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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

To wonder if tory voters care about the 1 million.

391 replies

Jacobsmum1972 · 08/05/2015 18:43

I bet they don't give a flying monkeys for anyone coming under attack by the Tories. The poor, disabled and tennants.

I have felt close to tears all day because I know what a conservative majority means for so many in this country.

SadSadSad

OP posts:
NRomanoff · 09/05/2015 10:40

What shocks me more is that there is very little vitriol thrown at people who chose not to vote and people like Russell Brand (who told people not to vote then to vote for Labour after registration was closed).

How much do they care about everyone else? How much are they bothered about even their own family that they didn't go and vote.

Turnout was just above the 2010 election. Why? I think this really needs looking at. Obviously E4 hoping they could improve figures by switching off for a few hours didn't actually work. Grin

BeaufortBelle · 09/05/2015 10:47

Actually I find Russell Brand so offensive I wondered if him telling people to vote labour was a counterintuitive tory stunt to persuade people not to vote labour.

Charis1 · 09/05/2015 10:49

Actually the majority of the country did not vote Tory. Only 37.9% did

  • the further 33% who didn't vote at all, meaning the majority of the country did not vote against the tories.
NRomanoff · 09/05/2015 10:50

Actually I find Russell Brand so offensive I wondered if him telling people to vote labour was a counterintuitive tory stunt to persuade people not to vote labour.

Whether he intended it or not, i don't know. But i do think the interview with Ed and that endorsement did not help.

His backdown video is ridiculous.

SirSpamalot · 09/05/2015 10:52

flippinada

The last paragraph on the BBC report about the poor gentleman who died...

This is a tragic case and the coroner attributed Mr Wood's eating disorder and food phobia as the likely cause of his death, rather than issues around benefits.

Which may explain why he was 5st poor soul. Either way, I don't think it's as simple as 'he died because his benefits were sanctioned'

For what it's worth, I have a relative with a severe, but acute, not chronic, serious mental health condition. When they are well, you would never think they were unable to work. Ever. But they can't work, as working is likely to make them ill.

They were worried sick about an ATOS assessment for PIP and its result thinking there was no way they would be supported (they had to go to an appeal about DLA which they won, but not the highest rate). In the event, a supporting letter from their doctor was sent. They didn't have to go through an ATOS assessment and have been awarded PIP.

I cannot see how their experience reflects the Labour voters view of how a Tory government treats the disabled and/or mentally unwell in this country. It's certainly not as straightforward as some Labour voters would have you believe.

devon004 · 09/05/2015 10:58

Pointless to count those who didn't vote.

JemimaPuddlePop · 09/05/2015 11:01

I'm far from being really knowledgable about politics - when it gets into the rules of coalitions, minority parties etc - it all gets a bit blurry for me.

But I understand the basics - 650 seats, each constituency votes an mp, the party with the most mp's wins.

BUT when I was in work on Thursday and there was generally a lot of election chat going on, there were an astounding number of people who didn't vote because they didn't understand the process so hence didn't bother...they understood the main policies iyswim but because the whole constituencies/who gets into parliament was unknown, they didn't bother. I had to spend 5 minutes explaining the basic rules to my bff, who is very intelligent and articulate, but just found this a blind spot.

The best thing that could be done for this Country IMO to encourage voting would be for an impartial third party to educate the masses on the actual process.

In my local seat, the Tories took the seat from Labour by 20-odd votes after 100 years of it being labour...and I've heared a lot of people moaning About it. In some constituencies just educating a few hundred to encourage them to vote would/could make a huge difference.

NRomanoff · 09/05/2015 11:01

devon I don't think it is. If voting Tory makes you selfish,choosing not voting makes you worse. Those choosing not to vote obviously don't care about the poor or disabled, following that thinking.

Lagoonablue · 09/05/2015 11:10

Demonise the poor and disadvantaged then.

Most benefits are paid to pensioners btw.

Yes there are scroungers just as their are tax avoiders. Not much being done to demonise them is there?

ShadowsInTheDarkness · 09/05/2015 11:12

What I'm finding so very hard to stomach is the attitude of "oh stop the melodramatic angsty hysterics and get over it". I posted this on another thread and I'm re posting it here.

The thing is that some of us are living these cuts. Some of us are right at the bottom, clinging on by our fingernails and worrying about how we get out of this mess. No labour didn't make any clear outlined statements on how they would do things differently. However the Tories have PROMISED cuts so in electing them, it's a given that our situation will definitely get worse. I didn't give a fuck who people voted for as long as it wasn't a conservative vote. I just wanted them out.

