To think MN is getting nastier?

[MaggieJoyBlunt]

So far this week we've had giving birth referred to as 'calving' (in the context of women having children while young). Someone loved that one so much they immediately commented on what a great expression it was and repeated it.

We've had someone propose that Prince Phillip should be 'humanely destroyed'. swiftly followed up by a similar suggestion about taking him out to a barn or a shed or some such and shooting him.

We've had a thread about the death of a convicted murdered where several posters queued up to tell us they were, smiling or "laughing gleefully" or simply to post "lol" as a one word comment. (Okay she was a vicious killer and will not be much missed, but really?)

Add to all of that the Budget threads where in the midst of people worrying and calculating the cut to their household budget, other people came to gloat and make helpful observations such as "If you can't afford DC, don't have them."

MN didn't used to be nasty. Vigorous, challenging etc; But not nasty.

What's going on around here?

Thank you Hex. I made the point about having a degree in English, but still making spelling and grammatical errors on posts, to disprove a poster's point about people making spelling mistakes because they were 'uneducated'.

I have no idea why Sunny took it up as some kind of boast or decided to try and 'prove' that I had no such degree.

And yes, I agree, sometimes writing a post on MN does feel like you're creating a legal document that will be scrutinised in court and used against you. In fact, it's probably good training should any of us find ourselves in that situation

Despite having two adult children with additional needs, varying from very severe to manageable, I have never ventured onto the SN board. I find it all a bit scary.

Yes, Orange, re live examples on this very thread.

However, I agree that it can be tremendous fun to watch all the bunfighting kick off. I do intervene if I see this happening where a poster seems vulnerable or upset - quite often a PARD post will bring things back on an even keel. One of the many things I've learned from Mumsnet is that 85% of people won't speak up until someone else has, so a single intervention can draw a lot of response from previously silent posters.

PC brigade is a horrible expression because 'political correctness' means trying to avoid gratuitous offence. Therefore, those who don't want to be PC are keen to offend.

Professionally offended is, I think, a real phenomenon. We've had plenty of examples here of how posters will raise offended straw men to derail a discussion. It's aggravating, as intended. "Seeking out perceived slights" is a good way of putting it.

The nastiness is mainly on aibu/chat. We should rename aibu to Look its Very Simple- Everything You Do, Think and Say Is Wrong, All Your Life Choices Are Stupid and You Can't Spell.

There are some fantastic people who give great advice on sen, mental health, style etc but unfortunately there are also alot of goady fuckers dragging the rest of us down. All we can do is just report the ones who cross the line.

I'm always reporting goady fuckers. MNHQ must be sick of me by now.

'genuinely hurt at being accused of being racist'

Trouble is, sometimes they are being racist. They may not think they are, or they may not care to examine their own attitudes too closely, but sometimes people post something ostensibly fair-minded and liberal but which betrays all kinds of unpleasant and prejudiced assumptions or attitudes. When they get pulled up on it, they throw out 'PO' and 'PC brigade' to dismiss the criticism.

It's quite common. Even the woman thrown out of UKIP for saying "The only people I do have problems with are negroes. And I don't know why...But I really do have a problem with people with negroid features." insisted she wasn't racist:

Mrs Duncan claimed there was a "hidden agenda" behind her expulsion and insisted there was nothing "racist or derogatory" in what she said.
She said: "I don't regret saying it. I don't regret anything, that's the truth.
"I still honestly believe that what I said was never at any time racist or derogatory.
"I used the word 'negroes' as you would do Asians, Chinese, Muslims, Jews. It's a description, it's not an insult.."

I post very sparingly on threads about racism, and golliwog threads, because they have the ability to really really get to me. Plus, my appetite for having people from the majority community deny or dismiss my experiences of racism as a black woman in the UK, never large, has diminished to vanishing point over the years. My take on the threads is that is it actually pretty rare for an allegation of racism to be made that has no validity at all.

As the poster who first used the term PC Brigade on this thread can I firstly apologise as it obviously caused offence and I used it incorrectly.

