one has massive houses

Doesn't matter whether you have a massive house, or a 2 bedroom. People are saying the migrants are entitled to be here (for whatever reason) so we should make room for them whatever our circumstances.

Coffeemarkone · 30/07/2015 12:19

"We haven't even got housing, schools and sufficient healthcare for the people already in this country"

of course 'we' do, although of course it is not 'we' is it?
That is just another myth peddled by certain news papers and regurgitated by innocent readers who have been brainwashed.

"No wonder they are coming in swarms."

Why are you using the language of an infestation of insects? Have you even thought about the words that you use or that you read in the paper?

JassyRadlett · 30/07/2015 12:19

Jassy, yes, the cake is finite. The annual tax take is finite, each year. The tax take is what bakes the cake.

Er, I'm not quite sure where to start with this statement.

First, the 'tax take' is based on economic activity. The level of economic activity is not set, and our system is based around the idea of constant economic growth.

Economic activity is influenced by many factors. One is the amount of economic activity - economic activity tends to beget more economic activity.

There are huge interplays between economic activity and immigration. It's not a simple picture, and I'm not up for open borders for numerous reasons. But the idea that economic activity is capped is simply nonsense.

I note no one has been willing to engage on the question of foreign aid.

hooliodancer · 30/07/2015 12:22

I was on holiday in a very remote Greek Island recently.

Traffickers dumped a boatload of refugees on a nearby uninhabited island with no water. Having accepted their €3,500 to escape Syria the traffickers left them to die. There were children and babies. A Greek fisherman picked them up and brought them ashore. They stayed for a day, then were taken to Rhodes, then on to Athens. The reason they stayed for a day was because each one had to be assessed as to whether they were an economic migrant or genuinely fleeing terror before they could be moved on. I heard a story of a woman who had been forced to watch her husband and son beheaded.

Yes, they had phones and iPads. Because only the middle classes can afford what the traffickers charge to get out. I expect many have degrees, or are studying to be pharmacists. Does this prevent being afraid for your life and having to flee, leaving everything behind?

Many of these people will end up in Calais.

I don't know what the answer is. There has to be some joined up policy, Europe needs to work as one on this. Of course we can't just take everyone.

But why do people judge so harshly when these people have already been through a living hell? They at least deserve our compassion.

Coffeemarkone · 30/07/2015 12:23

oh and if benefits and welfare is a 'cake' then the Trident bill must be a fucking great creamy gateau.

middlings · 30/07/2015 12:26

Hoolio it does all feel a bit different when you've witnessed the desparation doesn't it? I can't say it changed my mind, but it did reinforce my position.

They think they can roll up here after storming the tunnel creating havoc and then be rewarded with everything provided for on a plate. Why can't France take care of these people. No wonder they are coming in swarms.

Viviennemary I don't know where you live but I haven't seen anybody banging down the door of my GP's surgery, or chaining themselves to the railings of my local primary school or demanding anything from banks or shops. Where are these people of whom who speak demanding everything on a plate?

BeyondDespairandRepair · 30/07/2015 12:26

I often wonder at some of the posters on here who seem to believe that the answer is to allow anybody that wishes to enter, any country, they want?

Indeed I saw a funny post about problem neighbours a while back, someone was asking whether to risk it and live in dogy area or go small to nicer area. Lots came on to say nicer area, dogding neighbours, living with anti social problems which infiltrate your every day life - to the degree:

you cant let your dc play outside in garden,
you cant do things in your house due to noise and problems from next door eg bed times, watch tv, have a family dinner,

arguing and violence affecting your dc from next door,

watching until coast next door is clear before going out etc.

Not fun

Some said - they were liberal - live and let live until they started living in above nightmare scenario then they got as they said - All Daily Mail.

Hard to remain free and easy liberal when your minutea of life being affected by people to such a degree. Being robbed of your own freedoms really.

TwistInMySobriety · 30/07/2015 12:31

There are also many safe countries in Africa and indeed to the east and west as well as north of Africa so why the UK?

By far the biggest brunt of refugees / migrants worldwide is borne by the developing world. The vast majority of people fleeing conflict end up in neighbouring countries. Those that make it to Calais are a tiny, tiny fraction of the total. There are three and a half million Syrian refugees in Lebanon, Turkey, Jordan and Iraq.

Coffeemarkone · 30/07/2015 12:32

" Being robbed of your own freedoms really."

Tell us more about how the migrants at Calais have robbed you of your freedom, please. It must have been awful for you?!

Justanotherlurker · 30/07/2015 12:34

Careful coffee, your beginning to sound like the brainwashed you so despise.

The annual cost of Trident over its lifespan is equivalent to roughly 1.5% of the annual welfare.

BeyondDespairandRepair · 30/07/2015 12:35

Coffee I dont think you could have mis read or mis quoted me more really.

Having to do the below in your own home - and more I have not listed is being robbed of your own personal freedom YES

you cant let your dc play outside in garden,
you cant do things in your house due to noise and problems from next door eg bed times, watch tv, have a family dinner,

arguing and violence affecting your dc from next door,

watching until coast next door is clear before going out etc.

Or do you think ^ the above is fine for people to have to put up with when simply trying to live and raise families?

WhetherOrNot · 30/07/2015 12:35

Those that make it to Calais are a tiny, tiny fraction of the total

And that makes it alright, does it?.