To ask, how much are Mumsnetters owed in maintenence arrears?

[whothehellknows]

I know from previous threads that there are lots of us on MN with ExP's that do anything they can to avoid maintenence.

Last night in a fit of ire (because ExP who "can't afford to pay maintenence" told me about how he's looking to buy a fucking boat) I used the CMS calculator to double check how much he should have been paying all this time. In total, our kids have missed out on over £6000 in payments in two years. The number really shook me. I'm sitting here thinking how many times I've cried in desperation trying to make ends meet, worked overtime, sold my stuff and gone without to take care of my kids. What a difference that money could have made.

I know it's a broken record, but I can't help but think that lone parents would need a lot less help from the state if NRP's had to step up and pay for their kids.

So out of curiosity, more than anything else, I'm wondering how much mumsnetters have had to make do without-- I'm betting it's a mind blowing amount.

If your ex should be paying and isn't, how much has he managed to dodge?

Reporting is when you ask MNHQ to come and have a look at a thread in case they need to take action. At the top of every post, there are options to add a message, report or message that poster individually.

Thanks Helen!

happens where property is owned. The CSA owns just less than half of my ex's house. It was the only way he could be persauded to pay maintenance - even then, they had to take it to the point of it being taken from under him before he paid anything. Once he pays what he owes, the process will (I hope) start again

I know a woman whose ex had a % share in her house from when they split he also owed her something in the region of 40k CM arrears through Csa.

Guess what she had to do when she sold her house?

Yep pay him his % share and she was not allowed to deduct his debt to her from it nor would the CSA do anything to enforce.

I am still owed well over half a million quid in CM from my ex and haven't even had a fiver collected.

Haven't read the thread but my delightful exP was at silverstone for the Grand Prix last weekend yet hasn't paid a penny in maintenance for over 4 years as he's unemployed and can't afford it apparently!!

Thank you TheFormidableMrsC. Good luck with your fight too.

For my entire life my father didn't pay a penny for me or my sister.
He also never saw me after I was 6 mths old. No contact ever or any attempt to support us financially.
He also lived abroad.
It's an utter disgrace.

OP- something I've been banging on about for years-good thread!

We could turn it on its head to get the politicians attention- how much would each of us NOT have to claim if their ex paid up his(or her) fair share?

That's just the monetary gain. Then there is the unquantifiable but still costly statistic of how many mums & kids need counselling/ specialist care/ extra educational input as a result of their fathers fecklessness? How many who need medical support AD's/MH input?

SamCam is on here somewhere......show your DH this thread Mrs C and get him to sort out the toothless tiger that is the CMA. Start getting some actual prosecutions for non payment and tighten up the loopholes.

Biggest vote winner ever I reckon.

Exactly textfan I know of so many friends who have driven themselves half demented trying to persue their exes via the CMA. The ex gives them the run around, refuses to pay so they put a charge on his house.......which he won't sell for years!!

Attachment of earnings should be enforced & greater liaison with HMRC so that tax avoidance for express purpose of evading maintenance payments can be detected.

We need a journalist to take this on........

Bogeyface, I know one. Will get in touch with her

just short of £20,000.

Tbh it will only change when being a Child Support avoider causes the same social shame as being a drink driver or a benefit fraudster.

Those are the crimes that grab headlines, that make us look at someone we know and think less of them.

Until it becomes unacceptable on a national level to be the pond scum who cheerfully abandons children, then nothing will change.

MrsC I dont but will cheerfully harass every left wing journo who publishes their email address until someone will take it on!

I really wish the government was as keen and proactive in chasing up parents who don't pay child maintenance, as they are to strip people of benefits or tax credits they need so much need.

Having said that, if the rationale is to cut the state support to force nrp to pay, we are stuffed. More resources are needed to get parents to pay.

Surely it would benefit HMRC too, all these cash in hand jobs to avoid maintenance, must be costing millions. Apart from the ethical & moral sense, its madness from a business angle, & far more cost effective than cutting TC's!

And by resources I mean greater investigative powers to child maintenance agency and quicker sanctions.

