To think today's Royal Christening is deliberate mind-fuckery timewarpery?

[Foxypaws70]

It's all so ... 1948? ... mummy pushing the heirloom pram, George's historical fancy dress outfit, the Norland Nanny in her starched uniform, the crown jewels font shipped in from the Tower, the fawning sycophantic voice-over on the BBC helpfully sharing with the little people the details of George's internal monologue ... It still is 2015 is it? Haaaaaalp!!!!! I thought these were the new wave modern Royals?

I think she's slightly made that rod for her own back though. Personally I like Carole Middleton and I respect the fact she's set up a very successful business and she has brought up three well adjusted and pleasant children whilst also having a seemingly happy marriage.

But I think Kate didn't do herself any good by never doing a proper job. I suspect that may have been just as much William's choice as hers, because it suited him with a busy schedule to have a girlfriend who could drop everything at a moments notice when he wanted to see her. But it just adds to this sense of detachment with the real world.

I don't think she really has a right to complain about scrutiny either. She is afforded a very comfortable lifestyle and the price she pays for that is a level of scrutiny and having to adopt certain standards of behaviour. This isn't unique to her, in the same way judges, politicians, doctors and lawyers are supposed to maintain certain standards of professionalism and not to bring their profession into disrepute.

It's not like she didn't know it was going to happen and like she still didn't desperately want the role even though she knew she would get stick.

I suspect Snowden might have simply been trying to hide the Wales' blushes.

Yeah because if one of the three adults involved in producing that photo - and the actual one who shot it, printed it and published it - owned up and said it was his idea and his mistake that it was naff, he MUST be lying.

And if a disgruntled ex employee, on the run for contempt of court for trying to print a book full of greasy mudslinging tittle tattle that none of the subjects will ever be able to counter for fear of stooping to her level, says otherwise then she MUST be telling the truth.

I much prefer the approach taken by Anne's children- Zara and Peter. They always seem so normal and happy, as do their children.

but I just thought apeing what William wore 30 years ago was really odd and must have involved a lengthy search

I suspect the designer did her homework and copied a few key outfits worn by William and had everything ready to be manufactured once the timing was right, and All that was then left to do was send them to the palace as presents.

If Snowden gets asked directly he has a choice between either glossing over or telling the truth which would hurt his nephews and reopen old wounds. If it is true that Diana did that he would never admit it.

And the Wendy Berry book is regarded as being reliable. Stories in it have been corroborated by other sources. And there are things in it which weren't in the public domain at the time of publishing, but now are and are accepted as true. There are lots of reasons to think that book is reliable.

Were you alive at the time? I remember it and they and their 'friends' were in the press every day tearing strips off each other. They were engaged in a constant round of oneupmanship and point scoring against each other in all areas of their lives. I don't know why you find it so hard to believe when there's plenty of accounts they engaged in this sort of thing.

She could be incredibly manipulative. The Patrick Jephson book does an even worse hatchet job on her and basically accused her of stalking and harassing her staff.

I don't have a problem with what they wore but it all just looked a bit staged. My first thought, do you think the pram smells musty seeing it's been in storage for yonks.

Oh yes I was alive and I know what went on. I have no intention of defending Charles or Diana. I know there were countless instances of Diana trying to show Charles up - I read a very good book by two Guardian journalists which was very reasonable and measured about their marriage and they did a great little analysis of how Diana managed to spin the event when William got whacked by a golf club at school into making Charles look bad. It was what unhappy wives do all the time in similar circumstances TBH - tell him to go home, I'll be FINE, and then leave later looking miserable and all coping-with-my-poor-injured-child-all-by-myself-and-his-father-doesn't-give-a-shit. So it's perfectly believable about the photo except I think in this instance it's not true.

Whoever first brought the subject of that photo up though, I do see the analogy. There was something very staged and artificial about them walking to the church with through the crowd of "ordinary people" in their ordinary clothes. Kate's outfit was beautiful but looked quite bridal (although would match the Christening gown perfectly so I expect that's why she chose it). They looked very alien and odd. Whereas when they arrive in a big car, give a distant wave and then go into the church, like the Queen did, they don't look alien, they look Royal and it sort of works.

