To ask if you have had any contact with benefit 'scroungers'

[JumpRope]

I utterly believe that we need to protect the poor, vulnerable and those unable to work and they should have help to live.

I grew up in a very rural area, fairly poor, very hard work for non land owners - workers werefarm labourers mainly. And there were many people leaving school in the 80s and 90s and then abusing the system - picking up the dole, laughing about it, straight to the pub until it ran out; I remember a dog called Giro. People just sold a bit of marijuana for extra work. After moving to a bigger town, I came across families like this, where the dad would start it off, and the children would just grow up and do the same.

There were jobs around. As students homes for holidays, we picked up work without trouble, and could have stayed on, got promotions etc.

How do you deal with these situations? How can we make sure we are not making cuts to those who desperately need it, whilst absolutely changing the mind sets of able bodied men (and women) who have grown up believing they are entitled to money for nothing.

I knew somebody who claimed DLA for a bad back, had a car on motorbility.
When she was out and about, she'd walk with a stick.
At the same time, she'd attend to her 2 horses, ride them and ride other people's.

Somebody shopped her and she was photographed riding a horse. She had to pay back a substantial amount by order of the courts.

Conservatives plan to cut benefits to 23k per couple from 26k. I think that's perfectly reasonable. A lot of people work their arses off for the minimum wage and don't receive that.

I know many ' scroungers' through my work who come from families who haven't worked for generations. This is why the system needs a shake up and for it to be seen that work pays, regardless of what the hysterical left say. There are genuine claimants of course needing to be helped but equally there are many scroungers who do not want to work. My sil is one of them. I would rather not have a generous welfare system at all, more of a safety net as it was originally put in place for.

Apprenticeships, training will support people getting into work. Not to just spend even more tax payers money not actually fixing a problem but bloating it by the Labour Party's idea of free for all for anyone and everyone.

Manic, it wasn't intended cynically.

I was genuinely surprised that it wasn't obvious anyone with eight children will hugely struggle. You would seriously need a large income to be comfortable, even if all the children were NT.

work in healthcare. see it all the time.

long long ago, I offered a cleaning job to a young girl who told me outright that she didn't need the work because she had money coming in from her benefits. (words to that effect)

They won't cut them to 23 they will make that the cap. In many areas where rents are less it is much less In London its enough to leave someone homeless or at best without money for food

Ok crustaway. Well if you find my postings to be aggressive, feel free to report them to MNHQ.

Link to our guidelines Thanks everso

Yes. My Dad and SMum are the ultimate cliche. He has 'depression' and she has a 'bad back'. Result, 30 years of no one in the family working.

They have a higher standard of living than us. It is truly amazing what you get can if you know the system.

I think that finding a loophole is entirely different to deliberately paying workers cash in hand don't you think? A loophole may be legal, if unethical. Whereas cash in hand is illegal.

I used to know plenty of 'benefit scroungers', my home town was rife with them. When low paid, seasonal temporary employment in crappy jobs was the alternative I didn't blame some of them either. Or better still, they'd take on some of the lighter duties of this seasonal work, cash in hand, and still claim their benefits too. Nearly all have been single mothers, many had partners living with them but not declared, a few were young single men pretending to be unwell. However, all of the ones I'm still loosely in contact with have in the last few years began working, or gone to college/work based training, and stopped popping out babies like rabbits. Funny that! .

There are still a handful that I know of, and unsurprisingly some are the children of the people I know who were living a benefits lifestyle in the mid to late 90s. Born to 16/17yo mothers themselves and recently making their mothers, grandmothers at the age of less than 35. Straight into social housing, some of it brand new.

I am staggered that there are folk here who claim they've never come across a benefits scrounger.

And Ive been reported to MNHQ for telling another poster not to be aggressive, really?

Get over yourself Bursary.

crustsaway do you (personally) know people who dodge paying tax? If so, what's your view on it? I'd asked upthread but no reply as yet.

Actually, I didn't report that one.

I know people - through my job- who could work and have never worked from choice. Some live off benefits and some live off benefits and questionable activities. I also know people who work and are very poor because they do two, or even three, very low pad jobs and refuse to claim benefits from a sense that they don't want to take handouts.

I think there is no question that, for some, the benefit system is seen as a way of life and a choice and it is those people the government needs to tackle. No idea how!

I know a lot of people that avoid paying tax by many a legal loophole. I know a lot of people that had a contingency plan to leave the country if labour got in. I know a lot of people that do lots of things. At the end of the day, we are all human and we all do what we have to. Im neither worried nor cross about what I see and hear. I don't judge.

Surely people who ahve never worked still get a basic pension and/ or pension credits/ Housing benefit etc?

One can get some pension entitlement by claiming housing benefit for a child under 12, while not working, but as the legislation actively intends people to do this, I think it would be harsh to call that gaming the system.

I'm not 100% sure about this, but I think marrying someone much older just to get a spouse pension might be a thing. If it ever was a problem, I think it will be less of one in future, as I think state pensions for spouses are being phased out now. Eventually people will only get state pensions based on their own NI record.

However despite these two exceptions, I'd still say pension entitlement is overall something that's relatively difficult to game. Having children or marrying someone a few decades older are not options many people will take for the pension benefits they might bring.

Not sure how pension credit/housing benefit are relevant. They are means-tested benefits that don't depend on your NI record, so nothing like state pensions.