I suppose what I actually meant was people who totally misunderstand and misinterpret what people are saying or how those remarks will be perceived by others as opposed to themselves.

For instance the late lamented LaQueen once wrote a post about the difficulties of finding decent restaurants while holidaying in Ireland. Most Irish posters (including myself) agreed with her, advised her to try this area or that area etc but some non-Irish posters came on the thread accusing her of being racist, insulting the entire Irish population and so on. They meant well but just got it all wrong. It also came across as quite patronising to the many funny, intelligent Irish posters who were quite capable of debating the issue themselves and didn't really need all this 'up in arms' stuff by people who had never even been to Ireland.

That kind of thing is what I meant by the 'PC Brigade' but I won't use that expression again as it's obviously not the correct term.

Saying that MN is nastier than it used to be is the equivalent of saying that 'aren't policemen young nowadays?' and that Viz isn't as funny as it used to be. It's shows that your getting older.

We should rename aibu to Look its Very Simple- Everything You Do, Think and Say Is Wrong, All Your Life Choices Are Stupid and You Can't Spell.

Ah ha ha!

Hmm, you may have a point, Uncertain! I've just hidden 3 threads I was watching due to persistent nastiness - but several of the nasty comments were by long-term posters I've not usually pegged as intolerant, unthinking grumpy bastards. Either they're getting nastier or I'm getting nicer ...

That could be true Uncertain. In the same way that you rock along through life and then suddenly start to notice rude badly behaved children, annoying people in restaurants and so on. It all used to go over my head but now I'm really aware of it.

There's a definite tension when discussing political and identity issues.

This isn't an ideal way to make complex arguments; it's so easy for people to reconstruct misrepresent what you have written. Arguing like that is utterly tedious so I don't often bother. I know how it will go.

There is no hope for my dd then. She's 20 and always notices rude children and annoying people in restaurants.

We're planning an excursion to the Metrocentre on Thursday which we will walk through like Harry Enfield's Old Gits.

I've been here for more years than I care to admit to, and name change a lot. And IMO it's nastier and dafter.

And despite being told how supportive SN was, for the first time in my MN history I was reduced to tears during a terrible pasting about my little boy.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/special_needs_chat/2425457-My-mother?msgid=55600021#55600021

God that's a fucking awful thread Chipped. I remember your thread in Chat, thought it sounded like a tough time for your family, but didn't think you should cut your DM off.

That SN thread made grim reading. Hope MNHQ did something.

to you.

It is amazing how one or two angry posters can set the tone of a whole thread. Some posters come on, disagree, explain why and take it from there.

Others come bursting on, steam coming out of their ears, and start shouting and name calling from the off. They're also, often, the posters who get very shirty and outraged when anyone stands up to them and either storm off the thread, begin throwing really personal comments around or start calling everyone goady fuckers and accuse them of looking for a bunfight.

Not talking about Chipped's thread, but about a lot of the threads that turn really nasty on AIBU.

Thanks GeorgeYeatsautomaticwriter. I think what confused the issue was that the main poster has SN himself and so didn't see how much he was going on, and didn't get the rinsing he'd have got if he hadn't revealed his autism. But yes, extreme and hideous.

Adoption has gone unpleasant too unfortunately.

wow And that is the cosy sn topic, so glad I don't post there now.
Hope your ok

Chipped...I'm so sorry your first post in mn sn ended that way. Sorry to say I've seen it before :(
Sadly That poster does tend to make nasty sweeping remarks and because of his sn and - frankly - the pandering of other posters on the sn board he gets away with it.
He absolutely was bullying and hectoring you. I'm glad you reported it.
I stay away from sn mostly now, which is a shame as I had a lot of help and support on there a few years ago.
I hope you stick around.
There are some lovely posters on here...honest! :)

Oh, God, and don't get me started on the budget threads :(
Awful
Posters genuinely worried how they will feed their families, posters with kids with sn and disabilities who will have their care package cut...and all some people could do was jump up and down rubbing their grubby hands together about what a great budget it was and how the scroungers would suffer :(
I considered de regging....