I say this without a hint of hysteria and as calmly as possible so as to avoid being called a hysteric: I left an abusive relationship. I went into refuge. That refuge has now closed. I have a 2yo with asthma which is as yet not being effectively controlled leading to frequent hospital admissions. I have a 4yo with sensory issues who is slightly on the spectrum. Neither of these are conditions which in any way entitle me or them to disability/carer benefits yet they do mean that I would struggle to hold down a job with the frequent medical appointments and three day stretches of time off I'd need every time DS was admitted to hospital (frequently). The benefits I do receive are barely enough. Bedroom tax means I pay a hefty amount on top of my housing benefit to make up the rent, and my house is "cheap" for this area. I manage to sell a few craft bits and get some maintenance from exP and this just about keeps our heads above water. We eat very little meat and I'm on iron supplements to hold the anemia at bay. I grow veg, and have fruit trees, I keep hens and feed them on scraps so we always have eggs. I'm breaking my tenancy by having the veg patch and the hens but with no inspections it's a risk I'm willing to take to ensure we have more than we did if I tried to buy all our veg/eggs.

If the benefits I receive are cut I can only see one option. (And it's likely they will be, I'm under 25, they've threatened a cut to tax credits, housing benefit will prob be squeezed a bit more etc) I've sat down and gone through my options over and over but if my money decreases I won't be able to afford to keep the house, I won't be able to afford the essentials like heating in winter and the tv license, new shoes, winter coats. If this happens I will have to get back with my ex. I can't see another way out. It's ok though, because he wasn't very abusive, just a little bit and it's only for five years right?

That's my calmly explained reality. It's not even that bad compared to an awful lot of people. So many people aren't lucky enough to have an abusive ex who would take them in and pay all their bills. An awful lot of people will be forced down the route of patching up old school shoes, layering jumpers in place of coats, not heating their homes, selling their tv, radio, tumble drier, hair dryers as my friend has, just to try and free up even a few extra pounds for some basics like big bags of spuds and rice in an attempt to keep her kids fed. I'm luckily, incredibly so, to have the luxury of the veg patch and hens. A lot of lone parents on benefits don't get maintenance either, so they are already struggling far more than I am now. I eat less than I could to ensure the kids have enough. We already eat porridge for dinner twice a week to keep costs down. It's scary. I'm scared. Actually scared. It upsets me that those of us at the bottom have to spell this out actually. When we rant on about people starving any lives being destroyed do the Tory posters think we are just being dramatic for effect? Don't they understand that we are talking about our own lives? When I post that families will be plunged into further poverty I'm talking about myself, my family. I'm upset that I and others are being told to "shut the fuck up" when we really need to be able to sound off somewhere about the bleakness we feel looking ahead at the next five years.

DawnMumsnet · 09/05/2015 11:15

Morning all,

We seem to be posting similar messages on a fair few threads this morning.

As you can imagine, we've had our hands full responding to all the reports that have been generated by election-related threads (such as this one).

We've been busy zapping posts and suspending anyone who we feel has crossed the line - here's a link to our Talk Guidelines if anyone needs a reminder. Please be aware that 'no deliberately inflammatory behaviour' is one of our (very few) rules, as well the more obvious 'no personal attacks'.

We do respond to every single report we receive - though at times like this it might take a little longer than usual - and we do rely on your letting us know if someone's being out of order.

So please, report, report, report.

Thanks Flowers

Queenofwands · 09/05/2015 11:16

Shadows in the darkness... Thank you for your articulate post which should help people to realise what life in Cameron's Britain is like... I shudder at the thought of what it will become.

troubleinstore · 09/05/2015 11:17

Romanoff

  • just what I said back on page 4 about the original OP
34% of the population didn't vote at all...I don't see you mentioning them being as bad as the Tories...in fact if this 34% voted against the tories they might have saved the 1 million you talk about...and i bet your bottom dollar some of the 1 million you talk about are part of the 34% who didn't vote.... just sayin...
GraceGrape · 09/05/2015 11:24

I think that most people don't care if it doesn't affect them. You probably don't care about lots of other issues which don't affect you. Its human nature

This ^^ is the reason the Conservative party won - individuals voting for their own interests, rather than for the good of society as a whole. But I disagree that it's human nature. It is actually in the nature of some people to be compassionate about the more vulnerable members of our society and to vote for policies that will protect them, even if there is little or no self-interest. Financially, I am probably better off under a Conservative government. I am privileged in that I don't claim any benefits, nobody in my family is disabled, I own my own home. I work, but I don't believe that I necessarily work harder than those in low-paid jobs. However, I could never vote for a party that puts the interests of the rich above the interests of the poor. The rich have the means to look after themselves, the poor do not.

At it's most simplistic, it seems (IMO) that this is the basic ideological difference between the two main parties. It was epitomised during the campaign by reaction to Labour's idea of a mansion tax. To me, it seems like a no-brainer. Of course somebody who can afford a £2m house should take on more of the burden than somebody surviving on a minimum-wage, zero-hours contract.

I know there are many other reasons why people didn't vote Labour, which I can understand: a lack of confidence in their ability to manage the economy, the "Ed Miliband" effect. To be honest, I probably believe that in purely economic terms, the Conservatives will do a more efficient job. However, I read an interesting article recently that suggested that our government will always swing between the right-of-centre and left-of-centre parties. The Conservatives will be needed to run the economy with a "firmer" hand. Then we will need a period of time with a more left-wing government to spend money on more socialist policies to support those more vulnerable people who have been hammered by harsher, "Tory" policies. It will be interesting to see if this happens in the future.