Legal loopholes and wanting to leave the country are entirely different to paying cash in hand, are they not? My problem is with a business I know that pays everyone minimum wage on their payslip. But actually pays them a lot more in reality which is not declared.

Apprenticeships, training will support people getting into work. Not to just spend even more tax payers money not actually fixing a problem but bloating it by the Labour Party's idea of free for all for anyone and everyone
My husband is an apprentice at the moment, it was all he could find after leaving the army and becoming a sahd for a while (I had to voluntarily leave a job 60hrs a week on commission) and we have to claim tax credits, housing benefit etc as he earns £400 a month. We do not get as much as an unemployed family do, and I feel that apprenticeships seem like a great idea but in reality most apprentices will end up claiming top ups in order to afford to live.

Yes, I come from a working class background and knew people claiming benefits, sometimes fraudulently, when they could work ( I knew these people well, family friends, so I am not making mean spirited assumptions about people I barely know from Adam). It makes me mad as claiming when you don't need to takes public money away from those who do. And I work in a job I don't like so I resent my taxes going to those who genuinely don't need it.

I used to work in a disability day centre, and I am sorry to say that I saw it many times. People who were out to claim everything they possibly could and who were unashamedly cynical about it. There were also people there who were in heart-breaking situations and who desperately needed every penny they could get. It made it worse seeing the scroungers (and believe me, they were) next to the truly vulnerable.

Tax credits caused most of the problems, people should never have been allowed to work sixteen hours or to not work at all.

Well if that been the case I wouldn't have worked at all after having my first dc. Going back to work fulltime wasn't an option as I had limited free childcare and couldn't afford to pay for it so just working 16 hours worked just fine for me.

I paid into the system when I worked fulltime before having dcs and will do again if I'm lucky enough to find a job with more hours. I don't think I've abused the Tax credits or maybe I have.

I'm one of your benefit 'scroungers'.
I trained hard and got employed in Accounts. Met my DH who was my boss at work, Production Manager there. We both worked very hard for low salary as we were at the bottom of the ladder. We managed to get a mortgage for our first property, mortgage rates began at 11% but soon rose to 15%. DH under immense pressure at work had his first breakdown. We had to sell the house and move in with parents. DH went on to have 2 more breakdowns before being diagnosed with a variety of mental illnesses, recently settling on Borderline Personality Disorder. He was also diagnosed with Fibromyalgia and CAM type hip impingement. Work became impossible for both of us. I would get up at 6, get him up, showered, dressed, fed and go to work, returning at lunch time to check on him and quite often find him in exactly the same place as when I had gone. he had nothing, no other family to call on, no support services (surprise it was the late 80s and these had all been cut to the bone). Eventually I was called in to work and asked to make a decision as my work was suffering, they couldn't afford to carry me anymore. I left to become his full time carer but wasn't officially accepted as this (him receive Care Component of DLA thereby triggering my Carers Allowance) until 15 years later. We survived on his sickness benefit. We were fortunate to have a housing association flat to rent. His health began to improve, he managed a few jobs; we had children believing good times were returning. Then he really fell and hasn't come back yet. he won't. He was awarded DLA Care for life after being examined by 3 separate independent doctors. He was told by Benefits Advisors to not attend any more interviews as they could see the obvious distress and worsening of his health they caused.
We moved rurally to escape from his family who were back on the scene and causing huge stress as he had a traumatic childhood. Unfortunately, this meant day trips just to see consultants at hospital, huge petrol bills with no public transport even if he could use them. We have so far managed a holiday once a year in the UK using Sun vouchers and tesco vouchers but we have to go in term time or DH has panic attacks. We are threatened with being fined £60 per parent per child for taking them away by LA (school are excellent and understanding but their hands are tied). Everything we own has either been given or bought second hand. I haven't had new clothes for over a year, a £10 pair of jeans means the difference between food on the table. Last year we jumped through hoops at tribunals because someone who had never met my husband decided he was fit to work. After another overdose, he was placed in the Work Recovery group.

I'm sorry for the long post but I need people to see the reality of what life is like on benefits. there is no extra money. Those who drink, smoke and appear On Jeremy Kyle must be fiddling and getting extra money from somewhere, they are the ones to be targeted, not people like us. But now we have another Tory government even more cuts are to be expected. Rumours that my Carers Allowance are to be stopped - I already have £30 of the £61 taken away as DH receives Income Related ESA (£115 a week). private rent means we top up Housing Benefit by £25 a week, we are on the list to move but council properties are few and far between, and private rentals do not like HB claimants.

I am what you like to call a 'benefit scrounger'. I go without food to put meals on the table, your bottle of wine tonight would pay for the familys meals for the next 2 days. I care for my husband because no one else will. You are all one accident or illness away from this.

Yes, loads.
My brother for one. He is 38 now and has never had a job. He has a diabetes and gets extra money for that and says he can't work nd why should he byway as he gets enough 'pocket money ' from the state.
Can't work but manages to get round the country to festivals and been ti Berlin, Ireland and Krakow on piss ups this year alone.

I used to work for a department in Social services and try to get them motivated into different actiivities ( changed the details because it was a specific role and don't want to out my self) I had so many people say but I earn ( however much .....in benefits) why should I go out and work. I had an alcoholic say to me ' thanks for thinking about me love, but I'm happy not working'

My list goes on but people won't believe me!