There are so many resident parents that are forced to give up just because the process is taking years to complete , making a claim is difficult, but following up even more, just an example:

If you want to get the eqivalent of the CSA to be involved, first you talk to a general advisor who after 20 minutes asking you to find a way to sort it directly with the other parent,agress to take your details and gives you a reference number and a phone number to call, you are asked to keep these details safe.

You get to the next stage, the next advisor give Goes through more questions and properly set up your case, then you are asked to provide a 7 number pin (not a 4 or 6 number, so you can 't use any of your usuable memorable ones), then a 8 digit password, and provide responses to 10 security questions that you need to identically spell when you talk to them next time.

I could hardly answer the questions: what is your favorite place?, your favourite date? (no birthdays allowed), the name of your best friend, etc. I have so many different answers to each of those questions, it is unlikely for me to remember which one I used in the call.

Just when you think you have it all in order and written down, the second advisor gives you a different reference number and phone and asks you to forget the ones you got from the first advisor.

If my bank, the benefit/tax credits help desk or even the student loans company do not ask such a stupid number of identifying passwords, numbers and answers to questions, why the agency that deals with child maintenance does? To protect me from my ex? Doubt it.

All the time we were going through this "protected access to your case" process,, which took at least 15 minutes to go through, I was thinking that this complex password acesss is designed to make it impossible to chase our cases. If you get one wrong, you are stuffed and your case delayed for some extra weeks.

But Floundering, cash in hand is not the only or main problem, professional people avoids paying the right amount by not reporting dividends payments, consultancy work or by hidding assets by registering as company property.

There is this irritating tendency to think that only financially disadvantaged people are avoiding to pay CM, but rich and respectable people avoid to do it too, in fact, they are far more resourceful in hidding their real income.

When I asked the CSA why they wouldn't send my ex to prison or suspend his driving licence, I was told they are being sued by parents who had been sent to prison/had licence taken away, therefore they wouldn't take this action again until the outcome of the cases was known.

Bullshit??? I don't know.

Based on the amounts here, I would guess that a fair proportion of the avoiders are high earners, who have learned how to hide the money.

And the CSA/CMS seems to be viewed about as seriously as tickets from Parking Eye-- They might get you in theory, but it almost never happens in real life.

Legislation and publicity might help, but I agree that society's perception needs to change most so that maintenance avoiders are seen as financial abusers of their children and ex partners. It is abuse and it's going largely unchallenged.

I've seen so many threads along the lines of "I think X is committing benefit fraud, should I report them?", but I've never seen a single thread about reporting a person who lies to get out of maintenance.

That's where I think a Mumsnet campaign like "We believe you" and "Let girls be girls" could help, maybe?

(not sure who MNHQ emailed, my inbox doesn't have anything?)

I haven't read all the thread.
Based on what he says he earns £5 per week for 8 years and 6 months so £2210 . Based on the I've earned £60 in an hour today texts I've had on what he actually earns, tens of thousands.

Actually laughing loudly that CSA consider £2210 a reasonable amount of money for the care of a child over 8 and a half years

Personally I think it is a feminist issue. The long term impact this has on women's lives needs to be discussed. This is largely financial abuse of women who have to then go on and shoulder all the financial responsibility as well as the majority of care because of men who feel they can 'opt out'.

The majority of NRP defaulting on child maintainance are male.

It is amazing in this day and age that government agencies can recover council tax arrears yet find recovering money owed to children difficult.

When I asked why my ex husband wasn't being sanctioned re removal of driving licence etc I was told that some errant father had challenged his ruling according to European law and had won so they were reluctant to pursue this angle.

I agree that it is a feminist issue. Although everybody on the thread has been careful to specify that it isn't just men, it's clear that men are in the vast majority.

TheMother Oh yes quite agree, just the cash in hand was just an example, high earners can probably afford clever accountants who help them reduce their tax bill & therefore their % donation as maintenance.

It is indeed a feminist issue, but I fear that attack although morally justified will not carry any weight with those able to address it.

If we keep it to factual, monetary terms, what it is costing society in brass tacks and the taxpayer in general I think a campaign would get more attention.

I have been thinking about asking MNHQ to look at this for a campaign, so am delighted so many of you are thinking the same & yes OP something like the "we believe you" .

Our children deserve more.

WE deserve more.