BeaufortBelle · 09/05/2015 11:27

ShadowsintheDarkness you sound like a very sensible and brilliant mum and please don't go back to your ex under any circumstances.

But, in reading your post, could you ask to be housed in a smaller property to save on rent?

Could you read the riot act at the next hospital appointment over the asthma and insist on seeing the consultant in charge and being referred to a specialist asthma nurse. I was where you are with this many many years ago and once that happened I was offered a smaller easier to use spacer (these weren't available on the NHS then, but are now) and the nurse explained that that getting the dose right wasn't about counting to 10 but counting the number of breaths and pointing out that many small children hold their breath when the spacer is applied so all that effort for no improvement. Things improved remarkably after than appointment.

I am guessing too if your children are four and two that you will shortly be able to take up nursery hours/school places and when that happens presumably you will be able to do bits of casual work and I don't mean this to sound patronising but where I live cleaners/ironers are like gold dust so there might be work available.

I am sorry for the situation you are in but I do wonder where your family are and whether they are helping you. I know that some people don't have family support but if you were my daughter and a bit of me wishes you were, you wouldn't be worrying like this, really you wouldn't because I would feel responsible for you and I would make sure you had enough to feed my grandchildren.

flippinada · 09/05/2015 11:37

SirSpam I understand that, which is why I said it was a contributing factor rather than the reason why. If I didn't express myself clearly then I apologise - I was posting in a hurry.

The fact remains however that his benefits were sanctioned and they shouldn't have been. If someone is so mentally ill that they can't work then they should not be having their benefits sanctioned.

Also, a PP stated confidently that nobody has starved to death in the country - I was pointing out that this is not correct.

Charis1 · 09/05/2015 11:41

Pointless to count those who didn't vote

no it isn't, you want to know how the tories got in, the reason is because the MAJORITY of registered voters either voted for them or didn't vote against them.

anyone who wanted their opinion heard would have voted on Thursday, Those that didn't were quite happy not to register a vote against the tories, whether they lived in marginals or not.

fiveacres · 09/05/2015 11:45

I have a great deal of sympathy for your post Shadows. I presume you are unable to find somewhere which offers cheaper rent hence paying over the odds for where you live, but I do feel that is something that needs addressing pretty urgently - this may mean living somewhere less than ideal which is hard, I know.

I don't feel your post was remotely hysterical, but it was personal - to you - of course, and you have expressed yourself beautifully. But, the job of a government isn't to respond to people's personal issues and problems - it's to govern. I very much doubt (and my own XH has alluded to the same) that changes will be made to existing children - it will, most likely, be children born after 2017 who will 'miss out'.

(My own XH is an abusive twat also, but an abusive twat who does know his political stuff Wink hence why I mentioned it. I hope that this reassures you. Flowers)

Saltedpeanuts · 09/05/2015 11:50

Conservative supporters believe what it's convenient for them to believe. That people who "whinge" about being poor are exaggerating and with a little bit of financial nouse would be able to live very comfortably. That people who don't have a job are to blame because they are too lazy to find one. And so on. They only read the Tory press, because it tells them what they want to hear. They don't look too deep, because they'd rather not see something that shows the reality of life under the Tories for so many people. That way they can continue to benefit from the Tories' reward the rich policies without feeling bad about themselves.
They are to blame for this hellish government being re-elected, and I hope that they get a taste of their own medicine one day.

UnoPan · 09/05/2015 11:51

With the OP.

Tories spent 13 years gagging to get in and do some social re-engineering i.e. make us a low wage economy for the benefit of their financial backers. Now they have a majority the cuts to the 'working poor' (And there are millions of them) and those unable to work will be shattering.

Viviennemary · 09/05/2015 11:52

There have always been sanctions for not complying with DWP rules. Only they were more rarely applied and people given chance after chance. And food banks existed under Labour too. And people dying on hospital trolleys under Labour. The NHS was a shambles under them. IMHO.

JockTamsonsBairns · 09/05/2015 11:54

Shadows thank you for posting - it sent shivers down my spine to read, but I hope it gives some an insight of what the reality of the cuts mean to actual real people.
I really hope things end up ok for you.

UnoPan · 09/05/2015 11:55

There are no approx 600,000 foodbanks. In 2010 they weren't really part of the national consciousness i.e not many people knew about them, never mind actually use them.

The biting has already started - You may have noticed the plan announced on Thursday to reduce the 'help-into-work' scheme for people who are disabled. Just a bit of a taster for things to come.

Marmiteandjamislush · 09/05/2015 11:58

YABU Nobody, if they we honest, votes altruistically. However rich or whatever, you are, you have your own interests and concerns. People who ignore this are vomit inducing piss artist IMHO. All voters are selfish, even Labour ones. I would say the least selfish are Green party voters.

UnoPan · 09/05/2015 12:00

600,000 food banks? Are you sure about that Pan

Hope! Sorry about that. In 2010 there were 61,000 'uses' of FBs. IN 2013-14 there were 900,000 uses. (according to the Trussel Trust figues)

And we say the Tories are 'competent with the economy'? Yes competent at promoting a vested interest.