to have said no naps for 2 year old ds (mil related, and long)

[justbatteringon]

DS turned two in April. If he has a nap during the day is up until at least midnight, about a month and a half ago DP and I agreed to try no naps for a week to see if it helped any. It did DS's mood improved he was sleeping from 7.30 - 8pm until 6 - 7am the next morning (his usual wake up times). I admit some days he has a tired period but usually if you distract him/keep him busy he'll have no problem staying up.

At the minute DP's parents take care of the children while DP and I are working, controversial to MNers I know but it's very temporary and it's a long story but please believe me when I say I have legitimate reasons and I appreciate them doing it very much.

So DP's parents watch them at the most about 5 hours a day maybe 3 times a week. We asked them to please not let DS nap, because of above reasons DP was insistent to them that they not nap I took the approach with them that I understood that he's sometimes hard work to keep but up but if you've tried and he's knackered then let him have a wee sleep. No problem or so I thought.

They've since told DP that they will not make any attempt to keep him up and if DS wants to sleep they're going to let him and that is that. They even lied about letting him nap which made us think he would be much more tired than he was and took him to bed much earlier than we would of had we known he'd had a sleep during the day. This happened 2 days in a row and it's not even the problem.

DP sent them a whatsapp picture of DS at midnight saying "this is what i mean about letting him sleep he's still up and it's after midnight i know my boy and i know when he needs his sleep"

FIL replied that he was absolutely livid at DP for sending him that message and MIL sent DP 3 messages about how terrible he was how none of her other children were as terrible and was he proud of himself that his DF was now going to bed with high blood pressure. I told DP to ask them over for coffee the next day to sort this out. MIL responded that DP must have a guilty conscience to invite them for coffee.

I thought that the response was absolutely awful and want to have a word with them to clear the air and remind them that we are the parents and not them.

Would I be wrong to do that?

Does anyone else not allow their 2 year old to nap?

Thanks for reading.

I'm with the grandparents on this - it isn't a case of him dropping naps by himself, he is clearly tired if you are having to physically keep him from falling asleep.

If I was looking after a child who was showing tired signs I would also think it cruel to keep him awake all day. The OP is contradicting herself in her posts, one minute he's easy to keep awake and the next he is being distracted with being taken outside and removing comforting, admitting it can be awkward to keep him awake.

I agree with a pp that you need to sort out his bedtime routine and ensure he sleeps longer at night. The answer is not to deprive him of sleep in the day if he is showing he needs it.

My DS is now nearly 10. Still does turbo somehow, but is getting better at listening to himself and accepting he is tired. He will still push for more story, more cuddles, more this and that.

Sometimes we do stuff that takes him WAY out of his usual bedtime slot - a concert, a mid week footy match, and we are home late. I find he sleeps LESS and wakes up earlier if he's had a late night, he's always been like that, that is the way he is. If he goes to bed roughly at the same usual bedtime, he will wake 7 ish the next day, give or take half an hour. If I keep him out until 10pm or 11pm, he'll be up at 6, give or take half an hour >_

I don't think you've done anything wrong. The photo showed evidence re why you wanted no naps!

Change your childcare though. If you are paying for it, you get more say in the service you receive...

justbatteringon, I'm not quite clear about what you are saying. Do you mean before this happened your MIL had told you she wouldn't keep him awake? How did you find out she lied, what I mean is has she said "Oh yes I put him down for a sleep" after denying it or might he have nodded off when she was busy and she just didn't tell you. I think the devil is in the detail really.

Mariposa is every single day of your life the same? I can't tell you every aspect of my life. Do you fancy coming to stay with me for a week so you can really understand. Wouldn't want to contradict myself anymore.

grannytomine when I came home from work, ds had a dummy and I thought something was off but couldn't place it.
Then when he wouldn't go to sleep and I realised if that if he hadn't napped he'd been up about 13 hours I put 2 and 2 together.

Don't think I'm taking all your advice in vain I've been speaking to dp a lot about ds's sleeping and I think it's definitely going to change dp struggles to change ds's routine
I've only just convinced him to stop spoon feeding ds his breakfast. like literally this week

Grannytome i ment to add that dp always calls his parents to ask when they were fed and if they napped and when.
She told him he hadn't napped.

OP - is your DP like that with a lot of things, or is it just DS? Resistant to change, very focused on 'the way we do it'.

justbatteringon, so you think she lied to your DP, does the little one ever have bad nights even when he hasn't had a nap? My bad sleeper wasn't that easy to read but if you are sure then fair enough. Has she come clean now, how would you feel if she said something like I did, popped into kitchen and came back and he had nodded off? Would that make it better? Or not?

It can be hard if they are retired and having both of them, I don't know how old they are but I am early 60s, fit and active but I have to confess I do get more tired than I did 20 years ago.

I had an issue with my GC where DS and DDIL were accusing me of being a liar. One GS couldn't have certain drinks, e numbers making him hyper. I stopped buying it, no problem we like lots of soft drinks. Had a phone call one night, "You gave him X drink." I hadn't. "We can tell, he is hyper." I really hadn't. "Don't let him have it again." OK but I didn't.