Deste, someone said a quite a few pages back that the pram is on public display in Sandringham.

Balloon, get the book and read it, then say if you still think it isn't true.

I'm not sure why two journalists from the Guardian repeating second hand stories are more reliable than an eyewitness.

There are plenty of things in that book which were unknown to the public at the time which have since been confirmed as true. Diana bullying her staff and freezing them out, unwanted gifts being burned on a pyre in the back garden, Diana tricking the staff into disclosing Charles' movements, her poor relationships with nannies. All of these (and other things) have been corroborated. And friends on both sides (including Gyles Brandeth, off the top of my head) have said it is a reliable account.

She doesn't go easy on Charles either, and makes it very clear he was heavily involved with Camilla and treated Diana badly.

There's no reason to think that the book is unreliable. Even Prince Charles didn't dispute the accuracy in the court case, he never claimed the book was inaccurate, just that she has breached a confidentiality agreement.

I remember when that Christmas card photo came out. I didn't think Charles looked out of place but I did think the whole thing was very in keeping with the Ralph Lauren vision of English life which was bring heavily promoted in the media at the time, not least by Diana's good friend Tina Brown.

Thank you,thank you! The few hand smocking African women left who are masters of this craft are stitching their fingers raw with the upsurge of orders for romper suits and frocks!

They are a self help group and do exquisite work on fine cotton lawn. This is a market which recognises heirloom craftsmanship and where price is not an object!

The little red romper suit is a Godsend!

Has anyone read James Hewitt's book? I found it (honest guv) in a b and b in Yorkshire. Hilarious.

I haven't no. Isn't it in the style of Mills and Boob? Might check it out, could do with a laugh.

This made me laugh:

www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/celebrity/creepy-ghost-kid-outfits-sell-out-across-uk-2015070799948

[grim]

It was 98 when I read it, so bit hazy but very much so. They would visit his aged mother for cream teas and leave bodyguards lurking in the rose garden.
The one about Camilla and Charles was about the same.
They were fab. Utter tosh, of course, but hilarious. As were Paul Burrell's.

I wish to underline that I found JH's in a b and b. I hold my hand up to borrowing Andrew Morton from Marjorie-up-the-street and who then bought me the rest, bless her.

I loved the pram, I'd have had one if we could afford it, all the traveller families have one, why shouldn't William and Kate? But George's outfit...it was a bit girly!

Paul Burrell's books are a proper lol fest. He's so camp and over dramatic. I didn't like the photos he put in though, of all Diana's private rooms in her apartment (taken in the days after she died), the sitting room and her dressing room. It felt like an invasion of the families privacy in the worst way. And I'm sure William and Harry could have done without the story of her going to meet Hasnat in only a fur coat and earrings...

I'm not sure why two journalists from the Guardian repeating second hand stories are more reliable than an eyewitness.

They are not! You are missing my point. I was saying that I am quite happy to believe that a lot of what is written in books by journalists/ex employees is true, and that a lot of it is speculation that actually is probably spot on.

But NOT in the case of that photo SIMPLY BECAUSE I saw the interview with Snowdon. And I happen to think the testimony of the photographer himself rather trumps whoever it was who wrote that book who was neither in the photo, nor planned it, nor took it.

If someone told me that Paul Burrell used to parade around in Diana's clothes when she was out I wouldn't be surprised.

hahaha me neither limited. In fact, I'd be surprised if that wasn't the case...

I reached ick point in his book when he talks about sleeping next to her coffin.
All very Norman Bates.

No...He didn't, did he??
I need to get me a copy of that book..

Again, was 98 so a long time ago, but I'm pretty sure he did. Just him and her the night before the funeral. (not at poor old Di, more at him)
He picked her frock out and dressed her as well. I know he buttled, and that is what buttling is, but still.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1180778/Paul-Burrell-faces-wrath-Princes-William-Harry-reveals-Dianas-secrets-TV-interview.html

Apologies for Fail link.