to think we all need to take responsibility for challenging islamophobia

[karbonfootprint]

It is so common and so hurtful to some of our fellow citizens. I don't think any of us should let it pass when we hear it, in private, but especially in public.

Are we saying then that if I disagree with someones views about something, it becomes okay for me to publically revile them in the street? Do you mean that if other people do things that we think are wrong we should then throw away all our own values??? Well I will not.

Riiiiiight,

The jeremy kyle reference just about sums up your intellect. You know the answer to your own question don't you? surely, you would have researched that question too. Or did your research stop there? But hey, don't let context get in the way of your 'research' will you. Just stick with Jeremy Kyle, love.

By the way, i don't believe that you have a closed mind, just a hateful one. i dont believe you need to be re educated, as you clearly have a very twisted agenda.
Most muslims find marmaduke pickethall's translation fairly easy to understand. You obviously interpreted it differently with the help of your jeremy kyle intellect. Well done. Of course your interpretation must be the right one, just as ISIS interpretation must be the right one. You are not that different to extremists you know that don't you? They bang on about hiw their interpretation justifies hatred, you bang on about how your interpretation justifies hatred. Its the ordinary muslims who then bear the brunt of the hatred towards them due to your hatred preaching.

Pathetic really. Nope, i shall most certainly not engage with a hatred preacher. Or are renouncers not capable if inciting hatred?

Sorry to take this off topic, but everyone is saying that all Christians aren't getting blamed for the recent shootinga in the US.

My family are Irish catholics, my nana moves to the UK when she was 20 but when she dies 14 years ago, she still had a strong accent. My mother and me were born here. In the 80s and early 90s there were shops that would refuse to serve nana because the ira actions. I went to a small catholic school and endured lots of nasty comments and even was slapped once because my nana was Irish Catholic so 'must have been in the ira' .

So yes it does happen to other faiths outside Islam. It doesn't justify it, but it does happen.

I also think it is extremely brave to renounce Islam considering people all over the world get ostracised and even MURDERED for it so hats off to you mistressmia

"Taking responsibility" for any of this is very low on my agenda. In fact it isn't on my agenda at all. YABU, OP.

I think this thread encapsulates a much wider and more worrying debate.

Person 1; I differentiate between Muslim-bashing and islamphpobia. I think all religions should be open to scrutiny

Person 2: here are my (anti-women, homophobic, human rights, free speech as appropriate) issue with Islam

Persons 3-10 you racist scum! I am upset beyond words, I refuse to engage with such a racist etc.

Other people ooh so sorry, you're right what an outrage.

Wearisome, predictable and depressing in equal measure.

In a long time admiring her intelligent politesse in the face of such abuse, I applaud MistressMia for simply caring enough

MistressMia is in danger due to being an "apostate", but always gets flamed by certain posters on Mumsnet.
I have to suspect this is outrage at an apostate who dares to go public.

If a Catholic or Protestant was posting about fearing her Uni colleagues would murder her for going atheist, I'm sure everyone would be outraged, not criticising her for racist Chrisophobia.

Other posters are more hostile to Muslims and are totally ignorant about the religion. What has she done to deserve this venom ?

I see apostophobia here.

Personally I find radical Islam really fucking terrifying. But I find all fundamentalist beliefs frightening, including those that result in 10 year old victims of incest carrying their baby to term, and those that result in children being killed on the West Bank.

None of the above is any excuse for racism, though.

No other muslim is responsible for your apostacy.
You are responsible for your actions.
Isis is responsible for theirs.

Fantastic Splitpeas. Let's just end the thread then because as a non muslim why should I be responsible for others islamophobia?

Saying that I would never stand there as someone ripped a headscarf from a muslim lady or any of the other disgusting things mentioned. I don't know anyone who would no nothing as someone was abused in front of them. It doesn't matter if they follow Islam or not

It is the totally un called for levels of hostility that I am referring to. I don't think Christians face the same thing at all.

Maybe not in the uk, but what about the persecution and hostility they face in Muslim countries? Syria, Iraq, Egypt? How
Much do you know about attacks
On Churches and persecution of Christian communities outside Europe.