Couple of weeks go by, "You have given him X again." No. "We know you have, if you do it agian you can't have him." Fine, if you speak to me like that again I won't.

Went to collect him one night for a sleep over. Other GM was there, as we were getting him ready to leave she turned to her DD and said, "Oh I gave him X drink when we had lunch, I know you don't like him to have it but he loves it and I don't see him much." DDIL and I looked at each other. No one said anything and I left. He actually wasn't hyper so don't know about that but no one ever mentioned the drink again. Doesn't mean I have forgotten though.

Hope you can work it out, if its any comfort you can look forward to him being a teenager who wants to spend the weekend in bed. Revenge is vacuuming his bedroom at 8 am on a Saturday morning for a long time. I loved it.

YABU. I presume they're looking after your child for free, and if they want a bit of peace and quiet during that time instead of a whiny tired toddler, they should be entitled to it.

If you want to dictate the terms of your childcare then you need to pay someone to do it.

I had to stop MIL having my boy when he was a baby: I would advise when he needed to nap (not past 2pm), and basically she and her husband decided that no, that didn't suit them ... and would bring him back to me at 5pm fast asleep! His bed time was 7pm! They only had him once a week - their request, I didn't work so didn't need a babysitter. FIL's response was 'when he's with us, we can do what we want, and there's not a damn thing you can do about it.' Ooh I could go on ...

Shore - tbh I would have just been grateful they had baby all day and would adjust bedtime accordingly. Does it matter if bedtime was 10pm that day? It's not like you would have had baby all day anyway so could have just spent evening together

you presume wrong yoursfan OP does pay them. RTFT

shore my jaw dropped when you said they left him off at 5 asleep it's not much of a break if your up until 10 with baby.

Grannytomine I haven't confronted her about it, I won't either.
Maybe she didn't lie I just have a feeling and she's told me before fil has asked her not to tell us things concerning ds. Nothing sinister though.

I don't think you're being unreasonable at all. The free childcare thing is a massive red herring that gets up other mumsnetters noses so they can't see the wood for the trees.

Ffs, we tell toddlers their actions have consequences and follow through on them, asking two adults not to do something then showing them exactly why when they ignore you is not a big deal. They are at fault here. I think you do need alternate childcare though because these two can't be trusted.

On the sleep thing I think you probably need to get tough. We had similar problems with our son and were at the end of our tether. I wouldn't leave him and went up every time he cried/got up etc and he would NOT sleep/stay in bed. Eventually we put a stair gate up and left him. He was running up and down the landing, crying, shouting daddy then crying when he didn't get a response etc. We ignored it (I say we, I went out and left my husband to deal with it). He finally took himself off after 45 mins. The next night it was my turn and he was asleep in 3 minutes - I had to check he was alive I was so shocked. This was after MONTHS of sleep refusal. Now he goes to bed nicely at 7.30. Has a bottle before which he sometimes takes with him, story, kiss, sleep. Try it. Leaving him was a last resort but was so effective it was definitely for the best for us.

Good luck. xx

I looked after my DNephew nearly every weekend, holidays and even some school days when my SIL (a single Mum) was working. That was from aged 6-13 yrs old.

To be honest, I had the "Mummy's Rules" phrase for everything. Times of meals, bed-time routine, reading, computer use etc etc. If he protested, I would just say "You know Mummy's Rules". As he grew older, I would check if bedtime had changed, how long he should be allowed to read in bed before lights off. He was a fussy eater and breakfast became a non-starter. I had to check with Mum if it was okay for him to skip his toast and Nutella when he categorically refused to have it. (Apparently, she couldn't get him to eat breakfast either and put an extra healthy item in his lunch box for play-time. She'd forgotten to tell me.)

Not all of the rules suited me to be honest e.g. DNephew didn't have to have a bath/shower every night (Yuk!), he refused to have his hair combed (another Yuk!), he was allowed to stay up after MY bed-time as he got older - but I couldn't settle until I knew he was soundly asleep so it was my sleep-deprivation that came into play when the dog still needed to be let out in the garden and fed at 6am and I wasn't getting to bed until after 10.30pm.

But they were the "Mummy Rules" rules and I kept them.

Having said that, we always talked about changing routines and she would say, "You go to bed even if he is still reading". I just couldn't because I needed to know he was sleeping safely and soundly before I could sleep myself. But at least she recognised that at my home things might have to be a little bit different otherwise I wouldn't have the stamina to continue to provide FREE, regular child-care. For example, DNephew HAD to walk the dog with me for up to 4 miles a day even though he wasn't an outdoor type. We'd usually go to a park or a forest where DN could play, but he knew that at my house, dog-walking was a daily activity and Mummy supported ME with this rule.

I hope you can work things out OP. It just takes a bit of give and take on either side; each one in the parent/child-minding situation understanding the necessary rules and reasons. Oh - and a bit of give-and-take when a rule is broken