I get that you as a Muslim want to live in peace and not be subjected to any phobia due to you faith, everybody should have that.

That was the weirdest post by Splitpeas. I mean really?what a load of BS.
I applaud you MM. I've learnt a lot from your brave and insightful posts.

mistressmia is absolutely at risk.

You need only see what Muslim MNetters think of her and how enraged they get by her posting on the Internet to imagine what RL interactions are like for her.

And the fact that someone automatically described her as an "apostate" tells you all you need to know about their mindset.

On this issue, I have said before that my family are Muslim. I am not irrationally frightened of people who peacefully practice Islam and go about their lives. But I would like to have a rational debate about the very significant overlap between Muslim countries/sharia law/practicing Islam and misogyny, homophobia, hatred of other religions and terrorism/jihad.

I think the faith leaders coming together right after British attacks helps. The appeals for calm help. Increased police presence around the attack sites help. Anger does die down with time. The current strategy of publicising certain prosecutions of hate crimes, reminding people of how the law actually stands, and so on, help to manage the relatively sedate nature of this crisis. If Nigel Farage was in charge of this country (or Marine Le Pen) there would just be chaos. Britain is this orderly, given what's going on, all over the place, because it's well managed.

I am interested in challenging fundamentalist, outdated Islam, so that its women and children are longer second class or mutilated to please weak men.

Most victims of ISIS in other countries are other Muslims, just from a different strand:
ISIS make horrific snuff videos with the latest high-tech equipment where other Muslims are put in cages and burnt to death or drowned.
They explode bombs in mosques or at shrines.
Like the Taliban, they kill girls who go to school and kill their teachers.

They are phobic about every other variant of Islam.

No wonder if most other Muslims are scared stiff of them and would rather keep quiet, or complain about veil-pulling in the UK. Much safer.

As for Christians, when ISIS invade, they execute the men and boys, enslave the women and little girls, to be raped as the spoils of war.

Absolutely no tolerance for different interpretations of the Sky Fairy.

The christians in the middle East are treated very badly IMO.

www.premier.org.uk/News/World/Christians-mark-one-year-since-capture-of-Mosul

There are aspects of the Islam faith that need discussing. Islamaphobia can be used and directed to silence such discussions.

Bring on more discussion I say.

Sadly this thread is no longer about the very serious topic raised in the op. If you wanted to debate islamic veliefs, politics, terrorism, apostacy, fgm, why would you derail this thread instead of starting another?

Quint and others, are you really saying that because some muslims in (mostly) other places commit atrocities, that you feel that public victimisation and vilification of innocent muslims in this country is somehow acceptable? I simply cant understand this thinking, and I am fairly sure noone would find it okay if it were another group rather than muslims.

Inkanta, islamophobia is not the robust discussion of difference whilst bringing with us our own cultural prejudices. It is negative, insulting, demeaning, frightening, abusive statements or actions made towards muslim individuals or groups. In fact most islamophobic incidents in the UK would be considered the be crimes, but they are just not reported. Are you condoning these behaviours?

Quint and others, are you really saying that because some muslims in (mostly) other places commit atrocities, that you feel that public victimisation and vilification of innocent muslims in this country is somehow acceptable?

The British Jewish community are on the phone. They want to know why they are constantly asked to defend, distance or deny the behaviour of the Israeli government. Particularly, as it happens, by Muslim organisations.

But what is your point? Are you saying that British jews should not be held accountable for the offences of the Israeli government, but Brisish muslims should be held responsible for the actions of all muslim terrorists? You cant have it both ways. If its wrong, then its also wrong when directed towards muslims.

Muslim community here. Why do we have to defend distance deny the behaviour of ISIS? Particularly as it happens by everybody else

And are you also saying that british muslims are routinely spitting and cursing at british jews in the street, and that you think the british public should sit back and allow that to happen?

If its wrong, then its also wrong when directed towards muslims.

It is. But that argument would have more force were it not Muslim organisations wanting to hold Jews responsible for Israeli actions.